Fury Swipes overriding most Lifesteal items

[dalbozofgurth]

Ok, I get the entire concept of not stacking unique combat modifiers. However, it's a bit of a cheap small print to make an always on ability such as Fury Swipes completely disable only 1/2 of the lifesteal abilities in the game.... there should be some consistency here: disable ALL lifesteal. Allow lifesteal for unmodified damage. Or at least give us the option of turning fury swipes off.

I wouldn't be complaining if it just wasn't so inconsistent.

[pringles]

vlads lifesteal aura isnt a 'unique combat modifier', neither is sk lifesteal aura, which is why they work with fury swipes

hotd/madness/satanic are orb effects which dont work with fury swipes

pretty consistent if you ask me

[redlaserbm]

It is consistent; Fury Swipes overrides all other unique attack modifiers, like that from Mask of Madness, Helm of the Dominator, Satanic, and Morbid Mask. It does not override auras such as the one from Vladimir's Offering.

Unique attack modifiers do not stack with some exceptions; Maelstrom and Mjollnir stack with other unique attack modifiers but override them when Chain Lightning procs, and Eye of Skadi's unique attack modifier can be combined with lifesteal on ranged heroes.

[dalbozofgurth]

Yeah, that's exactly why this is inconsistent.

I'm sorry but there's no reasoning behind this. Why should vlads not be a unique combat modifier but helm of command is? Why are fury swipes considered a unique combat modifier in relationship to life steal when life steal should be base damage to begin with? Especially since Fury Swipes is an innate ability.

I don't know of any other innate damage + ability which is considered a unique combat modifier like this. The Drow's + damage doesn't do this, for instance. Why does Fury Swipes?

It's inconsistent all the way with the Ursa.

[dalbozofgurth]

BIGGamerer it's not consistent with other heroes and innate damage + modifiers which you cannot turn off.

[redlaserbm]

Originally posted by dalbozofgurth:

Yeah, that's exactly why this is inconsistent.

I'm sorry but there's no reasoning behind this. Why should vlads not be a unique combat modifier but helm of command is? Why are fury swipes considered a unique combat modifier in relationship to life steal when life steal should be base damage to begin with? Especially since Fury Swipes is an innate ability.

I don't know of any other innate damage + ability which is considered a unique combat modifier like this. The Drow's + damage doesn't do this, for instance. Why does Fury Swipes?

It's inconsistent all the way with the Ursa.

You didn't hear me the first time, so I'll type this again in all caps for your slow brain: UNIQUE ATTACK MODIFIERS (WITH SOME EXCEPTIONS) DO NOT STACK WITH OTHER UNIQUE ATTACK MODIFIERS. AURAS SUCH AS THAT FROM VLADIMIR'S OFFERING OR ASSAULT CUIRASS ARE NOT OVERRIDEN BY UNIQUE ATTACK MODIFIERS.

[dalbozofgurth]

I read you just fine. You gave an argument with nothing to back up your opinion. I stated it is consistent and cited instances where it is inconsistent and asked that a change be made for balance and consistency purposes. I've reported you for your trolling and combative tone.

[Hempest]

Its called hero balance they do what they do for a reason, somehow I think that the game devs know a little bit more about how to balance the game than some rando with ~100 hours play time.

[redlaserbm]

Originally posted by dalbozofgurth:

I read you just fine. You gave an argument with nothing to back up your opinion. I stated it is consistent and cited instances where it is inconsistent and asked that a change be made for balance and consistency purposes. I've reported you for your torlling and combative tone.

Buddy, you're gonna get yourself kicked out of these forums faster than any trash-talker will by randomly reporting people for no apparent reason. Stop trying to debate facts, since I did just state a fact that the game's rules abide by without fail, while your ass insists that for some reason, everyone else is wrong and you're right. I ain't posting opinions buddy, it's straight-up facts. Stop trying to combat them.

Anyways, I didn't have a reason to report you, but I do now since you have decided to report me for something that otherwise could've been solved by talking it out and asking for an apology. Reporting for an unprovoked personal attack.

