Allowed to have 2 accounts?

[Crispzx]

Is *any* alt account considered smurfing and bannable? Even if such an account is at approximately the same mmr as your main one, and is never used to be toxic, cheat or abandon games?

Because according to the official valve post it wouldn’t seem like it applies to such a circumstance:
“ Smurf accounts are alternate accounts used by players to avoid playing at the correct MMR, to abandon games, to cheat, to grief, or to otherwise be toxic without consequence. ”

It is unclear to me whether this applies to any and every 2nd account any player has. Or only certain ones which are used to reduce the quality of games for other players. I’m inclined to believe that it doesn’t apply to any and every second account, as otherwise one would be left wondering why all the pro’s who have multiple accounts that are publicly known have not been banned. However I would like some official clarity on this circumstance. It would be nice if valve could be more explicit here.

[Red]

what do you expect from a company that has become lazy?

[kabanod1m #NotoToxicity]

even if you just have or have had a second steam account (or simply had somebody logged in to their account on your computer/had somebody log in to your account on their own computer) for the past 1.5 years then you get measures taken against you… but it's random and more often than not does not work

reinstalling windows often, having a dynamic IP address or just playing (even on multiple accounts and literally smurfing) in net cafes, all these factors seem to decrease the chance of getting banned as per my observations so far (one of my acquintances has had multiple accounts but was reinstalling windows often, created a new account right after reinstalling windows and played only on it since then, and he didn't get any toxic lumps of coal despite literally jumping from archons into playing with heralds)

[Crispzx]

I have a friend who plays on 2 different accounts that are both his. They are both about the same mmr, same behavior score, same communication score. He doesn’t use one to Smurf at a lower mmr, abandon or grief games, or act toxic without consequences.

He has been doing so for years, playing both accounts on the same computer. Sometimes switching between the accounts in the same Que session. Both accounts have the exact same hotkeys, user settings, played under the same IP. Point is he is not trying to hide it whatsoever and it is about the easiest possible case of multiple accounts ever for valve to catch if they were intending to punish this sort of player.

Based on the official announcement made by valve, he doesn’t believe he should be concerned. Indeed he’s been doing this for years without ever receiving any warning or account flag or anything, and is not hiding it at all. However I’m not sure he shouldn’t be concerned, as I think the rules are not being expressed clearly so I’m making this post for him.

[76561198164658792]

Not only is having multiple accounts fine it's the best way to play in my opinion.

Three accounts I think is the sweet spot. I jump between them for different game modes, streaks, and to play and behave at different behavior score levels.

There is no reason not to. It will give you a better understanding of your hot keys and you effectively become unbannable.

[☠ ௹ ☠ ௹ ☠]

Originally posted by .:

Not only is having multiple accounts fine it's the best way to play in my opinion.

Three accounts I think is the sweet spot. I jump between them for different game modes, streaks, and to play and behave at different behavior score levels.

There is no reason not to. It will give you a better understanding of your hot keys and you effectively become unbannable.

Listening to this poster will lower your behavior score and make you lose accounts

Originally posted by dicknipples:

Based on the official announcement made by valve, he doesn’t believe he should be concerned. Indeed he’s been doing this for years without ever receiving any warning or account flag or anything, and is not hiding it at all. However I’m not sure he shouldn’t be concerned, as I think the rules are not being expressed clearly so I’m making this post for him.

If he thinks he shouldnt be concerned, then that means he is incapable of reading. Might want to find a new friend that knows how to do basic reading so he doesn't bait you into bad decisions. Valve clearly articulated his type of situation = ban. IDK how more clear they can be unless someone is just incapable of reading.

[Crispzx]

Originally posted by Lesh & Me <3333:

If he thinks he shouldnt be concerned, then that means he is incapable of reading. Might want to find a new friend that knows how to do basic reading so he doesn't bait you into bad decisions. Valve clearly articulated his type of situation = ban. IDK how more clear they can be unless someone is just incapable of reading.

Would you mind posting the source for your claim. Where is it that valve has clearly articulated this? I myself have done some googling and I can’t seem to find a source for your claim. No official post from valve, don’t see it in the EULA rules etc. and the only official post by valve I see I quoted at the start of the thread what their definition of a Smurf is and it wouldn’t seem to apply to him.

[☠ ௹ ☠ ௹ ☠]

Originally posted by dicknipples:

Originally posted by Lesh & Me <3333:

If he thinks he shouldnt be concerned, then that means he is incapable of reading. Might want to find a new friend that knows how to do basic reading so he doesn't bait you into bad decisions. Valve clearly articulated his type of situation = ban. IDK how more clear they can be unless someone is just incapable of reading.

Would you mind posting the source for your claim. Where is it that valve has clearly articulated this? I myself have done some googling and I can’t seem to find a source for your claim. No official post from valve, don’t see it in the EULA rules etc. and the only official post by valve I see I quoted at the start of the thread what their definition of a Smurf is and it wouldn’t seem to apply to him.

