Disco Elysium

Disco Elysium

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Arthur Mar 17, 2023 @ 10:00pm
2
This is so sad
One of the greatest games of all time is being destroyed before my very eyes by a greedy company. It's almost comical how Disco Elysium is turning into the thing it openly criticizes so much. I know I'm gonna sound like a broken record saying this, but capitalism destroys art. I hate this. I wish I could refund the game (even though I love it). I sincerely hope the vultures at ZA/UM go F themselves. Rip Disco Elysium, I'm glad we still have piracy whenever we feel like experiencing the original game.
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Showing 1-15 of 15 comments
Ryou Mar 17, 2023 @ 10:35pm 
Capitalism is just a glorified slavery.
Rakiin Mar 18, 2023 @ 1:20am 
What happened, saw it on sale and I don't see any DLC are there micro transactions or something?
Volpin Mar 18, 2023 @ 7:47am 
2
4
2
Originally posted by Rakiin:
What happened, saw it on sale and I don't see any DLC are there micro transactions or something?

https://www.reddit.com/r/DiscoElysium/comments/11tvv9f/whats_the_big_deal_its_just_a_photo_mode_a_short/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

I saw a decent amount of comments on my last post about how the fans are overreacting when it comes to this photo mode, and I believe that this stems from a general confusion of why we're so against ZAUM, so I wanted to once and for all type up exactly what's been happening, from the beginning, especially given recent developments. Because I believe that ZAUM has worked to make this intentionally muddled when it's honestly as clear cut as can be. Keep in mind that I am more than a little biased and please tell me if I get anything wrong or leave out important details so I can correct them.

It started in October of 2022 when Martin Luiga made a medium post saying the ZAUM cultural association had dissolved. This association is where the ZAUM company was born from, and in that article he makes it clear that neither he, Robert Kurvitz (Lead Writer), Aleksander Rostov (Lead Artist), and Helen Hindpere (writer) are working at ZAUM, and implies they left unwillingly. The next day the claim that they no longer work there is followed up with confirmation by Rostov. As of that point in the timeline this was the only statement ZAUM had made on the matter. People weren't happy.

Rostov makes his own comprehensive statement on Medium, giving everyone more detail on the situation. The current majority shareholder and investors of ZAUM fired them unfairly. They believe that they were being intentionally shut out once their old majority shareholder was bought out, as they had begun to get excluded from daily company operations. What's important is Rostov and Kurvitz believe that the two new majority shareholders in ZAUM, Ilmar Kompus and Tõnis Haavel, had obtained their majority share illegally. They did this by buying a majority stake with ZAUM’s own funds, which surprise surprise, is illegal. Kurvitz and Rostov claimed they were fired after asking for financial documents.

In response, ZAUM claimed that actually Kurvitz and Rostov and Hindpere were all fired for misconduct. Specifically, they were fired for:

● Limited to no engagement in their responsibilities and work – including not working at all for almost two years while still being paid by the studio – and forcing colleagues to compensate for their lack of effort.

● Creating a toxic work environment that is antithetical to the ZA/UM culture and team productivity.

● Misconduct in interacting with other colleagues that includes verbal abuse and gender discrimination.

● Attempts to illegally sell to other gaming companies ZA/UM’s intellectual property with the aim of undermining the rest of the team.

Obviously they deny all of these claims, but you should read the whole article on this one, it's so clear that they're lying it's almost funny. Rostov and Kurvitz made it clear they are intending to pursue legal action for both the fraud and the unfair termination.

This is where things get confusing and most fans fall off, I believe this is a result of Kurvitz and Rostov’s general lack of communication with the public due to ongoing litigation combined with ZAUM’s lame attempts to spin the story in their direction.

Karl Kender, who also left ZAUM in August, had filed a suit against Kompus specifically, stating that he believed they cheated him out of millions. This was quickly withdrawn, however with the withdrawn lawsuit, Kompus and Haavel quietly repaid 5.1 million dollars to ZAUM (not admitting that they stole it). This left us all confused as we didn’t know exactly what was happening in regards to Kurvitz’s suit. All we knew was that it was still ongoing.

We get no word until this Tuesday, March 14. ZAUM out of the blue claims that everything is now resolved. They said that the unfair termination claims by Kurvitz and Rostov were dropped due to lack of evidence, that Kompus had paid the money back in full, and Kender had paid Kompus for all legal fees for his withdrawn suit back in December, resolving the situation once and for all.

