KEZ not OP, not broken, why ?

[Louffe]

Aside of the fact the hero has just been significantly nerfed, I think people complaining do not understand Falcon Rush, leading to controversy. They also do not get that this hero is super weak, even with a +2.6 strength buff per level. And they forget that low cooldowns abuse and switch mania requires the scepter.

I really invite those complaining to go to the demo mode and test Falcon Rush. They will find out there is a nerf in it since day one. A huge one, which explains the best builds in Sai mode are actually Ursa builds... Even Radiance may be better than Butterfly because of this... no one pick Maelstrom / Molljnir and there is a good reason for that. Even Power Treads in Sai mode are a bad idea, Phase Boots are better.

I also reminds that stun and crit have 17% odds. Daedelus crit is 30% and Skull Basher is 25%. Combined with the nerf included in Falcon Rush, the procs remain contained.

By the way, in the nerf/buff series, I really hope a compromise will be reached with a 4/5/6/7 duration for Falcon Rush. 7 was a bit abusive in lane while 3/4/5/6 is far too low.

[Alpha Omega Pepega]

Messaggio originale di Zagryzaec:

Did you ever talked with doctors of science?

Because I did and even persuaded him he was wrong.

Your argument is idiotic.

If no one cares about free stun why not give it for free every carry?

Why not give it to blood seeker?
Why not give it to antimage and phantom assassin?

Why not give ursa free harpoon at the start of the game?

Do you really think that having an opportunity to become practically immortal vs hero without detection is something irrelevant?

Do you think that the entire farming process that every player on dota do irrelevant? And so is their choice of items they get to get the utility?

Why doesn't every support then get a free glimmer cape that takes no slot space and require no gold?

I don't know what account you baught by your reasoning is about herald level. And I talked here with a few.

:D
This thing alone really shows your lack of understand of how game works. You legit made a classic "riki is op, because you need to ward whole map against him" archon-legend bracket argument.
This is where i draw a line. One thing is a legend player, who talks nonesense.but legend player with ego.who thinks he is better ,than he is. Neh. Im tired of wasting time on you.
Goodbye.
P.S."Did you ever talked with doctors of science?

Because I did and even persuaded him he was wrong."
This one is the funniest part tbh. I just made an analogy, but your ego just could not take it, so you made up some bs. I love when an average person, talks about how he is a master of all trades.

[ConfusedSOB]

Messaggio originale di Zagryzaec:

Did you ever talked with doctors of science?

Because I did and even persuaded him he was wrong.

Your argument is idiotic.

If no one cares about free stun why not give it for free every carry?

Why not give it to blood seeker?
Why not give it to antimage and phantom assassin?

Why not give ursa free harpoon at the start of the game?

Do you really think that having an opportunity to become practically immortal vs hero without detection is something irrelevant?

Do you think that the entire farming process that every player on dota do irrelevant? And so is their choice of items they get to get the utility?

Why doesn't every support then get a free glimmer cape that takes no slot space and require no gold?

I don't know what account you baught by your reasoning is about herald level. And I talked here with a few.

i think his IQ is just too low to understand anything, just ignore him

the hero got nerfed again and thats all that matter

[P R O P H Y L A X I S]

I havent played vs an incredible kez yet. He doesnt seem any more OP than any normal carry.

IMO a lot of the time people think a certain hero is OP they havent considered gameplay (mostly positioning) and item choices to counter him.

[twitch.tv/rennyxflame]

Messaggio originale di Louffe:

Aside of the fact the hero has just been significantly nerfed, I think people complaining do not understand Falcon Rush, leading to controversy. They also do not get that this hero is super weak, even with a +2.6 strength buff per level. And they forget that low cooldowns abuse and switch mania requires the scepter.

I really invite those complaining to go to the demo mode and test Falcon Rush. They will find out there is a nerf in it since day one. A huge one, which explains the best builds in Sai mode are actually Ursa builds... Even Radiance may be better than Butterfly because of this... no one pick Maelstrom / Molljnir and there is a good reason for that. Even Power Treads in Sai mode are a bad idea, Phase Boots are better.

I also reminds that stun and crit have 17% odds. Daedelus crit is 30% and Skull Basher is 25%. Combined with the nerf included in Falcon Rush, the procs remain contained.