? You admitted he made a 2nd account. As soon as that account was played in ranked, it was engaged in smurfing behavior. Just because it FINALLY is same mmr as current account, doesnt change that it was smurfing. You cant rob a bank and claim "well im not robbing it right now so i didnt rob it" doesnt work like that.......he smurfed and he will get nailed eventually for that action

[Си́нтез]

Multiple steam accounts, even with dota , activated in game list = fine (with 99% certainty)
Launching any matches or activity in dota (possibly including arcade or inventory activity) on two or more accounts = smurfing according to valve (with 80% certainty)

Exact - how, when, and why ban happens are unknown to us. All I can say is that Valve's public descriptions in blogs / support pages could be vague / outdated. To lower your chances of being banned be active in dota on only one, single account.

At least I would asnwer this question this way.

[Crispzx]

Originally posted by Lesh & Me <3333:

? You admitted he made a 2nd account. As soon as that account was played in ranked, it was engaged in smurfing behavior. Just because it FINALLY is same mmr as current account, doesnt change that it was smurfing. You cant rob a bank and claim "well im not robbing it right now so i didnt rob it" doesnt work like that.......he smurfed and he will get nailed eventually for that action

As far as I know the two accounts have never been far apart in MMR. And they’ve both been ranked similarly for several years. Anyway I’m not really trying to argue with you I’m just asking if you could point me towards any source for your claim.

[Crispzx]

Originally posted by Си́нтез:

Multiple steam accounts, even with dota , activated in game list = fine (with 99% certainty)
Launching any matches or activity in dota (possibly including arcade or inventory activity) on two or more accounts = smurfing according to valve (with 80% certainty)

Exact - how, when, and why ban happens are unknown to us. All I can say is that Valve's public descriptions in blogs / support pages could be vague / outdated. To lower your chances of being banned be active in dota on only one, single account.

At least I would asnwer this question this way.

Yes I have heard some people saying this. However I’ve yet to see anybody post a source for the claim that having any 2nd account at all is a bannable offense. I’m particularly talking about a 2nd account that is not used to lower the game quality for anybody else - namely one that is roughly the same mmr, with high behavior/comms score, 0 abandons 0 cheating. It would be nice if there is an official source for this claim.

Another way in which this is confusing is to consider that just about every pro player has alt accounts. And as far as I know, basically none of them are banned. RTZ regularly streams on different accounts for example. However if their alt accounts are publicly known, if it is against the rules and literally everybody knows about it, why are they not banned?

[no154370]

Originally posted by dicknipples:

Originally posted by Си́нтез:

Multiple steam accounts, even with dota , activated in game list = fine (with 99% certainty)
Launching any matches or activity in dota (possibly including arcade or inventory activity) on two or more accounts = smurfing according to valve (with 80% certainty)

Exact - how, when, and why ban happens are unknown to us. All I can say is that Valve's public descriptions in blogs / support pages could be vague / outdated. To lower your chances of being banned be active in dota on only one, single account.

At least I would asnwer this question this way.

Yes I have heard some people saying this. However I’ve yet to see anybody post a source for the claim that having any 2nd account at all is a bannable offense. I’m particularly talking about a 2nd account that is not used to lower the game quality for anybody else - namely one that is roughly the same mmr, with high behavior/comms score, 0 abandons 0 cheating. It would be nice if there is an official source for this claim.

Another way in which this is confusing is to consider that just about every pro player has alt accounts. And as far as I know, basically none of them are banned. RTZ regularly streams on different accounts for example. However if their alt accounts are publicly known, if it is against the rules and literally everybody knows about it, why are they not banned?

because it is all over the news already.

did you even bother to read the 15th December 2023 Frostivus dota 2 update??????

did you even bother to do a research on it before making such a thread?????

----------------------------------------------------

pro players Smurf Dota 2 Accounts are already Permanently banned forever.

https://esports.gg/news/dota-2/dota-2-pro-smurf-banned/

----------------------------------------------------

this is written

On the other hand, if you’re on the Naughty List, we’ve got great news for everybody else and bad news for you, because this year is gonna be a bloodbath. You might remember back in September, we got out the ban hammer and permanently banned 90,000 smurf accounts. Since then, we've continued to invest in player behavior monitoring, on both the manual and automatic analysis fronts. Over the last few weeks, we've engaged in an even more aggressive ban wave, including many tens of thousands of smurf account bans today alone.

At The International, some pro players reached out to us to talk about their smurf accounts. Those conversations have continued, and there’s broad agreement amongst pros that banning pro smurf accounts is a win for Dota as a community: The rules should apply to everybody, and from now on they will. And smurfing isn’t even the only naughty thing players are getting up to. Amongst other questionable choices, some bad actors are playing like jerks, ruining games and losing behavior score because of it, then hiring behavior score farmers to drive it back up.


Regardless of how you’ve been naughty, we've been watching you (not while you're sleeping, calm down) and we’re cracking down on all of it. Punishments will be handed out for all of the above, including behavior score penalties — and in serious cases, main account bannings.