It’s important here to talk about the news cycle. It’s generally important to a company that searching their name on google doesn't bring up hundreds of articles about how fraudulent they are, so for a few days, searches of their name were good for the first time. “Disco Elysium suit resolved, situation over”

This lasted all of two days, because yesterday on March 16th, Kurvitz and Rostov responded to that claim, saying that no they had not withdrawn the claims at all, and returning stolen money doesn’t fix anything since Kompus

Still committed the damn crime

Still has majority stake in the company

This, is when collage mode drops. On the exact same day Kurvitz and Rostov respond. Almost as if to lead away a google search for something like “Disco Elysium news” or “Disco Elysium update.” To be literally anything but the fact that they just unabashedly mislead the public. In all likelihood they've been sitting on this feature until right after an intentionally misleading statement about the litigation against them, whether they did it in direct response to Kurvitz and Rostov's reply I can't say. I think the feature is a gross misunderstanding of what DE is about and its general philosophy, but this aspect is what enrages me. It's not "just a photo mode" it's a lame diversion tactic, and what saddens me is that it seems to be working. So please, don't let it.

This ended up being way longer than I thought (so much for short recap), but I might as well close things off with talking about why Kurvitz can’t walk away. People were obsessed with DE for its amazing writing, so why can’t Kurvitz just make Pissco Pelysium 2 and keep going. Because he doesn’t want to write anything but stories in the world he has been crafting for 30 years. Elysium. I can’t explain just how much it means to him better than he can, so I urge you to please read this statement he made to celebrate the final cut release of the game, before it was taken from him.

This story is only going to get more muddled, so please keep following it. I urge all of you to read every article I linked in full, it's a sad story. But they're still fighting, and I believe they'll come out on top in the end. All we can do for now is wait, but let's not forget why we're angry in the meantime.
Last edited by Volpin; Mar 18, 2023 @ 7:48am
Arthur Mar 18, 2023 @ 8:02am 
/\ This summed up things perfectly
vulgo xande Mar 18, 2023 @ 8:23am 
can you guys do a tldr cuz english aint my first language and i just bought the game
Arthur Mar 18, 2023 @ 8:31am 
Originally posted by vulgo xande:
can you guys do a tldr cuz english aint my first language and i just bought the game
Opa, e aí cara. Posso sim, também sou BR. Acabei de explicar resumidamente a história pra uns amigos no zap, se liga: https://imgur.com/a/VvaTMl3

Os links que mandei na conversa também, se quiser dar uma olhada:
https://twitter.com/discoelysium/status/1636383558779682819
https://www.pcgamer.com/dollar48-million-paid-to-zaum-and-one-lawsuit-dropped-as-the-battle-over-disco-elysium-continues/

E no áudio do final eu basicamente só falei que o CEO fez coisas ilegais pra tomar as ações da empresa (resumindo, ele comprou as ações usando os fundos da própria empresa, o que obviamente é crime), e depois de conseguir tomar as ações, ele chutou os desenvolvedores pra fora da ZA/UM.
Last edited by Arthur; Mar 18, 2023 @ 8:33am
Arthur Mar 18, 2023 @ 8:35am 
Outra informação que o cara disse ali no comentário grandão é que esse anúncio do modo colagem também tá com cara de cortina de fumaça, pra ofuscar qualquer notícia relacionada a Disco Elysium, porque eles anunciaram um dia depois de os caras da empresa responderem a uma das acusações de dinheiro roubado. Enfim, longa história, mas te contei o principal.
vulgo xande Mar 18, 2023 @ 5:18pm 
Originally posted by Arthur:
Outra informação que o cara disse ali no comentário grandão é que esse anúncio do modo colagem também tá com cara de cortina de fumaça, pra ofuscar qualquer notícia relacionada a Disco Elysium, porque eles anunciaram um dia depois de os caras da empresa responderem a uma das acusações de dinheiro roubado. Enfim, longa história, mas te contei o principal.
krl mano q parada bizarra, genuinamente nao sei mais se eu fico com o jogo comprado ou se eu tento jogar por outros meios, to real na duvida pq eu pensei q eu ia ta ajudando uma desenvolvedora indie mas agr vi q o estudio tem um CEO fdp q fode com os funcionarios mn kkkkkkkkkkkkk n sei mais oq faço agr
Arthur Mar 18, 2023 @ 6:22pm 
Originally posted by vulgo xande:
Originally posted by Arthur:
Outra informação que o cara disse ali no comentário grandão é que esse anúncio do modo colagem também tá com cara de cortina de fumaça, pra ofuscar qualquer notícia relacionada a Disco Elysium, porque eles anunciaram um dia depois de os caras da empresa responderem a uma das acusações de dinheiro roubado. Enfim, longa história, mas te contei o principal.
krl mano q parada bizarra, genuinamente nao sei mais se eu fico com o jogo comprado ou se eu tento jogar por outros meios, to real na duvida pq eu pensei q eu ia ta ajudando uma desenvolvedora indie mas agr vi q o estudio tem um CEO fdp q fode com os funcionarios mn kkkkkkkkkkkkk n sei mais oq faço agr
Sei lá, vai do seu senso moral. Eu já comprei tem uns 2 anos, então não tem mais o que fazer ahuahuauha, mas de qualquer forma os devs ainda tão tentando vencer essa batalha legal pra tomar de volta o IP. Agora é só torcer pra eles conseguirem mesmo.
dot Mar 18, 2023 @ 11:15pm 
Originally posted by Arthur:
I know I'm gonna sound like a broken record saying this, but capitalism destroys art.
Originally posted by Dark Slayer:
Capitalism is just a glorified slavery.

