[Problem Solved] CPU overheat that appeared from one day to another

[Doryl]

Hello.


I'm seeking for help to understand what is happening with my computer while playing MHW.

Here are some data about my computer :

- Windows 7
- Intel Core i5-4670K
- NVIDIA GeForce GTX 760
- Around 4 or 5 years old.


I started playing MHW around 11/08. And until 18/08, everything was working well. I was able to play with 1080p/30FPS, and almost all others parameters on the low-quality side. It was good. I played around 10-12 hours with no problem at all.

Then, yesterday, my computer made an alert sound. It was an alert for overheat. My Bios is configured to alert me when above 70°C. (According to Intel website, i5-4670K max temperature supported is 72,72°C.).

Today, I cleaned my computer from all the dust it amassed. But nothing changed. It still hit the 70°C limit.

I downloaded "SpeedFan", to check my CPU temperature myself. When doing nothing, it's around 35-40°C. When playing MHW, but staying in Astera, it's around 60°C. When a quest start, it raises a bit. And when more things happen, like a fight with a monster, I'm alerted that I crossed the 70°C limit with a constant sound, and I must quickly close the game with the task manager.

I changed nothing on my computer since when it was working well. The only 2 things that have happened are :
- Maybe some updates that were done automatically without me knowing it.
- A little bit higher temperature in my room. From 25-27°C to 27-29°C.


Do you have some ideas about what is the source of the problem ? Does my computer begin to age too much ? Was I already close to the 70°C limit, and the small ambient temperature raise made it cross the line ? Or maybe... Something else...?

I sent a mail to Capcom support. I'm waiting for the answer. But any help, even the smallest, is welcome, since I can't play anymore with this problem...


Thanks for reading this. Have a good day !

[Habi]

What CPU cooler do you have? You might be in need of a new, better cooler.

[Armageddon]

I dunno where you read that the limit for that CPU is 72c, but its wrong.
For comfort i would aim to stay below 85c, when overclocking.
For stockclocks you shouldnt get anywhere near that.

1st and formost you need to understand that software like games cannot suddenly make ur system overheat. The problem lies with your cooling, it just so happens that in this case MHW is the game that is showing up the flaw.

So, check you cooling. Basic stuff:

Clean it, you done that good.
Air flow, have you restricted the case somehow, like having it in a cuboard.
Does the case have enough case fans
Is the CPU cooler good, or is it the stock POS intel gives out.
Do you have a fan profile set for the CPU cooelr and case fans.
Is the CPU cooler mounted properly
Does the CPU cooler have a good application of quality TIM

Idle temps of up to 40c are indeed high, so yu do most certainly have an issue, but dont blame MHW ..or any game, infact thank it for showing up the issue, now you can fix it.

[Doryl]

First, I never blamed MHW.

I'm just asking for help here because, in my case, the problem appears only on MHW. It's the only "heavy" game I play.

Also, I was surprised by the fact I was able to play perfectly for a week, and that I now have this overheat alert. It's because of this happening on MHW that I also came ask help here. (That doesn't mean I blame MHW for that.).


About where I read the temperature limit for my CPU, it's on Intel website, and Intel Support confirmed it when they answered me. (And they also suggest me to ask about this to the game's community.)

https://ark.intel.com/products/75048/Intel-Core-i5-4670K-Processor-6M-Cache-up-to-3_80-GHz


Then, since I'm not a native english speaker, I'm not sure to have understand all you said. But my CPU only has its original fan. My computer case have enough fans, and the air flow is probably perfectible, but good. The case is not in a restricted area. Today, while cleaning it, I checked the fans. All of them are properly fixed and work perfectly fine, with no sound or other signs of malfunction.

I know my computer is now old, and that I'll need to do some changes on it, but really, what I don't understand is why I have this problem after 1 week playing MHW without any issue...


And about idle temperature. It's high, but is it that high ? I'm really a beginner when it comes to computer temperature, but, I mean, since right now, the room itself is around 30°C, can I really expect my computer to be lower than 40°C...?



Edit : Also, when I say 35~40°C when doing nothing, it's what "SpeedFan" says. I noticed that on "SpeedFan", the temperature shown is higher than 70°C when the alert sound come. So, maybe it has a 0~5°C error margin with real temperature.

[NintendosixD4]

We need way more detail. Fill these in:

- Case
- Fans (and # of them)
- Motherboard
- Overclock settings (If applicable)
- GPU and Cooler type on it
- Harddrive location(s)

One thing I can recommend right now is to upgrade your cpu cooler, that stock one is pure garbage. The Cooler Master Hyper 212 Evo is great for people on a budget while personally I'd recommend the Corsair H100i (I use it myself on my 4790k, I also overclock and keeps my cpu nice and cool). If liquid cooling is not your thing then the Noctua NH-D15 is a great air cooler on the higer end (kinda ugly but the performance is great).

Fill out the list above and hope this helps.

