wither should never have existed.

[SenMithrarin85]

tried it for the 1st time on hellwyrm, and its attack hit me for 39 points of damage...

japanese certainly like their rpgs easy. squeenix at least...

[Zodiark]

That's quite contradictory. You say it's challengeless, but if you wander off a bit you get killed. And some bosses apparently still manage to kill your party?

I agree with some of the things JDHski mentioned. Autosaves removed any feeling of danger. The speed modes made grinding much easier so it's more probable that you will be overpowered throughout most of the game. But I also believe that the stat growth is a bit too large in this version. It feels like you have way more HP when fighting the story bosses than in vanilla. You also have better weapons and better overall stats. I just finished a playthrough of the PS4 version for the first time and my strategy consisted of simply using the Attack command throughout 90% of the story. Sure, I had an overpowered Deathbringer right after the Tomb of Raithwall, but it still feels way easier than vanilla.

I don't see how a newbie would have trouble with the story battles, but I can see how they would have trouble with some of the optional battles if they weren't using a guide. Aside from making the enemies vulnerable to Wither, the difficulty shouldn't have changed much. Instead of making the breaks permanent, they should have made them timed. That would keep the technicks useful, while also adding some strategic value.

[JD]

Originally posted by Zodiark:

But I also believe that the stat growth is a bit too large in this version. It feels like you have way more HP when fighting the story bosses than in vanilla. You also have better weapons and better overall stats.

This is true, but it's also true that you can't go and just unlock three quickening licenses early to quadruple your MP pool like you could in the old version. TZA also makes you strategize much more about equipment choices rather than just giving any random three party members your best heavy armor, your strongest weapons, and Curaja gambits. The end result is more powerful characters in TZA, but only if you spend the time finding optimal equipment and all the spells / abilities for them.

NG- also removes that advantage and requires you to add several dimensions to your strategy, Although it's not really all that challenging for someone that's very familiar with the game.

[JD]

I'd say the biggest structural advantage from TZA to the original is that you can use Espers and Quickenings without depleting your MP pool. It allows you to use those abilities pretty much at anytime without handicapping yourself. I think it's a good change though because it encourages you to experiment more with these abilities without sacrificing your much more limited (as a whole) magick capacity in this version.

[SenMithrarin85]

Originally posted by JDHski:

I'd say the biggest structural advantage from TZA to the original is that you can use Espers and Quickenings without depleting your MP pool. It allows you to use those abilities pretty much at anytime without handicapping yourself. I think it's a good change though because it encourages you to experiment more with these abilities without sacrificing your much more limited (as a whole) magick capacity in this version.

quickenings are useless really and espers are dismissed if the summoner dies, which makes them not very helpful in a hard fight.

[Zodiark]

I wouldn't dismiss Quickenings as being useless. They can certainly help with those remaining 20% of an enemy's HP pool. One example is the Overlord battle. He can kill your entire party with a single Rage. Without Quickenings I would've gotten my first and only Game Over in TZA.

While the separation of Mist Charges from MP makes your initial chain stronger and easier to perform, it also doesn't allow you to perform a second one after a couple uses of Charge. I think these things even out in terms of difficulty.

[Peelsepuuppi]

Originally posted by JDHski:

Originally posted by ToveriJuri:

TZA is the easiest version. If you keep your gear updated(which you can buy) and do basic things like make a mage attack enemy weaknesses it's not hard you don't need ultimate weapons or optimal setups, it's still easy.

I played the original one on PS2 without guides and it doesn't have some of the elements that make this version ridiculously easy. The base game was not hard even back then and you can figure out a pretty decent way to play the game on your own.

I never did the optional side content back then so I can't speak for that.

lol the optional side content is the stuff that is actually somewhat challenging. Try making it through the great crystal upper layer without primo equipment or a map or auto saves whenever you move to a new zone. Playing through the first time on PS2 I think it took me at least 2 or 3 trips and over 10 game hours to find and defeat Ultima without a map.

On the original version you could also buy a Nihopaloa fairly early and easily which lets you breeze through pretty much every non-optional part of the game. "unfair" equipment in TZA is also available but you need to know how to find or create it at the bazaar.

A relatively easy game can have hard side content. I was talking about overall difficulty of the base game. Couple challenging end game superbosses doesn't mean the game is hard. But yeah Optional part of the Great Crystal is a challenging mess if you don't use a map.

It's nothing like Nocturne where the regular game is unforgiving and you actually need to have some strategy for base game bosses.

[Serafie1999AD]

For the Foebreaking abilities, I tend to use the same principle that I use for other broken skills in jRPGs, such as Knights of the Round (FFVII), Omnislash (FFVII), Selphie's "The End" (FFVIII), Yojimbo's Zanmato (FFX), Byzel Market items (SD3) etc: I try not to use them, especially against bosses. It takes all the fun out of the boss fights if you just cheese them.

[Blind]

Wither is ok... stacking Wither 10x is not

[SenMithrarin85]

Originally posted by BBX:

Wither is ok... stacking Wither 10x is not

yeah, but it shouldn't stack that high lol. even fighting omega 34 levels below it still allowed the odd wither to stick. 2 or 3 casts and its attacks were only averaging 1000 damage.

[Vaan]

There's only one way to make a balanced non action rpg, and that is to have a limited amount of enemies and make the game completely linear so that every battle is designed with a certain level in mind. Give people any degree of freedom and they'll crush it (find FF1 too hard? Just run back and forth for 2 hours to grind and crush that dungeon).

The only option to offer challenge in this scenario is with unavoidable statuses / deaths, that don't really provide a challenge but just an annoyance. Anything besides this would be puzzle fights, like the Reflect boss in FFX, which after you figure out stops being a challenge. By design classic jrpg fights CANNOT be challenging. All you saying "boo hoo back in my day" know nothing.

[SenMithrarin85]

Originally posted by Vaan:

There's only one way to make a balanced non action rpg, and that is to have a limited amount of enemies and make the game completely linear so that every battle is designed with a certain level in mind. Give people any degree of freedom and they'll crush it (find FF1 too hard? Just run back and forth for 2 hours to grind and crush that dungeon).

The only option to offer challenge in this scenario is with unavoidable statuses / deaths, that don't really provide a challenge but just an annoyance. Anything besides this would be puzzle fights, like the Reflect boss in FFX, which after you figure out stops being a challenge. By design classic jrpg fights CANNOT be challenging. All you saying "boo hoo back in my day" know nothing.

well i beg to differ. the last boss in the last remnant still holds his own even after all the optional content has been completed. pretty much the only jrpg i've played where I can say that even 9 years on.

[Vaan]

Originally posted by SenMithrarin85:

Originally posted by Vaan:

There's only one way to make a balanced non action rpg, and that is to have a limited amount of enemies and make the game completely linear so that every battle is designed with a certain level in mind. Give people any degree of freedom and they'll crush it (find FF1 too hard? Just run back and forth for 2 hours to grind and crush that dungeon).

The only option to offer challenge in this scenario is with unavoidable statuses / deaths, that don't really provide a challenge but just an annoyance. Anything besides this would be puzzle fights, like the Reflect boss in FFX, which after you figure out stops being a challenge. By design classic jrpg fights CANNOT be challenging. All you saying "boo hoo back in my day" know nothing.

well i beg to differ. the last boss in the last remnant still holds his own even after all the optional content has been completed. pretty much the only jrpg i've played where I can say that even 9 years on.

TLR is more of a strategy game than a turn based / atb jrpg