As we’ve said before, smurfing (and other negative behavior) makes matches worse, and we want to make sure your matches are as good as possible as we head into the new year. So we’d like to wish everyone a Happy Frostivus Update! Except smurf accounts, who we assume will not enjoy the update as they choke on their richly-deserved coal-flavored just desserts.

from here

https://www.dota2.com/newsentry/3884981125532748791

pros players already made a joint statement to show PROFESSIONALISM by agreeing to let their Smurf Dota 2 Accounts be PERMANENTLY BAN

[Си́нтез]

Originally posted by dicknipples:

Originally posted by Си́нтез:

Multiple steam accounts, even with dota , activated in game list = fine (with 99% certainty)
Launching any matches or activity in dota (possibly including arcade or inventory activity) on two or more accounts = smurfing according to valve (with 80% certainty)

Exact - how, when, and why ban happens are unknown to us. All I can say is that Valve's public descriptions in blogs / support pages could be vague / outdated. To lower your chances of being banned be active in dota on only one, single account.

At least I would asnwer this question this way.

Yes I have heard some people saying this. However I’ve yet to see anybody post a source for the claim that having any 2nd account at all is a bannable offense. I’m particularly talking about a 2nd account that is not used to lower the game quality for anybody else - namely one that is roughly the same mmr, with high behavior/comms score, 0 abandons 0 cheating. It would be nice if there is an official source for this claim.

Another way in which this is confusing is to consider that just about every pro player has alt accounts. And as far as I know, basically none of them are banned. RTZ regularly streams on different accounts for example. However if their alt accounts are publicly known, if it is against the rules and literally everybody knows about it, why are they not banned?

Valve won't share specifics as it would provide information for those people who are being targeted how to evade bans. Pro players might as well be partially exempt from some policies but not the other. Again we don't know specifics. Some family gets flagged because of siblings, some people keep using multiple accounts. Don't look at any of us since we can't know specifics of how each individual ban is handled and why

[Си́нтез]

Originally posted by dicknipples:

I’m particularly talking about a 2nd account that is not used to lower the game quality for anybody else - namely one that is roughly the same mmr,

How do we know that btw? Dota players notoriously claim that x is ruining the game and still do the y and another player says y is ruining the game for me but x is totally fine and the other player claims abc should be bannable. There is no consensus in dota community and it could have partially being spilled into valve.

Another player may look at you and instantly claim you are the worst player they encountered and ruin the game on purpose, another player may say you are doing great.

For me smurfs are totally fine, if they are in my matches, some people claim it is "impossible to play" because of them etc

[no154370]

Originally posted by no154370:

Originally posted by dicknipples:

Yes I have heard some people saying this. However I’ve yet to see anybody post a source for the claim that having any 2nd account at all is a bannable offense. I’m particularly talking about a 2nd account that is not used to lower the game quality for anybody else - namely one that is roughly the same mmr, with high behavior/comms score, 0 abandons 0 cheating. It would be nice if there is an official source for this claim.

Another way in which this is confusing is to consider that just about every pro player has alt accounts. And as far as I know, basically none of them are banned. RTZ regularly streams on different accounts for example. However if their alt accounts are publicly known, if it is against the rules and literally everybody knows about it, why are they not banned?

because it is all over the news already.

did you even bother to read the 15th December 2023 Frostivus dota 2 update??????

did you even bother to do a research on it before making such a thread?????

----------------------------------------------------

pro players Smurf Dota 2 Accounts are already Permanently banned forever.

https://esports.gg/news/dota-2/dota-2-pro-smurf-banned/

----------------------------------------------------

this is written

On the other hand, if you’re on the Naughty List, we’ve got great news for everybody else and bad news for you, because this year is gonna be a bloodbath. You might remember back in September, we got out the ban hammer and permanently banned 90,000 smurf accounts. Since then, we've continued to invest in player behavior monitoring, on both the manual and automatic analysis fronts. Over the last few weeks, we've engaged in an even more aggressive ban wave, including many tens of thousands of smurf account bans today alone.

At The International, some pro players reached out to us to talk about their smurf accounts. Those conversations have continued, and there’s broad agreement amongst pros that banning pro smurf accounts is a win for Dota as a community: The rules should apply to everybody, and from now on they will. And smurfing isn’t even the only naughty thing players are getting up to. Amongst other questionable choices, some bad actors are playing like jerks, ruining games and losing behavior score because of it, then hiring behavior score farmers to drive it back up.


Regardless of how you’ve been naughty, we've been watching you (not while you're sleeping, calm down) and we’re cracking down on all of it. Punishments will be handed out for all of the above, including behavior score penalties — and in serious cases, main account bannings.

As we’ve said before, smurfing (and other negative behavior) makes matches worse, and we want to make sure your matches are as good as possible as we head into the new year. So we’d like to wish everyone a Happy Frostivus Update! Except smurf accounts, who we assume will not enjoy the update as they choke on their richly-deserved coal-flavored just desserts.

from here

https://www.dota2.com/newsentry/3884981125532748791

pros players already made a joint statement to show PROFESSIONALISM by agreeing to let their Smurf Dota 2 Accounts be PERMANENTLY BAN

this post of mine which i'm quoting is the answer to this thread.

anyone who reply after me, they are completely ignorant of the 15th December dota 2 update

and spreading MISINFORMATION.

[JOJO]

eat chocolate