P.S. If you do change coolers make sure you change out your thermal paste to a higher quality one like Arctic Silver or Arctic MX-4.

[Fang]

I'm with Nintedosix. No matter what the cause of this is, investing in a seperate cooler won't cost you much, and it will *always* improve your cooling. The stock ones are never really optimized for gaming. They do the job, but it's just always worth getting a better one.

Your wallet will thank you, because odds are good your hardware will last longer too with the lowered temps. From now on, on every PC you intend to use for enthusiast gaming, git dem better fans.

[That Blind Person]

Tj Max is 105c, (auto shutoff temp) 72C is the tcase value for "under load" temp, so it's running just fine, keep it below 85c as Armageddon mentioned and it will be fine.

Also note that it may be reading the maximum socket temp reached and that's what you're seeing, core temp will generally be 5c lower than socket, and for a more accurate value make sure to monitor all 4 cores as it may only be the main cores heating up to that point.

MSI Afterburner for one can show socket temp or per-core temp if you need a monitoring software, I even customized mine to show maximum temps before thermal throttling occurs so if I see my CPU's socket reach 100% usage it means my CPU is throttling back

[Doryl]

Originally posted by That Blind Person:

for a more accurate value make sure to monitor all 4 cores as it may only be the main cores heating up to that point.

SpeedFan allows to do that, and it's what I had done. When the alert from the 70°C limit from my bios resound, all 4 cores are seen around 72~75°C on SpeedFan. That's why I thought of a small error margin.



So, I agree with you all for what you said. I thank you for your answers. My cooling system is good enough for what I played until now, but MHW is on another level, and it's now not sufficiant.

There is just that one thing I still can't understand... Why was I able to play for ~10 hours without that alert sound, and now, it appears every time ? That's the thing that bother me...

The meaning behind this question is "Could there be an other problem elsewhere ?". If it's possible, I would like to check everything, and know all the things that need to be changed before investing...

Is there a way to know the processor health (As well as other PC components, while we're at it), in the same way some softwares can check HDD health using S.M.A.R.T. ?

Originally posted by That Blind Person:

Tj Max is 105c, (auto shutoff temp) 72C is the tcase value for "under load" temp, so it's running just fine, keep it below 85c as Armageddon mentioned and it will be fine.

Does that mean I am still able to play with no aftereffect, until I made the necessary changes ? (Just changing my bios settings to alert me at 80°C instead of 70°C.). Or should I prevent myself for playing until changes are done ?

[Uranus Queen]

80 under high load is completely normal for both GPU and CPU, don't worry too much

but you can open the case or install some chassis fans to reduce heat

[That Blind Person]

There could be more happening you can't see, for instance, do you regularly replace the cooling gel between the CPU and cooler at least once a year?

As for monitoring...not really, most parts will last far longer than needed to span the gap till a newer, more powerful part comes out to replace it, as long as games still run fine there's nothing wrong with using a CPU or GPU for 8+ years (and usually they will last that long) CPU/GPU manufacturers also give warranties for at least 1~2 years, and if anything WAS going to break it will generally be in this time frame.

And yes you can run it constantly at that temp just fine, in all honesty set the limit for 90c this way if it hits that you KNOW something is going on, a part can only really be damage by exceeding the Tj Max (105c in your CPU's case) over and over but your comptuer will shut the CPU down if it reaches 105c, the only other way to really harm a CPU is to change bios settings and pump too much voltage into it lol (don't do that unless you know what you're doing)

As for why you could play for 10 hours without it happening it could be dependant on the area you were playing in, Rotten Veil and Elders Recess push hardware far more than the other regions, and if you Host a MP game that will put even more load on your CPU. (pier-to-pier MP relies on the host's PC, more players = more load)

[Doryl]

I never do something if I don't know what I'm doing, so, no, I never changed a bios settings without perfectly knowing what I was doing.
But, in the same way, I wasn't well-informed about computers temperatures and how to regulate it the best way. So, I never replaced cooling gel. That's something I'll need to learn and regulary check too.

Until now, even if I use it a lot for games, my computer usage was not that demanding. (I only happen to be a MH fan, who don't want to buy a game console just for one liked game.) So, with no significant problem appearing, I never have done that much of material maintenance beside dust cleaning every some months...

About that, if you know a good website to learn about material maintenance and upgrade, I'm interrested in it.


Beside that, I'm playing slowly, and in a lightheaded way, easily diverted from my goal. So, for now, I only played on the 2 firsts map. (Ancient Forest, and Wildspire Waste, if I'm not mistaken.). I was able to play perfectly on both map, so, I don't think it has anything to do with my problem.

And about hosting... My internet connexion is too low, so, I'll never host a MP game. Until then, I only played solo. But since it's not possible to be "offline" without some tricks, I hosted using the "private" setting to stay alone. So, it should not trigger more load on my CPU, right ?

