Why are guns so useless against other people?

[No Guts No Glory]

It seems... counter intuitive to me. It doesnt matter if its NPC or PC, they both tank ungodly amounts of gunfire before dying.

So any attempt at PvP usually revolves around syringe guns and perhaps harpoons because you have no chance to kill the other guy with gun unless he is stark naked, which people never are.

[Wasp]

Most likely for the medical system.

No point in making an entire medical system just for someone to die instantly within a single shot

[Buggy Boy]

Time to put a nuke in a detonator.

[MagikarpMagi]

https://barotraumagame.com/wiki/Human

There are different damage modifiers for different limbs, so head shots do better burst damage and torso shots do better bleed, but I think the problem is that arms and legs probably catch a lot of bullets/absorb a lot of hits in most fights. The character models are so lanky lol

But yeah, armor really makes the difference.

[No Guts No Glory]

Originally posted by CritMasterFlex:

https://barotraumagame.com/wiki/Human

There are different damage modifiers for different limbs, so head shots do better burst damage and torso shots do better bleed, but I think the problem is that arms and legs probably catch a lot of bullets/absorb a lot of hits in most fights. The character models are so lanky lol

But yeah, armor really makes the difference.

Armour makes waaaay too much difference imho. For real, you can empty two mags from SMG into someone wearing either armour or diving suit. PvP might aswell not exist in this game due to this. How is for example security supposed to kill someone using its tools, the guns, when syringe guns are apparently only thing that works at range?

[The Flaming Pike]

Hi! I suggest using shotguns against humans and SMG against creatures. The shotgun inflicts considerable damage per shot even when your aim is so-so, plus it has a great knockback effect on your victims, allowing you to assess the combat situation for a fraction of a second. I prefer the SMG against moving targets, especially when swimming, like in nests where you can get attacked on all sides and single shots have a risk of being missed.

The SMG will have a slight knockback on targets, but it's negligible, so they can still run up to you and attack you with melee.

As stated, headshots inflict more damage than limb shots.

It's true that the whole PVP aspect has been nerfed a few updates ago. Stun batons for example used to stun immediately with the first strike. Now it takes a few and a little bit of patience until the target falls unconcious.

However if you look at the game's trello, you will notice there's a heavy difficulty mode that's in the long term plans ( https://trello.com/b/hBXI8ltN/barotrauma-roadmap-known-issues ). I would believe this mode will be brought in near the latest stage of Barotrauma's development, once the dev team has a good grasp on what could make the game hardcore, and also once they have implemented all the features that could be modified with this mode.

[No Guts No Glory]

Originally posted by The Flaming Pike:

Hi! I suggest using shotguns against humans and SMG against creatures. The shotgun inflicts considerable damage per shot even when your aim is so-so, plus it has a great knockback effect on your victims, allowing you to assess the combat situation for a fraction of a second. :captainsinful: I prefer the SMG against moving targets, especially when swimming, like in nests where you can get attacked on all sides and single shots have a risk of being missed.

The SMG will have a slight knockback on targets, but it's negligible, so they can still run up to you and attack you with melee.

As stated, headshots inflict more damage than limb shots.

It's true that the whole PVP aspect has been nerfed a few updates ago. Stun batons for example used to stun immediately with the first strike. Now it takes a few and a little bit of patience until the target falls unconcious.

However if you look at the game's trello, you will notice there's a heavy difficulty mode that's in the long term plans ( https://trello.com/b/hBXI8ltN/barotrauma-roadmap-known-issues ). I would believe this mode will be brought in near the latest stage of Barotrauma's development, once the dev team has a good grasp on what could make the game hardcore, and also once they have implemented all the features that could be modified with this mode.

Not even headshot does enough damage to justify using firearm in a first place. And shotgun doesnt stunlock or kill fast either. If the traitor, clown or just idiot has syringe gun or something similar, you will die, Guns are practically useless on anything except few critters.

PvP wasnt "nerfed", PvP was destroyed and it resulted in people being able to grief even more.

[Cakner]

Guns aren't useless but people are tanky for sure. Stun Baton is by far one of the best PvP weapons. Once they are down either cuff them or put a Gas Mask (welding fuel) on them and let them choke. SMG has a mini stun with each shot and you can chain stun people well enough if you land all your shots. Shotgun has ease of use. Revolvers can be dual wielded for extra damage. Hand Cannon, Fissle Accelerator, Assault Rifle and Auto Shotty all slay who ever they are aimed at. Gotta aim for the head.

Originally posted by No Guts No Glory:

Not even headshot does enough damage to justify using firearm in a first place. And shotgun doesnt stunlock or kill fast either. If the traitor, clown or just idiot has syringe gun or something similar, you will die, Guns are practically useless on anything except few critters.

PvP wasnt "nerfed", PvP was destroyed and it resulted in people being able to grief even more.

