A whole city block? Really?

[GlassDeviant]

Is there really $45 (CDN, I can't see US prices) of value in a game that is supposedly open world but is contained entirely in one city block? Steam tells me this game is similar to Eschalon, but Eschalon has a huge game map, a whole world to explore. There are a lot of detective games around, but none of them have such a tiny map. I am also concerned by the video which shows a painfully slow walking speed. I don't like games claiming to have many hours of gameplay, when those many hours only exist because the movement speed is so slow compared to other games that use the same isomorphic perspective.

[Me]

You can run by double-clicking like in most of these types of games. It's still not super-fast, but at least it gets you around.

[Sisyphus]

It isn't contained in one city block, there are more areas that open up later.

You can run in the game.

The world isn't that big but the content density is immense. It's taken me nearly 10 hours to negotiate the first 2 days (not even quite finished with them yet).

It's probably a minimum of 30 hours, realistically 40-60, and it's replayable.

The content and value are the least of your worries with this game.

[[Heretic]Rivga]

From these threads you can see how games like AC Odyssey are made, "Lets through in a ton of empty space without any content, otherwise we'll have people whinning in the forums."

The game is dense, as with a real imvestigation you need to go back to certain NPCs to cross reference stories etc. So unlike a lot of games needs to be a little more compact.

[GlassDeviant]

Thanks, that's what I needed to know.

Originally posted by Sisyphus:

and it's replayable.

By replayable I am guessing you mean that there are multiple distinct paths though the game, making each play through very different, possibly with different endings.

[Me]

Originally posted by Indifferent Orangutan:

Thanks, that's what I needed to know.

Originally posted by Sisyphus:

and it's replayable.

By replayable I am guessing you mean that there are multiple distinct paths though the game, making each play through very different, possibly with different endings.

Since I haven't finished the game, take my words witha grain of salt. But a lot of it ties into what kind of a character you play. I started out with a frail but intelligent character, died rather quickly (on account of me being frail), then made a dumb, violent brute. And the dialog options, as well as the conclusions you reach about what is going on around you based on your skills, has been completely different for these two characters. But the people you meet, and the "quests" you have to solve has been the same of course, it's just how you interact with the world varies greatly depending on your skills.

[AdahnGorion]

Maybe this game is not for you. Its niche and most of us who bought it love it to death.. But if you like Battle Royale, FPS, Survival and think this is an open world action RPG, then you are knocking on the wrong door.

[Satoru]

Note you can have a lot to do in a small amount of space

You can also have literally nothing to do in 'open' worlds

THe game provides a density of interactions in a small space. You don't need an 'open world' to do that

[RodHull]

Originally posted by Me:

But the people you meet, and the "quests" you have to solve has been the same of course, it's just how you interact with the world varies greatly depending on your skills.

The quests are not all the same, for example the quests your own psyche gives you will vary depending on your character. So my character having ended up through coincidence and happenstance with a really high electrochemistry skill is utterly obsessed with seeking out drugs and his other high skill half light has ended up with lots of weird impulsive quests being given to me that i dont think a more sensible or thoughtful character would get.

Originally posted by Satoru:

You can also have literally nothing to do in 'open' worlds

People forget this, game industry has successfully sold us the lie that more content is always good, even if its all copy pasted busywork.

I mean even a game like skyrim (which im not a fan of) for all its size there has been more interesting ideas and interactions in a book shop, a back yard and a hostel for 5 hours of gameplay than the entirety of skyrim

[GlassDeviant]

Originally posted by Darkie:

Maybe this game is not for you. Its niche and most of us who bought it love it to death.. But if you like Battle Royale, FPS, Survival and think this is an open world action RPG, then you are knocking on the wrong door.

You're making unfounded assumptions. I could do the same and claim you're being a typical knee jerk reactionary fanboi.

I'm just trying to establish the nature of the game, and it's starting to get interesting because you don't see games with deep dialogue paths and meaningful choices like I am reading about from some of the posts in this thread very often anymore.

Originally posted by Satoru:

THe game provides a density of interactions in a small space. You don't need an 'open world' to do that

Yes, but it is claimed to be open world on the store page. A game doesn't need to be open world to provide a density of interactions. It does need to be open world to be open world. I shouldn't even need to make such a redundant statement.