[That Blind Person]

Honestly just find a youtube video tutorial on applying Thermal Paste, it's a pretty universal method and not much can go wrong, but after about 3 years Themal Paste can solidify into a
thick powder and begins to block heat transfer instead of conducting it properly.

When I first got this PC and it's I7-3770k the thermal paste wasn't even on and temps were sitting around 80~90c, after applying new paste it dropped to 60~68c under heavy load (With the cheap stock intel fan cooler), it makes all the difference.

And yeah it's absolutely fine to create your own online session, it's only when other players are in a match with you that the load increases.

[Doryl]

Update on the problem :

I raised the overheat alert option to 80°C on my bios, and tried to play once more.

The result is not reassuring... Not only the alert sound appear, but according to SpeedFan, the temperature raising speed was way more important past 75°C. From what I can see on the graph, it seems it goes from 80°C to almost 90°C in mere seconds...

So, first meaning of this is that I must not play MHW until the problem is solved. Now, it's crystal clear. The thing I must know now is if cooling is the only problem or if the whole processor need to be changed.

Does the fact MHW is an exigeant game could be the source of an quickened wear...?

[Ancient]

Originally posted by Doryl:

Update on the problem :

I raised the overheat alert option to 80°C on my bios, and tried to play once more.

The result is not reassuring... Not only the alert sound appear, but according to SpeedFan, the temperature raising speed was way more important past 75°C. From what I can see on the graph, it seems it goes from 80°C to almost 90°C in mere seconds...

So, first meaning of this is that I must not play MHW until the problem is solved. Now, it's crystal clear. The thing I must know now is if cooling is the only problem or if the whole processor need to be changed.

Does the fact MHW is an exigeant game could be the source of an quickened wear...?

The processor doesn't need to be changed unless it won't boot or is directly causing other errors like blue screens. CPUs don't have anything like S.M.A.R.T.; they either work or they don't. In terms of wear, you'll burn out transistors or even socket pins by running it way too hot repeatedly (105C+) or pumping too much voltage into it, but generally, they don't really wear like HDDs do because they have no moving parts.

What wears out are bearings or motors in the cooler fans and the thermal paste degrades over time until

Originally posted by That Blind Person:

after about 3 years Themal Paste can solidify into a thick powder and begins to block heat transfer instead of conducting it properly.

that happens.

Some pastes, notably the cheap stuff you get with the stock Intel coolers are not engineered to last 3 years under 8-12 hrs of load per day, more like 1-2 years before they're dust. They're for office/light duty usage cycles where the CPU is rarely if ever going to be stressed to 80-100% and definitely not good for gaming, enthusiast, or rendering workstation rigs. I personally swear by Gelid GC Extreme compound because it has a high thermal transfer rate (hence is highly ranked in the below list) and lasts a long time due to it's chemical makeup, but there are lots of good ones to choose from: https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/thermal-paste-comparison,5108.html

It's fairly likely that your paste was just at the end of it rope anyway (or cooler, let's not rule out it's fans failing until you're sure they're working still and you've taken it out and made sure the fins of the heatsink aren't packed with dust, smoke residue and pet hair). Depending on the paste's actual makeup, when degradation happens it's usually pretty quick and will happen over 20-30 hours so it's most likely nothing to do with any specific game or anything like that and it was just going to happen anyway no matter what game you were playing.

CPUs should be able to run at 100% load 24/7 for a week straight without issues with a good cooler and paste combo, so there is no software you can blame for failures in the cooling chain, since nothing can push the CPU harder than 100% and it should be capable of withstanding the waste heat exchange indefinitely with sufficient cooling. Issues like this are always just about time that the CPU has been used and then either the cooler's fans failing, heatsink getting packed full of dust or the paste wearing out.

[Doryl]

Thanks for that well detailed answer.

I think you're right with your explanation... The fan and/or thermal paste was probably at its limit. The degradation happened during the days after I started playing MHW. (With MHW not in cause.) And since MHW is the only exigeant game I play, that's also the only game that is suffering from that problem. (And allowed me to detect it.)

So, for now, I'll put MHW aside, and during the next days, I'll calculate my budget, and invest in a new fan and thermal paste.

Thanks again to all of you for you answers ! (^_^)

[Doryl]

Update :

I bought a new cooler, a low budget one, the "Be Quiet - Pure Rock Slim".
I have done all that needed to be done about thermal paste while replacing the old cooler. Everything is good.

Tested MHW right after. Here are the result :

- Before lauching the game, PC doing nothing --> 30~35° (35~40° before)
- Game launched, in Astera --> 45~50° (~60° before)
- Game launched, in quest, with 2 large monsters on screen --> ~55° (80+° before)


So... Theese numbers are clear enough. The problem is now solved.
Again, thanks for all your help ! Have a good day ! o/



Edit : After playing for ~2h tonight, CPU temperature raised to a maximum of ~65°C. As long as it doesn't goes beyond that, it's good enough for me.