On censorship...

[NandV;E]

The only reason why I feel the need to say anything on this is because of how much of immersion breaker and even character development break that the censorship of this certain "F" word creates.

The dialogue reactions were reasonable and even from an offended stand point. However, feeling offended is subjective.

To have this occur early on in the game is disappointing. This is because everything afterwards respects the player and gives the player the option to play according to their subjective needs.

In fact the reason why I love this game so far is because you have handed me the responsibility of carving my own experience. I can see my own personal thoughts and ideas about events being framed in the dialogue. I can play out and challenge views I agree with or disagree with.

Whatever the choice is, it is mine. No other game has created that experience for me quite as deep.

Still much love and thank you for your work.

[McPhail]

just happened here, i came to figure out how to deactivate the profanity filter. there should be one that you can turn off. else you shouldnt use the word or make up characters that would use it. thats the price of censorship.

[One Arm Biker Yang]

We get it, you wanna call us slurs, cry more.

[Halko]

Persecution syndrome much? A character referencing or calling another character something in a fictional medium has nothing to do with reality. Its not the content itself that is a problem but rather the context it is shown in. I doubt anyone in this thread has actually gotten to the core of the situation this shows up in the game to see exactly where all this is coming from so there is no context to the use of the word. Decrying a any media because of naughty words leads down the same trail as banning to kill a mockingbird because it uses racial slurs in it. Everyone misses the entire point.

Its a knee jerk WORD BAD emotional response. Explore the scene fully and youll see there is far more to it than what is shown at first glance.

In the end all censorship is wrong. Expression of thoughts and ideas is one of the most important rights a person has and limiting that because FEELINGS is a mistake.

[iCanTucan]

I don't get it.
If the word is too offensive - don't include it (whatever is the measurement of how offensive words are)
If the word is not offensive enough to remove it, why censor it?
If you're writing f****t instead of the actual word, it doesn't fool anyone. You could, with the same result, write f@gg0t. In both situations, readers knew exactly what you meant.

I understand artistic choices (i.e. previously mentioned Fallen London games). I even understand self-censorship - like Subnautica devs not including guns, games where you can kill NPCs not including children, etc. But I don't understand half-ass censorship.

[Eskaton93]

It seems a little stupid to me - why put the word in, then censor it in a way where its still obvious what the word is? Makes it look like an afterthought. The static noise they use to "bleep" is also very jarring and sounds bad.

[Black Hammer]

Socio-political morals are no better than religious ones.

[bad at games]

The static noise they use to bleep it is *deliberately* jarring and *deliberately* sounds bad.

They're supposed to be incredibly obnoxious kids who are being complete ♥♥♥♥♥ towards you while you have a hangover.

If you're not annoyed by them then they're not doing their job.

[NandV;E]

TL;DR: All subjective, no biggie and well it's just entertainment. And I am still enjoying the game

---------

I'm not trying to view this as in support or against the word itself. To me that is irrelevant, as it could have been any word.

In fact racism is handled with different words but in respect to the lore and the world they created. The same could have happened with this word in particular -- just replace it with something relevant to the game.

The points made about it be jarring and out of tone with the rest of the game is what broke that immersion I had and this is why I considered the immersion important...

When you start the game, you start as a tabula rasa so to speak. Your actions and your experience craft the person you become and future interactions.

For the first time in a long time we have a game that begins as such but creates an immersion like no other and that is thanks to the "Thought Cabinet". I love this mechanic!

Personally, it is not a big issue again it was just "jarring".

No doubt you may take what you want from all this. I see this product as entertainment, that is all. I want escapism not hand holding. I'll put this product down as an experience and that is all. I do not need to be represented, I do not need a glass ceiling to be broken. I am defined by my actions not by my representation, and I would not judge you any different.

[Blowfeld]

Oh boy, here we go again....

[Clarity]

atleast make it free dlc to remove the censored words.

[Hekatonkheires]

I really don't know why they are censoring this specific word when nothing else is censored. Five hours in and it is my only complaint (besides typos) with the writing.

[Dan]

It does seem somewhat odd in a game that is otherwise pretty uncompromising, but I suppose it potentially crosses over into the realms of deeply-discriminatory/hate-speech, even if it's considered in context... in the same way that I imagine they would star out the n***** word if it came up. Not starring it out could potentially invite serious legal repercussions in many countries. Government agencies are notoriously lacking in sense of humour or consideration of context in cases like this.

[Metz]

Originally posted by Grimdanfango:

It does seem somewhat odd in a game that is otherwise pretty uncompromising, but I suppose it potentially crosses over into the realms of deeply-discriminatory/hate-speech, even if it's considered in context... in the same way that I imagine they would star out the n***** word if it came up. Not starring it out could potentially invite serious legal repercussions in many countries.

^ This. As a gay guy, part of me appreciates the bleeping out of the word -- I hear it enough and frankly am tired of listening to it by crymore straight guys who think more about gay sex than I probably do (not to say all of those against this censorship are.. but there's definitely a few out there -- it's Steam after all).. but as a writer, I'm confused by the inconsistent enforcement of censorship, especially since the game goes into such depth and its commentary on sociopolitical ideology, race, etc.

But here's what I've noticed: Even though there's racism present, a lot of it is against fictional racism; the term "kipt" seems to be a derogatory reference to a lot of the darker-skinned people present in the game; "mesquito" is also another one. However, as far as the game goes, they never used the n-word.. STILL, when using homosexual slurs, "fägäri" is also used, but not censored. It's a nonsense word for us in the real-world, but it's still a slur in this fictional one. The main difference then with bleeping out f***** is because that is a real-world slur which, as Grim mentioned, could open the developer up to certain legal repercussions depending on local laws. Moreover, it's an interesting creative choice because it still lets the developers comment on these things and push the limit on them by being so overt, yet they, themselves, won't cross that line. That being said, it boils down to the game and its meta. You want immersion, be happy you get "fägäri." But given ALL of the things happening in the game, it's weird to be so transfixed on this once instance and argue "MUH IMMERSION."

Still, I appreciate this discussion, whether for or against. This gives me some ideas for a few things I wanted to write about with regards to the game so.. this has been enlightening. :D

[Stinkflipper Incarnate]

Personally I'm not arguing for that particular word's inclusion in the game, but it did feel very odd and out of place with those bleeps. Seems to me they should have just used some other word instead.

[Metz]

Originally posted by Stinkflipper Incarnate:

Personally I'm not arguing for that particular word's inclusion in the game, but it did feel very odd and out of place with those bleeps. Seems to me they should have just used some other word instead.

Building on that.. same: if they already have "fägäri" why not just use that? THAT is what's puzzling.