[RodHull]

Originally posted by Indifferent Orangutan:

Yes, but it is claimed to be open world on the store page. A game doesn't need to be open world to provide a density of interactions. It does need to be open world to be open world. I shouldn't even need to make such a redundant statement.

Define open world?

There is a world (an environment you play the game in) and its mostly open to you to go anywhere within that.

Now if you mean its not an actual world, well no game ever has been so not sure what the issue is?

[Raigavin]

Originally posted by Indifferent Orangutan:

You're making unfounded assumptions. I could do the same and claim you're being a typical knee jerk reactionary fanboi.

I'm just trying to establish the nature of the game, and it's starting to get interesting because you don't see games with deep dialogue paths and meaningful choices like I am reading about from some of the posts in this thread very often anymore.

Yes, but it is claimed to be open world on the store page. A game doesn't need to be open world to provide a density of interactions. It does need to be open world to be open world. I shouldn't even need to make such a redundant statement.

Wow that escalated quickly, I hope you seriously have the patience to play the game :)

[Nailfoot]

Originally posted by RodHull:

...

Now if you mean its not an actual world, well no game ever has been...

A few have come pretty close. Daggerfall was the entire known world.

However, I agree. "Openworld" does not, by itself, mean that a game has to include a huge landmass. A game can be "openworld" and be entirely contained in one small area.

[GlassDeviant]

Originally posted by RodHull:

Originally posted by Me:

But the people you meet, and the "quests" you have to solve has been the same of course, it's just how you interact with the world varies greatly depending on your skills.

The quests are not all the same, for example the quests your own psyche gives you will vary depending on your character. So my character having ended up through coincidence and happenstance with a really high electrochemistry skill is utterly obsessed with seeking out drugs and his other high skill half light has ended up with lots of weird impulsive quests being given to me that i dont think a more sensible or thoughtful character would get.

That's the sort of thing that piques my interest. The old Fallout games, I and II, had this (good) but had a terrible combat interface even given the state of gaming technology at the time (bad) which made them impossible for me to get into. I need a variety of things to do, combat can be one of them (though not necessarily as I have enjoyed many games that didn't have it) and if it's a part of a game I expect it to be up to par with the other facets of said game. I come from a tabletop role-playing background and if the game is at all like what you and some others are saying I will probably enjoy it.

Originally posted by RodHull:

Originally posted by Satoru:

You can also have literally nothing to do in 'open' worlds

People forget this, game industry has successfully sold us the lie that more content is always good, even if its all copy pasted busywork.

I mean even a game like skyrim (which im not a fan of) for all its size there has been more interesting ideas and interactions in a book shop, a back yard and a hostel for 5 hours of gameplay than the entirety of skyrim

While I get where you are coming from, I think you are giving Skyrim short shrift. It has a lot of flaws, but there is a lot more density of content that something like GTA 5 or PUBG. TES games have generally gone downhill from Morrowind to Oblivion to Skyrim, but there is still value in them if you grabbed them at a deep discount, plus having over 50,000 mods to add to Skyrim gives you a lot of flexibility to add to whatever your preference of gaming flavour, even if you have to dig through a lot of crap to find the small minority of truly great mods. I've been generally steering away from AAA titles but I am always looking for something new to enjoy, and though it's more unlikely every day for AAA publishers to put out something I can enjoy that doesn't prevent me from looking at them.

That said, most of my recent purchases have been from indies and small to medium studios.

[GlassDeviant]

Originally posted by Raigavin:

Wow that escalated quickly, I hope you seriously have the patience to play the game :)

You call that escalation? That's hilarious. I don't suffer fools gladly, but that is far from escalation. It was a valid response to his entirely unfounded and rude assumptions. I could have flipped out and been obscene, but I did not. I simply pointed out that if I were to make unfounded assumptions of the sort that he did, then I could accuse him of the things I wrote.

[RodHull]

Originally posted by Indifferent Orangutan:

TES games have generally gone downhill from Morrowind to Oblivion to Skyrim, but there is still value in them

Agree to disagree I find them to be among the worst modern rpg's ever made