By the way, in the nerf/buff series, I really hope a compromise will be reached with a 4/5/6/7 duration for Falcon Rush. 7 was a bit abusive in lane while 3/4/5/6 is far too low.

the hero needs bkb, satanic and dmg.

because he already has stun and critical with daggers.

farming item maelstrom since its cheaper then battlefury..

mana issue ? Buy ring of basilius or vladimir.

he is a great desolator carry but to be active or not dying fast he needs bkb and satanic. either he kills fast or he only kill one hero and die to the others.

with falcon rush and switching to katana passive with a orb of corrosion or orb of venom can deal decent dmg. on mid lane. yes im mid laner and its not the best mid lane but thats why i found out he needs dmg items and survive. as mid laner i want to make something happen which is not easy as a melee.

sometimes mid is feeding if i max falcon rush and roam lanes i get 4/0 (diving mid lane tower if enemy is low hp) falcon rush is great to chase.

but he will fall off if he doesnt get a desolator or a bkb with satanic. in team fights he gets usseles if all lanes lost lanes. and with no farming item it feels bad. i had good games and bad games. i think he is good safe lane

[twitch.tv/rennyxflame]

PS if enemy has a lion, shaman, ogree, storm, puck. withot orchid he is usseles as mid lane.

thats why i think he is better as a safe laner.

why would i play him on mid. WELL JUST FOR FUN :D

[Zagryzaec]

Messaggio originale di Alpha Omega Pepega:

Messaggio originale di Zagryzaec:

Did you ever talked with doctors of science?

Because I did and even persuaded him he was wrong.

Your argument is idiotic.

If no one cares about free stun why not give it for free every carry?

Why not give it to blood seeker?
Why not give it to antimage and phantom assassin?

Why not give ursa free harpoon at the start of the game?

Do you really think that having an opportunity to become practically immortal vs hero without detection is something irrelevant?

Do you think that the entire farming process that every player on dota do irrelevant? And so is their choice of items they get to get the utility?

Why doesn't every support then get a free glimmer cape that takes no slot space and require no gold?

I don't know what account you baught by your reasoning is about herald level. And I talked here with a few.

:D
This thing alone really shows your lack of understand of how game works. You legit made a classic "riki is op, because you need to ward whole map against him" archon-legend bracket argument.
This is where i draw a line. One thing is a legend player, who talks nonesense.but legend player with ego.who thinks he is better ,than he is. Neh. Im tired of wasting time on you.
Goodbye.
P.S."Did you ever talked with doctors of science?

Because I did and even persuaded him he was wrong."
This one is the funniest part tbh. I just made an analogy, but your ego just could not take it, so you made up some bs. I love when an average person, talks about how he is a master of all trades.

You lost the argument and looking for excuse to run away.

Everything people need to know about you is written in your profile comments.

Don't buy accounts of levels you cannot play at, please.

Also unlike you I don't need to lie.

[JJ, Professional Fool]

His aoe sucks and his after image is a neat mechanic to work around. More utility and use than Ringmaster. He just needs a hotfix as most new hero's tend. Scale comes after initial release. Shoot he ain't got no facit yet either.

[P R O P H Y L A X I S]

Messaggio originale di Zagryzaec:

Messaggio originale di Alpha Omega Pepega:

:D
This thing alone really shows your lack of understand of how game works. You legit made a classic "riki is op, because you need to ward whole map against him" archon-legend bracket argument.
This is where i draw a line. One thing is a legend player, who talks nonesense.but legend player with ego.who thinks he is better ,than he is. Neh. Im tired of wasting time on you.
Goodbye.
P.S."Did you ever talked with doctors of science?

Because I did and even persuaded him he was wrong."
This one is the funniest part tbh. I just made an analogy, but your ego just could not take it, so you made up some bs. I love when an average person, talks about how he is a master of all trades.

You lost the argument and looking for excuse to run away.

Everything people need to know about you is written in your profile comments.

Don't buy accounts of levels you cannot play at, please.

Also unlike you I don't need to lie.

What hero / items are you picking when you are vs kez?

[Zagryzaec]

I'm dedicated support player so I usually first pick

What does it has to do with him bieng broken or not?

[P R O P H Y L A X I S]

Messaggio originale di Zagryzaec:

I'm dedicated support player so I usually first pick

What does it has to do with him bieng broken or not?

Well if you get dumb items every game you wont ever be a good player. What item do you try to counter him with and on what hero?

[Htlr's son]

TL; DR. Kez is OP indeed!
Inbuilt: bash, satanic(kinda), blink, invis, radiance, something for atckspeed(falcon rush skill).
But aside from that: low durability, hex counters him, falcon rush can be dispelled(eul, invk tornado ect.).
Is he really op? If he's 5 levels higher than you - obviously yes, but it is the same for everyone. IMO it will just take some time for people to understand and adapt to standing agaist kez. (Sorry for bad english)

[Zagryzaec]

Messaggio originale di PROPHYLAXIS:

Messaggio originale di Zagryzaec:

I'm dedicated support player so I usually first pick

What does it has to do with him bieng broken or not?

Well if you get dumb items every game you wont ever be a good player. What item do you try to counter him with and on what hero?

Why do you ask?