What is even your definition of capitalism?
Yer Mom Mar 19, 2023 @ 8:09pm 
Well. I was going to buy this game tonight. I was sold. I'm not anymore. I'll buy 10 copies of it when I know it's back in the proper hands. As an aspiring indie dev myself, this sounds like a nightmare. If I devoted the next decade of my life to a universe and someone stole it from me, I'd probably not be a free man anymore, so kudos to that.

Someone let me know when this is resolved and I'll enjoy the title finally. :(
Stiven Mar 20, 2023 @ 2:23am 
Originally posted by Volpin:
Originally posted by Rakiin:
What happened, saw it on sale and I don't see any DLC are there micro transactions or something?
● Misconduct in interacting with other colleagues that includes verbal abuse and gender discrimination.
LOL. They don't even trying. It like one of the card from the pack of "101 Generic ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ excuses to mud the waters".
Dantastic Mar 20, 2023 @ 6:47pm 
Originally posted by Volpin:
Originally posted by Rakiin:
What happened, saw it on sale and I don't see any DLC are there micro transactions or something?

https://www.reddit.com/r/DiscoElysium/comments/11tvv9f/whats_the_big_deal_its_just_a_photo_mode_a_short/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

I saw a decent amount of comments on my last post about how the fans are overreacting when it comes to this photo mode, and I believe that this stems from a general confusion of why we're so against ZAUM, so I wanted to once and for all type up exactly what's been happening, from the beginning, especially given recent developments. Because I believe that ZAUM has worked to make this intentionally muddled when it's honestly as clear cut as can be. Keep in mind that I am more than a little biased and please tell me if I get anything wrong or leave out important details so I can correct them.

It started in October of 2022 when Martin Luiga made a medium post saying the ZAUM cultural association had dissolved. This association is where the ZAUM company was born from, and in that article he makes it clear that neither he, Robert Kurvitz (Lead Writer), Aleksander Rostov (Lead Artist), and Helen Hindpere (writer) are working at ZAUM, and implies they left unwillingly. The next day the claim that they no longer work there is followed up with confirmation by Rostov. As of that point in the timeline this was the only statement ZAUM had made on the matter. People weren't happy.

Rostov makes his own comprehensive statement on Medium, giving everyone more detail on the situation. The current majority shareholder and investors of ZAUM fired them unfairly. They believe that they were being intentionally shut out once their old majority shareholder was bought out, as they had begun to get excluded from daily company operations. What's important is Rostov and Kurvitz believe that the two new majority shareholders in ZAUM, Ilmar Kompus and Tõnis Haavel, had obtained their majority share illegally. They did this by buying a majority stake with ZAUM’s own funds, which surprise surprise, is illegal. Kurvitz and Rostov claimed they were fired after asking for financial documents.

In response, ZAUM claimed that actually Kurvitz and Rostov and Hindpere were all fired for misconduct. Specifically, they were fired for:

● Limited to no engagement in their responsibilities and work – including not working at all for almost two years while still being paid by the studio – and forcing colleagues to compensate for their lack of effort.

● Creating a toxic work environment that is antithetical to the ZA/UM culture and team productivity.