[76561198104142155]

HELP PLEASE! http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=192175489

[pringles]

Originally posted by dalbozofgurth:

Why are fury swipes considered a unique combat modifier in relationship to life steal when life steal should be base damage to begin with? Especially since Fury Swipes is an innate ability.

I don't know of any other innate damage + ability which is considered a unique combat modifier like this. The Drow's + damage doesn't do this, for instance. Why does Fury Swipes?

what is an 'innate ability' supposed to be? what does it have to do with anything? the only thing heroes have 'innately' is magic resistance. lifesteal is 'base damage'? what are you talking about?

Fury Swipes is a Unique Combat Modifier, which means it doesn't work with Unique Combat Modifiers like lifesteal. Drow's +damage isn't a Unique Combat Modifier, so it works with Unique Combat Modifiers like lifesteal.

Vlads lifesteal aura isn't a Unique Combat Modifier, so it works with Fury Swipes, which is a Unique Combat Modifier

how is that hard to understand, and how is it inconsistent

[̣]

Fury swipes isn't the only unique attack modifier.
Anti-Mage's mana break, drow's frost arrows, huskar's flaming spears, brood's incapacitating bite and more are all unique attack modifier.
EVEN weaver's geminate attack and entangling claws are unique attack modifiers whenever it triggers.

[̣]

Plus it's from dota 1, so deal with it

[76561198104142155]

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=192175489

[Mellithae]

Originally posted by dalbozofgurth:

I read you just fine. You gave an argument with nothing to back up your opinion. I stated it is consistent and cited instances where it is inconsistent and asked that a change be made for balance and consistency purposes. I've reported you for your torlling and combative tone.

the best way i can think of to explain it is: aura lifesteal is a different mechanic from unique attack modifier lifesteal
kind of like crit stacking with unique attack modifiers
he was also not trolling, and i see so many people with tones far more combative than this that if they were all reported there wouldnt be anyone here

Originally posted by dalbozofgurth:

Yeah, that's exactly why this is inconsistent.

I'm sorry but there's no reasoning behind this. Why should vlads not be a unique combat modifier but helm of command is? Why are fury swipes considered a unique combat modifier in relationship to life steal when life steal should be base damage to begin with? Especially since Fury Swipes is an innate ability.

I don't know of any other innate damage + ability which is considered a unique combat modifier like this. The Drow's + damage doesn't do this, for instance. Why does Fury Swipes?

It's inconsistent all the way with the Ursa.

it is because it applies a debuff, not actually increase his statistics, which's application is the unique attack modifier.
life steal isnt base damage though, and its not intended to be.

[dalbozofgurth]

Originally posted by Hempest:

Its called hero balance they do what they do for a reason, somehow I think that the game devs know a little bit more about how to balance the game than some rando with ~100 hours play time.

1. Explain to me how it's "balanced" when only half of the life steal items are excluded? A number of ones which are allowed actually are more powerful than say the Helm of Command.
2. Explain to me how it's "balanced" to have a damage + ability be an exclusionary ability, when it's innate? Innate meaning you cannot turn it off. ALL OTHER heroes who are exclusionary are cpabale of being turned off. That's a fact. The Ursa can't turn his off. That makes no sense.

True balance would be the following:

* Exclude ALL lifesteal items
or
* Make all lifesteal items only steal life for Base Damage
or
* Make the damage + ability which is exclusionary NOT Innate. Make it a toggle on or off feature.

Your comment about my playtime is the epitome of trollish behavior, especially when you're blindly claiming everything the devs do is 100% correct.

Got news for ya, the Devs make mistakes, they make oversights, they often are not capable of balancing all the heroes without player input.

Also, I've been playing dota since before many of these players even knew it existed (although I prefer hero wars). To think you are so smart as to check my play hours and use that in an argument is laughable.

Discuss if you wish to discuss, but don't try to troll me with such infantile attempts.