I don't need to counter him specifically.

I can just burn the entire team with warlock refresher aghs.

[P R O P H Y L A X I S]

Messaggio originale di Zagryzaec:

Messaggio originale di PROPHYLAXIS:

Well if you get dumb items every game you wont ever be a good player. What item do you try to counter him with and on what hero?

Why do you ask?

I don't need to counter him specifically.

I can just burn the entire team with warlock refresher aghs.

Because if you are thinking 1 hero is OP but you arent actually doing a thing to counter or respect the hero then its almost certainly a skill issue.

Getting the same items every game is nuts.

[Louffe]

Messaggio originale di twitch.tv/rennyxflame:

PS if enemy has a lion, shaman, ogree, storm, puck. withot orchid he is usseles as mid lane.

thats why i think he is better as a safe laner.

why would i play him on mid. WELL JUST FOR FUN :D

As many, I started to try the hero as a Hard Carry. But then I rapidly tried him as a Midlaner and he is far better at that position. This hero is not that different from a Riki in term of way of earning coins, fighting and occupying a lane are better options than camp farming.

It also frees him from expensive builds such as Battle Fury and Satanic. You can be focus on the Scepter, Diffusal Blade and Crystalis in Sai mode or on Orb of Corrosion, Skadi, Manta and Maelstrom (for fights against illusions) in Katana mode. BKB is more accessible, too.

I have never had a rough mid with him at all, even against Lion, Puck or Storm Spirit. Never played against Ogre mid, can't tell. Once you max out Talon Toss - Grappling Claw first, the lane is safe.

And yes, Kez is a fun, enjoyable Midlaner.

53% WR at my modest level with a n > 30.

[Louffe]

Messaggio originale di twitch.tv/rennyxflame:

Messaggio originale di Louffe:

Aside of the fact the hero has just been significantly nerfed, I think people complaining do not understand Falcon Rush, leading to controversy. They also do not get that this hero is super weak, even with a +2.6 strength buff per level. And they forget that low cooldowns abuse and switch mania requires the scepter.

I really invite those complaining to go to the demo mode and test Falcon Rush. They will find out there is a nerf in it since day one. A huge one, which explains the best builds in Sai mode are actually Ursa builds... Even Radiance may be better than Butterfly because of this... no one pick Maelstrom / Molljnir and there is a good reason for that. Even Power Treads in Sai mode are a bad idea, Phase Boots are better.

I also reminds that stun and crit have 17% odds. Daedelus crit is 30% and Skull Basher is 25%. Combined with the nerf included in Falcon Rush, the procs remain contained.

By the way, in the nerf/buff series, I really hope a compromise will be reached with a 4/5/6/7 duration for Falcon Rush. 7 was a bit abusive in lane while 3/4/5/6 is far too low.

the hero needs bkb, satanic and dmg.

because he already has stun and critical with daggers.

farming item maelstrom since its cheaper then battlefury..

mana issue ? Buy ring of basilius or vladimir.

he is a great desolator carry but to be active or not dying fast he needs bkb and satanic. either he kills fast or he only kill one hero and die to the others.

with falcon rush and switching to katana passive with a orb of corrosion or orb of venom can deal decent dmg. on mid lane. yes im mid laner and its not the best mid lane but thats why i found out he needs dmg items and survive. as mid laner i want to make something happen which is not easy as a melee.

sometimes mid is feeding if i max falcon rush and roam lanes i get 4/0 (diving mid lane tower if enemy is low hp) falcon rush is great to chase.

but he will fall off if he doesnt get a desolator or a bkb with satanic. in team fights he gets usseles if all lanes lost lanes. and with no farming item it feels bad. i had good games and bad games. i think he is good safe lane

The key with Kez is too choose the main weapon at the beginning of the game. You must plan it. Once it is done, the build can be considered.

Basically:

Sai mode: MUST AVOID ATTACK SPEED ITEMS, except Butterfly.
Katana mode: MUST BE FOCUS ON ATTACK SPEED ITEMS and HP regen limiters.

The typical example is Maelstrom. This item is prohibited in Sai mode and almost a must have in Katana mode. Same with Manta, forbidden in Sai, almost needed in Katana.

The Scepter is mainly useful in Sai mode, ICE. It allows you to get Grappling Claw and Raptor Dance ICE, if a fighting does not turn in your favor.

When do you use one or the other ?

Sai mode : against glass cannons and supports, to wipe them.
Katana mode : against sturdy heroes, to cut in half the HP regen and apply max health damages. Orb of Corrosion is a must to reach 50%, upgraded then into Skadi.

Katana is pretty efficient against Necrophos, Bristleback (the dash teleport you in front of him as well), Ogre, Centaur, Satanic enthusiasts, etc.