Thoughts on Bloodthorn?

[SUPER IDOL DE XIAO RONG]

Really, in my opinion. It's extremely ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ powerful. 1.35x crit applies ON ALLIES TOO. Why not just nerf it down to the wielder to? Literally puts phantom assassin to ♥♥♥♥. The items to build it are extremely easy to build.

[SUPER IDOL DE XIAO RONG]

Publicado originalmente por The Ultra Creep:

People are failing to see that building bloodthorn is not as simple as 7.3k gold. It begins with building orchids first or crystalis-vice versa which can be somewhat always relevent and dont understand the concept of item progression. The transition into Bloodthorn is much easier than people believe.

yeah this is what I mean

[Terminal Velocity]

But the individual items that make the bloodthorn are really low cost. So it's easily farmable unless your team is doing really bad.

[Terminal Velocity]

This is my first attempt at building it and it came so easy:

http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2326639482

[Vlad Crepeș]

People please. Despite bloodthorn being so expensive its ridiculously easy to built into.
Oblivion staff is 1650 gold each. Not too hard to farm up considering it also comes in pieces. Crystalis also comes in rather easily farmable pieces. Its really easy to build into it just.

[Thebirdofhermes]

Pretty easy to counter it you just buy euls,manta,bkb,ghost scepter or gaurdian greaves

[J_A_P_G]

Publicado originalmente por Thebirdofhermes:

Pretty easy to counter it you just buy euls,manta,bkb,ghost scepter or gaurdian greaves

Yeah. 7k gold item countered by a 3k gold one (euls).

[mooles mun]

Publicado originalmente por The Ultra Creep:

People are failing to see that building bloodthorn is not as simple as 7.3k gold. It begins with building orchids first or crystalis-vice versa which can be somewhat always relevent and dont understand the concept of item progression. The transition into Bloodthorn is much easier than people believe.

The strongest part about Bloodthorn is the allied crit, which isn't part of either of its components.

Publicado originalmente por Bazookagofer:

People please. Despite bloodthorn being so expensive its ridiculously easy to built into.
Oblivion staff is 1650 gold each. Not too hard to farm up considering it also comes in pieces. Crystalis also comes in rather easily farmable pieces. Its really easy to build into it just.

Just because it's easy to build into doesn't mean you should. So is Dagon, but that doesn't always mean buying it and then upgrading to 5 is the best option.

Publicado originalmente por Dat 900mmr guy:

This is my first attempt at building it and it came so easy:

http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2326639482

Your team was winning pretty hard though, and (no offense) but I don't think a single 1.3k average MMR game means much

[Terminal Velocity]

Winning? I was the Dire, the BH.
Anyway I'm not complaining about the item abilities or stats, I'm just saying it comes too easy to build, considering all its components are really low price. For high end items you need to farm and hold med-to-high amount of gold before you can buy some of their most costly components.
Not with the bloodthorne. So the 7k price is mitigated by the fact it's "easier" to build.

[A Street Sweeper]

Publicado originalmente por mooles mun:

Your team was winning pretty hard though, and (no offense) but I don't think a single 1.3k average MMR game means much

Also, he got it at minute 30 with nothing other than phase boots. I'm not convinced this is worth.

It seems like a powerful item overall, but it's hardly imbalanced. Even on Clinkz, I'd rather just get a deso. You 3 shot most squishy heroes anyway and it's better in longer fights.

[The Coal Man]

Publicado originalmente por Dat 900mmr guy:

Winning? I was the Dire, the BH.
Anyway I'm not complaining about the item abilities or stats, I'm just saying it comes too easy to build, considering all its components are really low price. For high end items you need to farm and hold med-to-high amount of gold before you can buy some of their most costly components.
Not with the bloodthorne. So the 7k price is mitigated by the fact it's "easier" to build.

plus you get the majority of its benfits before its done. If you need the silence part first you go orchid, if you need the damage you go daed. Its not like radiance where you get a relic and a recipe, the parts are also good, there is no weak gap while building it. The only unique part is the truestrike and team crit, which while being strong isnt exactly worth 7.2k anyway.

[Terminal Velocity]

Publicado originalmente por Dr Taco Monster:

Publicado originalmente por mooles mun:

Your team was winning pretty hard though, and (no offense) but I don't think a single 1.3k average MMR game means much

Also, he got it at minute 30 with nothing other than phase boots. I'm not convinced this is worth.

It seems like a powerful item overall, but it's hardly imbalanced. Even on Clinkz, I'd rather just get a deso. You 3 shot most squishy heroes anyway and it's better in longer fights.

Yup, the gameplan was I was going to solo bot, but the DK took it, so I went into roaming mode. I got fed with several early game kills, so I decided to go Orchid for everyone but the Slark.
When I finally built the Orchid I thought it'd be a good test to try the new item.

Especially because I considered the game to be lost by that point.

[Immaculatebacon]

Personally, I think a bit longer cooldown would be reasonable.

[Chubblezap]

Pretty generic buff to multi-unit carries like Meepo and PL as well as some others like Clinkz, and a vastly overestimated one at that. It's 7k gold, you won't see it early, and it's appropriately powerful for such a lategame item.

[Sky Marshall Sanders]

Publicado originalmente por Dat 900mmr guy:

But the individual items that make the bloodthorn are really low cost. So it's easily farmable unless your team is doing really bad.

Bloodthorne is really great for the handful of heroes that want all the components. But if you aren't an invoker, a qop, or a clinkz it will probably involve a detour in your build. There are easier ways to negate evasion. The buff to attack damage is nice, but not as much as a daedalus for the actual item user and it is not the kind of item you get on a support.

[Terminal Velocity]

Publicado originalmente por Sky Marshall Sanders:

Publicado originalmente por Dat 900mmr guy:

But the individual items that make the bloodthorn are really low cost. So it's easily farmable unless your team is doing really bad.

Bloodthorne is really great for the handful of heroes that want all the components. But if you aren't an invoker, a qop, or a clinkz it will probably involve a detour in your build. There are easier ways to negate evasion. The buff to attack damage is nice, but not as much as a daedalus for the actual item user and it is not the kind of item you get on a support.

Yes, I agree, it's just a jack-of-all-trades-master-of-none item. The only highlights which makes it better is, IMHO

1. The low cooldown
2. The team crit + 30% damage which could help take down tanks.