they ruined Trusty Shovel hate that change

[Taweret]

it was item that differentiated good and bad players, good players always had trusty shovel in backpack and use it off cooldown for chance of free gold for whole team even if he played any other pos than support now it's just purely support item...
it was not selfish item only for team players.

[Riblion]

It has always been a support item, cores have better neutrals on tier 1

[ʍolɟ ǝɥʇ ǝsɹǝʌǝɹ]

Well I will be taking the tree 🌳 so no worries

[Taweret]

Originally posted by Riblion:

It has always been a support item, cores have better neutrals on tier 1

yeah sure, then why the change? they ruined it, is not by any way support item, you pick it with any carry because of value it gives to whole team you dont care of pathetic low stats boost from tier 1 item because you wont anyway engage in combat until you farm your core items, you want at least tier 2-3 as carry (tier 2 drops in 17 minute you dont need slightly better t1 to do stuff) and have shovel in backpack to use it off cooldown when possible. also it's great item if your lane is dominated and you need to farm jungle since salves increase sustainability and free mangos are good too so you dont have return to regen mana. it was pro item for pro players now it's just generic item that dont reward smart gameplay.
also you only have 2.6k hours in dota, thats beginner mode, you wont understand how good that item was before this change.

[Riblion]

Originally posted by Taweret:

Originally posted by Riblion:

It has always been a support item, cores have better neutrals on tier 1

yeah sure, then why the change? they ruined it, is not by any way support item, you pick it with any carry because of value it gives to whole team you dont care of pathetic low stats boost from tier 1 item because you wont anyway engage in combat until you farm your core items, you want at least tier 2-3 as carry (tier 2 drops in 17 minute you dont need slightly better t1 to do stuff) and have shovel in backpack to use it off cooldown when possible. also it's great item if your lane is dominated and you need to farm jungle since salves increase sustainability and free mangos are good too so you dont have return to regen mana. it was pro item for pro players now it's just generic item that dont reward smart gameplay.
also you only have 2.6k hours in dota, thats beginner mode, you wont understand how good that item was before this change.

i have never seen a carry player take trusty shovel, so idk what are you about

[Taweret]

Originally posted by Riblion:

Originally posted by Taweret:

yeah sure, then why the change? they ruined it, is not by any way support item, you pick it with any carry because of value it gives to whole team you dont care of pathetic low stats boost from tier 1 item because you wont anyway engage in combat until you farm your core items, you want at least tier 2-3 as carry (tier 2 drops in 17 minute you dont need slightly better t1 to do stuff) and have shovel in backpack to use it off cooldown when possible. also it's great item if your lane is dominated and you need to farm jungle since salves increase sustainability and free mangos are good too so you dont have return to regen mana. it was pro item for pro players now it's just generic item that dont reward smart gameplay.
also you only have 2.6k hours in dota, thats beginner mode, you wont understand how good that item was before this change.

i have never seen a carry player take trusty shovel, so idk what are you about

trusty shovel was AMAZING, now it's useless, gj Valve. i have three times more hours in dota 2 and i know what im talking about, here is proof:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGzHr9XkEoo
footage from TI where morph uses trusty shovel.

the fact you didnt see means you played with bad and LAZY carry players.

in fact i was addicted to using this item on any hero on any pos, now i feel really empty... you dig mango it make your ult ready for teamfight, you dig salve it helped you to sustain hard times and get back on track, you dig kobold enjoy that passive income paired with philosopher stone, you dig 5 bounty runes throughout game enjoy that free kill everyone... it was broken.

[Riblion]

Originally posted by Taweret:

Originally posted by Riblion:

i have never seen a carry player take trusty shovel, so idk what are you about

trusty shovel was AMAZING, now it's useless, gj Valve. i have three times more hours in dota 2 and i know what im talking about, here is proof:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGzHr9XkEoo
footage from TI where morph uses trusty shovel.

the fact you didnt see means you played with bad and LAZY carry players.

number of hours dont mean anything, whats your mmr? your video is direct evidence why you shouldnt pick trusty shovel xddd, its also more than 1 year old...

[Taweret]

Originally posted by Riblion:

Originally posted by Taweret:

trusty shovel was AMAZING, now it's useless, gj Valve. i have three times more hours in dota 2 and i know what im talking about, here is proof:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGzHr9XkEoo
footage from TI where morph uses trusty shovel.

the fact you didnt see means you played with bad and LAZY carry players.

number of hours dont mean anything, whats your mmr? your video is direct evidence why you shouldnt pick trusty shovel xddd, its also more than 1 year old...

4k. mmr isnt indicator of experience since i dont try to climb by spaming same hero over and over, you can have coach that has great game sense and knowledge and he doesnt have super fast reaction time and mechanical skills. just like in real life coaches that have knowledge dont have to be athletes.

like i said they nerfed item that acutally required skill to be used on anything other than support, now is useless.

[Riblion]

Originally posted by Taweret:

Originally posted by Riblion:

number of hours dont mean anything, whats your mmr? your video is direct evidence why you shouldnt pick trusty shovel xddd, its also more than 1 year old...

4k. mmr isnt indicator of experience since i dont try to climb by spaming same hero over and over, you can have coach that has great game sense and knowledge and he doesnt have super fast reaction time and mechanical skills. just like in real life coaches that have knowledge dont have to be athletes.

yes i know that, but number of hours isnt indicator too since you could have stayed afk in main menu for 2k hours or play 90% of your time before neutrals were even added in the game, anyways i dont care about shovel since i have never picked it

[Fantastic Fwoosh]

what do you mean, guranteed water runes is great for bottle users.

[Taweret]

Originally posted by Fantastic Fwoosh:

what do you mean, guranteed water runes is great for bottle users.

you are right in my fury i ommited what they added instead but that makes it only more mid viable. but i dont know if this change is big enough to impact mid gameplan and justify/compensate the cooldown ticking in backpack removal, the pace in the game is much faster than in used to be long time ago, so idk if getting shovel from neutrals and using it on mid hero is relevant enough, when you are more focused on ganking, it might help a bit but is not game breaking change. it was more perfect on carry since you more likely get it early from jungle creeps.

[Artek [General]]

It's kinda lame that they nerfed but it also provided crazy value if you picked it and spammed the ♥♥♥♥ out of it. People would hold on to it even in late game because free gold is simply always good. One can argue there's an inherent issues when a Tier 1 item still sees use on minute 40.
Same reason they nerfed Philosopher's Stone actually. With these 2 items combined supports could artificially bloat their networth and keep up with the team without a single creep last hit. It was comfy, but clearly a tiny itsy bits flawed.
But only 1000 extra gold? That's nothing. You can't finish a single item with that... Urn of shadows, maybe.

[Taweret]

yes i used to spam it like a kid, now i will still probably do it even though it isnt working because "muscle memory" until i completely unlearn the swapping neutral items habit. or just simply wont pick it anymore, goodbye trusty shovel you were best friend... maybe will try on mid hero tho since the runes, hopefully it's worthwhile .

[Onkel mephisto]

The nerf hits shovel lovers hard. Overall it's still usable by anonymous bottle users aka midlaners.