Kulve Weapons

[Pi is exactly 3]

So I have a bunch of Kulve Taroth weapons from both before Iceborne and after. Now that I'm building up a collection of Kjarr weapons is there anything I can do with the old ones other than sell them? I don't want to sell and then find out there's going to be some way of melting them down into materials, or upgrade to Kjarr or some such.

[Mr. September]

You can upgrade some (?) of them into Iceborne variants, but most of them were useless in the base game too, so don't keep your hopes up.

[Mander]

You can upgrade all of them to level 12. But a Taroth remains a Taroth: you can't make them a Kjarr.,,
And very few of them are worthy of it. The complete list is a hassle and a half to summarize and post here.
So, it’s quicker to ask: what weapons do you main?
Because taroth blitz “support” (LBG) is the meta for Normal 2 Rapid Fire.
Few Taroth bows have a better matchup against a very small number of monsters than their Kjarr counterparts (but is it worth the hassle to have 4 bows for each element? Imo, no: better to have Kjarr generalist options with more widespread use).

Very few Taroth Hunting Horn MAY lend themselves to very specific builds, thanks to their mix-tapes…

But nothing more than that.
The rest can be melded or sold without fears.

[Pi is exactly 3]

Exactly the info I needed, thank you very much!

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Just keep all Taroth (starts at R7) and Kjarr (R8), sell the Gold (R6).

Even if some are not the best meta option for that weapon element/status, they're useful for quickly putting together builds for any weapon.

Since you're asking about selling, that means you're not going for a full collection, so you have more than enough space. There's no pressing reason to sell.

[Mander]

Originally posted by Pi is exactly 3:

Exactly the info I needed, thank you very much!

You're welcome.

Btw, and sorry if I sound overbearing, even among the Kjarr weapons, not all are worthy to be collected.
Kjarr weapons are ofc meta for elemental weapons… but not all weapons can express a competitive elemental build nowadays.
I say this, because I hope to lighten your farming in the next future 😉
Take Insect Glaive for example: Kjarr Ice builds with the Insect Glaive were a thing in High Rank (I hunted AT Lunastra with it, back in the days). But with the arrival of Fatalis weapons, the meta for Insect Glaive moved completely to a raw one. Same is true with lance, and many others.

In short: all Kjarr CBs, DBs, Bows (bar dragon, thunder and water for generalist options) are considered “meta”. Maybe SW too, I don’t remember atm.
Plus HBG (yes, there are builds for elemental heavybowgun. It’s niche, but it works splendidly).

For all the rest, raw usually performs better (usually, because Alatreon is a thing: there, Kjarr LS builds for example are how I hunted him the most).

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2913710144

[Pi is exactly 3]

Oh yeah not going for a literal full collection, just a nice array of the good stuff

[Pi is exactly 3]

Originally posted by Mander:

For all the rest, raw usually performs better

I was under the impression that elemental damage was added on top of raw, is this not the case? And if Raw is usually better does that just mean Raging Brachy or Alatreon? (I'm learning Fatalis atm)

[Mander]

Originally posted by Pi is exactly 3:

Originally posted by Mander:

For all the rest, raw usually performs better

I was under the impression that elemental damage was added on top of raw, is this not the case? And if Raw is usually better does that just mean Raging Brachy or Alatreon? (I'm learning Fatalis atm)

Yes, but elemental weapons have a total damage that is lower than raw, even with favorable matchup (outside the above cases ofc, with Kjarr and elemental builds).
With the arrival of Fatalis set and weapons (plus Velkhana AT) much if not all of the "meta" has been moved there.

[AI]

So... In short, kjarr is a thing just specifically because of alatreon's elemental check? Other than that it's raw power all the way?

[Pi is exactly 3]

Originally posted by Mander:

Yes, but elemental weapons have a total damage that is lower than raw, even with favorable matchup (outside the above cases ofc, with Kjarr and elemental builds).

I think I'm not understanding something here. If a weapon has let's say 500 raw and 100 element, wouldn't it be better to have the 500+100? How would a raw version beat that?

[Mr. September]

Originally posted by AI:

So... In short, kjarr is a thing just specifically because of alatreon's elemental check? Other than that it's raw power all the way?

Depends on the weapon type, but sounds about right.

[AI]

Originally posted by Mr. September:

Originally posted by AI:

So... In short, kjarr is a thing just specifically because of alatreon's elemental check? Other than that it's raw power all the way?

Depends on the weapon type, but sounds about right.

Ok ok, got it

Originally posted by Pi is exactly 3:

I think I'm not understanding something here. If a weapon has let's say 500 raw and 100 element, wouldn't it be better to have the 500+100? How would a raw version beat that?

Unless I'm wrong, I think that's because elemental is not a straight up additional damage, I think it's easier to treat it like how blast or paralysis occur, you didn't always got blast or paralysis in each attack, you attack a certain times, and after some degree of attack, that bonus attack damage is triggered, leading to overall lower damage than straight up attack power from the weapon that you always dealt

[Pi is exactly 3]

Originally posted by AI:

Unless I'm wrong, I think that's because elemental is not a straight up additional damage, I think it's easier to treat it like how blast or paralysis occur, you didn't always got blast or paralysis in each attack, you attack a certain times, and after some degree of attack, that bonus attack damage is triggered, leading to overall lower damage than straight up attack power from the weapon that you always dealt

But if that were the case you'd still be doing the same amount of raw damage, just with a little extra element damage sprinkled in here and there.

[Mander]

Originally posted by Pi is exactly 3:

Originally posted by Mander:

Yes, but elemental weapons have a total damage that is lower than raw, even with favorable matchup (outside the above cases ofc, with Kjarr and elemental builds).

I think I'm not understanding something here. If a weapon has let's say 500 raw and 100 element, wouldn't it be better to have the 500+100? How would a raw version beat that?

Having 650 of pure raw, for example.
The comparison is a little harder because of sharpness, that changes how much of the total damage is "translated" on hit. For example, blue sharpness < purple sharpness…
But the gist of it is the above.

[Mander]

Originally posted by AI:

So... In short, kjarr is a thing just specifically because of alatreon's elemental check? Other than that it's raw power all the way?

Not exactly, sorry for the oversimplification.
Let’s take Legiana as a case study: it’s a monster weak to thunder.
SO, you can fight it either with a thunder build, or a raw build.
In term of pure damage done to the monster, a Kjarr thunder build, for example dual swords, will achieve better overall damage than raw… in this specific case. Because dual swords are generally “elemental weapons”.
IF instead, you’re using insect glaive? Your raw build with insect glaive will deal overall better damage. Because insect glaive isn’t (anymore) an elemental weapon in Iceborne.

The following question could be: “and what about elemental dual swords VS insect glaive raw vs Legiana”?
DS would probably do better damage...
But nothing forces you to always use the "best" weapon. Sometimes, a beloved generalist option you’ve spent thousand of hours to master is enough 😉

EDIT: that said, there are some monsters I usually hunted only with elemental weapons.
Mainly the headache type: Rajang, Furious Rajang, Ragin Brachydios, Lunastra… Ice bow/ Ice CB all the way.
Or Kushala. Frick him, btw, I hate Kushala Daora with a passion: it's the only monster that I learned a new weapon for just to deal with him (elemental dragon bow with high elderseal by Alatreon).