● Misconduct in interacting with other colleagues that includes verbal abuse and gender discrimination.

● Attempts to illegally sell to other gaming companies ZA/UM’s intellectual property with the aim of undermining the rest of the team.

Obviously they deny all of these claims, but you should read the whole article on this one, it's so clear that they're lying it's almost funny. Rostov and Kurvitz made it clear they are intending to pursue legal action for both the fraud and the unfair termination.

This is where things get confusing and most fans fall off, I believe this is a result of Kurvitz and Rostov’s general lack of communication with the public due to ongoing litigation combined with ZAUM’s lame attempts to spin the story in their direction.

Karl Kender, who also left ZAUM in August, had filed a suit against Kompus specifically, stating that he believed they cheated him out of millions. This was quickly withdrawn, however with the withdrawn lawsuit, Kompus and Haavel quietly repaid 5.1 million dollars to ZAUM (not admitting that they stole it). This left us all confused as we didn’t know exactly what was happening in regards to Kurvitz’s suit. All we knew was that it was still ongoing.

We get no word until this Tuesday, March 14. ZAUM out of the blue claims that everything is now resolved. They said that the unfair termination claims by Kurvitz and Rostov were dropped due to lack of evidence, that Kompus had paid the money back in full, and Kender had paid Kompus for all legal fees for his withdrawn suit back in December, resolving the situation once and for all.

It’s important here to talk about the news cycle. It’s generally important to a company that searching their name on google doesn't bring up hundreds of articles about how fraudulent they are, so for a few days, searches of their name were good for the first time. “Disco Elysium suit resolved, situation over”

This lasted all of two days, because yesterday on March 16th, Kurvitz and Rostov responded to that claim, saying that no they had not withdrawn the claims at all, and returning stolen money doesn’t fix anything since Kompus

Still committed the damn crime

Still has majority stake in the company

This, is when collage mode drops. On the exact same day Kurvitz and Rostov respond. Almost as if to lead away a google search for something like “Disco Elysium news” or “Disco Elysium update.” To be literally anything but the fact that they just unabashedly mislead the public. In all likelihood they've been sitting on this feature until right after an intentionally misleading statement about the litigation against them, whether they did it in direct response to Kurvitz and Rostov's reply I can't say. I think the feature is a gross misunderstanding of what DE is about and its general philosophy, but this aspect is what enrages me. It's not "just a photo mode" it's a lame diversion tactic, and what saddens me is that it seems to be working. So please, don't let it.

This ended up being way longer than I thought (so much for short recap), but I might as well close things off with talking about why Kurvitz can’t walk away. People were obsessed with DE for its amazing writing, so why can’t Kurvitz just make Pissco Pelysium 2 and keep going. Because he doesn’t want to write anything but stories in the world he has been crafting for 30 years. Elysium. I can’t explain just how much it means to him better than he can, so I urge you to please read this statement he made to celebrate the final cut release of the game, before it was taken from him.

This story is only going to get more muddled, so please keep following it. I urge all of you to read every article I linked in full, it's a sad story. But they're still fighting, and I believe they'll come out on top in the end. All we can do for now is wait, but let's not forget why we're angry in the meantime.

I'm grateful for the detailed description of current events. The more attention this information gets the better.

In defense of the creators for not communicating with the public about an ongoing lawsuit, it might be against their interest to comment on an ongoing lawsuit (other than perhaps through a lawyer)

ZAUM needs to admit to wrongdoing before they get any more money from me for anything.
EUIX Mar 23, 2023 @ 8:06am 
Unforunately this is a fairly common story - an artist expends his/her own blood and toil for years in obscurity, eventually meets commercial success and financial stability - thereby introducing business interests, in the process said business interests no longer find the eccentricity or egoism of the artist useful and remove him or her form the equation. Ironically those are the exact traits that sustain them for all those years but now that there is a commercial entity, business interests and stock holders, HR and all the other banalities of ordinary life that the artist probably abhors they are no longer useful and are cast outside.
_oBSOLEte_ Mar 23, 2023 @ 10:05am 
It's not an artist vs businessman story or some other ideology bullcrap.

It's an already known fraud, Kompus, and his associates already involved in other frauds, stealing shares of a company.

This is not a game anymore, it's just a scam and people who bought the game just fell for it.
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Date Posted: Mar 17, 2023 @ 10:00pm
Posts: 15