How is it that the griefers are able to PvP but you can't? Guns do enough damage and you can stun lock players with SMG or 2xRevolvers. If they have armor on back up and let them bleed out after you empty your gun.

[No Guts No Glory]

Originally posted by Cakner:

Guns aren't useless but people are tanky for sure. Stun Baton is by far one of the best PvP weapons. Once they are down either cuff them or put a Gas Mask (welding fuel) on them and let them choke. SMG has a mini stun with each shot and you can chain stun people well enough if you land all your shots. Shotgun has ease of use. Revolvers can be dual wielded for extra damage. Hand Cannon, Fissle Accelerator, Assault Rifle and Auto Shotty all slay who ever they are aimed at. Gotta aim for the head.

Originally posted by No Guts No Glory:

Not even headshot does enough damage to justify using firearm in a first place. And shotgun doesnt stunlock or kill fast either. If the traitor, clown or just idiot has syringe gun or something similar, you will die, Guns are practically useless on anything except few critters.

PvP wasnt "nerfed", PvP was destroyed and it resulted in people being able to grief even more.

How is it that the griefers are able to PvP but you can't? Guns do enough damage and you can stun lock players with SMG or 2xRevolvers. If they have armor on back up and let them bleed out after you empty your gun.

The moment someone has Syringe Gun and lets say Diving Suit (not that hard to get lol) or any piece of armour, you might aswell throw away your SMG or Shotgun, or any other normal firearm. He *will* score that one hit he needs while you need to empty mag or two to kill them, provided you are willing to wait for bleed out or similar ♥♥♥♥ to happen. Instead of gun just outright flooring anyone you empty your mag into.

And yes, gas mask with fuel n similar stuff is viable. But its not the PvP "as intended", you are basically forced to grief the other griefer instead of using "intended" PvP tools as they simply dont work fast enough. Especially due to ridiculous dmg reductions outfits provide. People dont tend to go into PvP without protective stuff...

[Buggy Boy]

Unless it's been nerfed, a few harpoons can drop someone pretty quickly with the sudden massive bleed damage.

[No Guts No Glory]

Originally posted by Buggy Boy:

Unless it's been nerfed, a few harpoons can drop someone pretty quickly with the sudden massive bleed damage.

Yeah by guns i mean actual gunpowder using guns, not harpoon gun.

[Rotiart]

Depleted Fuel rounds have armor perf. Shame it's locked behind a talent, you'll never see them in PvP outside of Custom Subs

[Cakner]

Syringe gun doesnt one shot people. Even if they have a deadly poison in it, it still takes time to take affect. One shot of chloral hydrate doesnt knock anyone out either. Paralysis takes time too. stop exaggerating.

[Buggy Boy]

So, you want to play pvp but you feel that some weapons are superior to others... if it's really such a night and day situation then I see two choices - outright ban the use of certain weapons (make it a banable offence) in your server rules, or just use the superior weapon type. Body armour could go the same way - either make sure there's enough for everyone or remove it from the rounds and make it a banable offence to use.

Im sure as game development progresses that hand weapons effectiveness will change, I don't think the game is really geared towards PvP at the moment, more P v Monsters, so maybe in the future if we see more mission types involving Coalition vs Separatists the weapon damage vs humans might get a rebalance.

Also, harpoons are very effective from what I can see and are easy to manufacture, why the negativity towards them? Seems there's an unhealthy obsession with SMGs.

[No Guts No Glory]

Originally posted by Buggy Boy:

So, you want to play pvp but you feel that some weapons are superior to others... if it's really such a night and day situation then I see two choices - outright ban the use of certain weapons (make it a banable offence) in your server rules, or just use the superior weapon type. Body armour could go the same way - either make sure there's enough for everyone or remove it from the rounds and make it a banable offence to use.

Im sure as game development progresses that hand weapons effectiveness will change, I don't think the game is really geared towards PvP at the moment, more P v Monsters, so maybe in the future if we see more mission types involving Coalition vs Separatists the weapon damage vs humans might get a rebalance.

Also, harpoons are very effective from what I can see and are easy to manufacture, why the negativity towards them? Seems there's an unhealthy obsession with SMGs.

There is no negativity against harpoon, i love that weapon. But harpoon is not part of the topic here because i am talking strictly about actual guns, firearms, however you want to call them.

[EchoFort]

Originally posted by Engineer from TF2:

How am I gonna stop some big mean Mother Hubbard from tearing me a structurally superfluous new behind? The Answer? Use a gun, and if that don't work? Use more gun.

Jokes aside, if There was a megalomaniac German doctor that shoots "Medicine" from their syringe gun at you, well I guess that's one more reason to fear Doctors who know poison or medicine better than others. I mean, if you really are a Juggernaut that is being hunted down, then no hunter would hesitate or try to exploit your weaknesses.