Graveyard Keeper

Graveyard Keeper

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walrusgumbo Jun 7, 2018 @ 12:52pm
Must we use up energy to swing a sword?
As it currently stands: you use up 2 energy every time you swing a sword. There are plenty of dodgy enemies and things to bust up in the dungeon: could we maybe ditch that energy expenditure? I feel like it's enough of a hassle to be annoying, but not enough to really add to the experience, especially when you spend most of your energy slashing away at nothing. Could we ditch that for free sword swings?
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Showing 1-15 of 28 comments
Commander Corvus Jun 7, 2018 @ 12:54pm 
+1 Agree, I found this excessive. It already takes a crap load of energy to do everything else, chopping down trees, and preparing corpses etc. This was a massive let down to me that I need to be super conservative when fighting, where as in Stardew Valley (I didnt want to reference but it feels that it fits the best) You could blow energy and still have the ability to defend yourself and would just have to worry about your health.
Last edited by Commander Corvus; Jun 7, 2018 @ 12:55pm
Lin Din Jun 7, 2018 @ 12:55pm 
+1 on that. Freely swing without using energy would be great.
Skrymaster Jun 7, 2018 @ 2:01pm 
Feels kinda cheap though, I mean, if you're delving into a dungeon, you have to be prepared. By the point that you get to be able to delve you should have plenty of rations available. Many dark themed games have this realistic element to them. Take darkest dungeon for example. IF you ran out of food or are tired, nobody's gonna stop you from going back and trying again later. Monsters don't really do a great job at chasing you down, so the "defending myself" part falls kinda short. IF swinging sword cost nothing, you'd be chasing any sign of monsters early game in the swamp and whatnot for essentially free stuff like a lunatic. That doesn't fall in with the theme of the game.
xenxander Jun 7, 2018 @ 4:03pm 
Play stardew valley. It's not cheap. It makes things a lot better for everyone.
Skrymaster Jun 7, 2018 @ 6:06pm 
Originally posted by xenxander:
Play stardew valley. It's not cheap. It makes things a lot better for everyone.

I've played stardew valley enough to get all the achievements, I've played it vanilla and modded, I've got a decent couple 600ish hours in it. Stardew valley is a cutesy simplistic game at its core. This is supposed to be a more dark themed, half-serious , semi-realistic game.
Besides, the weapons in stardew valley were not balanced with regards to energy consumption because that was never a concern. If they were to take some energy on swing, the starting green slimes would have to be 2 shottable with the starting weapon at worst.

This is entirely opinionated, but I'd argue that a game without a challenge is just a mindless distraction. There are already people complaining about how the prayers are now "broken" and give no money, when in fact they've been fixed. Those people feel like they'd like the advantage of affording to buyout every store, but then at game release, if that was kept like that, everyone would get bored and stop playing it after 2 or 3 days because you reach endgame too fast.
It is a delicate balance to achieve when making games, between grind and content. Too much content means alot of costs on the development side. Too much grind and the playerbase diminishes, because people don't want to waste time doing the same thing over and over again (or do they? DO the players even know what they want?). After a game kicks off, modularity and moddability improve its "survivability", that is to say, the time it can stay relevant, considerably.

In my probably over 100 hours of gameplay so far, I've not felt it too impactful that weapon swings cost energy. Heck I don't even take my weapon with me most of the time, because I just run past bats and slimes in the wild, and that only early game, and maybe in town when smashing certain barrels for items, later on you probably won't even care about energy since you will have access to ample food supplies (provided wine gets nerfed because it totally should).


And here's another thing, if weapon swings would take no energy, traversing and clearing the dungeon could just be done in one whole seating, no matter how many levels, since you would not need to sleep, and it's likely all enemies will have a mechanic that allows you to not take damage if you play it well. For slimes, it's keeping a distance and striking after they bounce, for bats, its backing off when they prepare to charge, and triking afterwards, for iron maidens, you just walk behind them as they swing, and then hit them, etc. .

By comparison, stardew valley weapons don't take energy to swing because progressing in the mines/caverns ALREADY use up energy or resources, most of the time you need to dig quite a bit or use bombs to traverse. Here you just have to kill all the mobs, with an optional scavenge some wood and iron from chairs. Where would the balance be in no energy/swing here?

By the way, just saying, but it was possible to gather honey faster from beehives by swinging your sword at them prior to 0.675
Lin Din Jun 8, 2018 @ 12:52am 
Originally posted by Skrymaster:
The wall of text

I do see your point. After some practices and get use to, plus the right kind of foods. The energy using in dungeon from swinging sword is not a big problem anymore.
It make sense why Stardew valley work that way and GY keeper work this way. I did got used to rushing through the dungeon/mine from stardew valley. So the no energy swing would help run 5+ floor per day quicker. But in GY keeper. You don't need to rush 5+ floor like that. And it does make it different, unique, and fun in a way.

Maybe after more weapon and armor upgrade. The energy cost will be lower and even more easier to manage. That would be kool to fight bigger harder monsters and be able to gauge
your gears+tactics vs. monster dificulty though out the higher level dungeon.

Can not wait for try out more contents of the game!
Last edited by Lin Din; Jun 8, 2018 @ 12:52am
Skrymaster Jun 8, 2018 @ 2:24am 
Originally posted by Lin Din:
Originally posted by Skrymaster:
The wall of text

I do see your point. After some practices and get use to, plus the right kind of foods. The energy using in dungeon from swinging sword is not a big problem anymore.
It make sense why Stardew valley work that way and GY keeper work this way. I did got used to rushing through the dungeon/mine from stardew valley. So the no energy swing would help run 5+ floor per day quicker. But in GY keeper. You don't need to rush 5+ floor like that. And it does make it different, unique, and fun in a way.

Maybe after more weapon and armor upgrade. The energy cost will be lower and even more easier to manage. That would be kool to fight bigger harder monsters and be able to gauge
your gears+tactics vs. monster dificulty though out the higher level dungeon.

Can not wait for try out more contents of the game!

See? If you take some time to think about the repercussions of making swings free, you kinda understand that there still has to be a progression lock of sorts to prevent the player from breezing through the dungeon. Something like energy consumption is needed for balance purposes. Maybe currently it might not be the best idea though.

IF they really would change swings to be free, they would still have to implement something like blockages in the dungeon along the way, that are hard to clear and you need to shovel at them for quite a bit of energy loss ( cuz it makes no sense how your church basement has 4 sets of debris to clear, yet the dungeon is all intact and stuff). I'm not saying the blockages would require resources to fix, that could get tedious, but just energy bumpers of sorts.

This way pple would not be able to complain about sword swinging using the lame reasoning that "they can't defend themselves", but progress would still require energy.

Otherwise think stardew valley, but going through the mines all over again but with no naturally occuring rocks to block your way, only ore and the exit uncovered every floor. Where's the fun in that?
Nasabot Jun 8, 2018 @ 4:55am 
-1

At least there is something which makes food exclusivly useful.
Currently you would actually need no food at all, because you can sleep. But the dungeon forces the player to cook.
Arucard Jun 8, 2018 @ 5:35am 
Still haven't gone dungeoning, but would it make sense to have different energy costs based on weapons? Like using a knife would cost very little, but a broadsword much more, honestly I don't know what weapons are actually in-game at the moment so sorry if that sounds stupid.

Also, is there a way to build up the pc to have either more total energy, or become more efficient at work, thus using less over time? With the RPG style of unlocking abilities, it seems obvious for this to be possible.
Skrymaster Jun 8, 2018 @ 6:02am 
Originally posted by Arucard:
Also, is there a way to build up the pc to have either more total energy, or become more efficient at work, thus using less over time? With the RPG style of unlocking abilities, it seems obvious for this to be possible.

You do that when unlocking new tiers of tools. Iron tools are a must, early game, as they reduce energy consumption by half, and are faster. Then there's steel tools. They are faster, and of course more durable.

As for weapons, there seem to be 2 weapons currently in the game, the starting rusty sword, and an iron sword you can unlock and craft at the woodworking bench that deals twice as much damage per swing.
Vierik Jun 8, 2018 @ 7:18am 
Just make muffins,cake or take wine whats the big deal?
CloversDrop Jun 8, 2018 @ 7:27am 
I'd like to see the energy use removed from sword swing.

If I'm really getting what I want I'd like to see the tool decay removed too.
Skrymaster Jun 8, 2018 @ 8:15am 
Originally posted by Vierik:
Just make muffins,cake or take wine whats the big deal?

Nah, people soon will start suggesting they remove the gameplay from the game, just make it a long cutscene, they can't be bothered to play it, you know...
nightworg Jun 8, 2018 @ 10:11am 
No need to remove that. A stack of wine is more than enough to get through that.
NexAngelus *X* Jun 8, 2018 @ 10:22am 
i didnt like it at first but u fight so little i think it does not hurt the game. WHEN u go into the dungeon u have dungeon stuff on u. so far the game is not like SV where ooo i feel like going into the mine *runs over*. this is more like im planning on doing duneon first light today... gotta have my stuff ready. once u get over that i dont see the issue anymore. *yes i hated it at first*
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Date Posted: Jun 7, 2018 @ 12:52pm
Posts: 28