Kinda disappointed in the new patch

[Hugosz]

I was hoping the patch would make the game feel fresh again however 90% of the changes were "you get 5 mana off a skill!" "You get 1 attack" "These two abilities in the tree are swapped" "This skill deals 5 more dmg!" Not really stuff that gets my blood pumping. The only heroes that got any significant changes are Silencer, Brood, Clinkz, Axe and Tinker( and maybe underlord but its not like you can use lt effectively in solo q). If you don't play these heroes almost nothing changed. New neutrals are kind of meh. Dawnbreaker got scepter/shard bit I've seen maybe 1 in my last 30 games and it's still even up for debate should you build it.
You guys happy with the patch ?

[Deepbluediver]

I don't think it's Valve's goal to entirely remake the game every patch- that tends to screw up balance and upset people who put a lot of time and effort into mastering the previous meta.

So Valve ends up stuck between one group of people who say "they changed it, now it sucks!" and another group of people complaining "they didn't change enough- I'm bored!". It's impossible for them to please everyone.

[鐚檸檬]

Honestly, arguing over who gets what neutral item is becoming a real pain in the butt.
Excessive amount of learning from random dropped items, and people getting upset for not getting their ideal neutral item that leads to childish throws is irritating.
It's like Valve is trying to test how much RNG and how much information we can endure to fight against this random-madness when we already have 100+ heroes and 100+ items (excluding the neutrals)
Now talking about 7.30 hero balance, why did they give Tinker unnecessary buff when the hero was already strong in 7.29.
Man, "if" I was on the developer-side adjusting future patches, I'd be tormented with how much information inflation that has happened to DOTA2.
There's been a lot of addition made to the game, but not enough subtraction to appear clean as a refined product.

[Water Ｖａｐｏｒ Merchant]

BitterLemons původně napsal:

Honestly, arguing over who gets what neutral item is becoming a real pain in the butt.
Excessive amount of learning from random dropped items, and people getting upset for not getting their ideal neutral item that leads to childish throws is irritating.
It's like Valve is trying to test how much RNG and how much information we can endure to fight against this random-madness when we already have 100+ heroes and 100+ items (excluding the neutrals)
Now talking about 7.30 hero balance, why did they give Tinker unnecessary buff when the hero was already strong in 7.29.
Man, "if" I was on the developer-side adjusting future patches, I'd be tormented with how much information inflation that has happened to DOTA2.
There's been a lot of addition made to the game, but not enough subtraction to appear clean as a refined product.

Tinker didn't really get buffed so much as destroying his ability to play Pos 2 in exchange for vastly improving his ability to be a Pos 4. I'm still on the fence with it, it seems like it'd be good, but he's such a squishy hero it's hard to both make up for your mana problems and simultaneously tank up, and you get focused most of the time. I'm wondering if I should just ignore trying to use Laser at all in fights and just go ham on the Rockets.

[鐚檸檬]

I don't think Tinker was destroyed as pos-2.
All he really needs is his Laser to win the last hits.
He's a squishy hero, but that's normal and natural for an intelligence hero right?
With his new teleporting skill, he doesn't have the necessity to purchase boots of travel, which is a huge discount to his future item purchase.
You must surely know how annoying it is to face a tinker that hex's you forever & ever, and that kind of build is easier to access when he doesn't have to waste 2500 on boots.
He's still viable with Laser and Missiles, and March is still available with Shard.
The change is going to be his style of playing hunting instead of farming, with short-cut access to annoying items even faster.
Yeah, I'm partially theory crafting, but people were satisfied with 7.29 Tinker.
I don't understand the change on him at all.

[:D]

BitterLemons původně napsal:

I don't think Tinker was destroyed as pos-2.
All he really needs is his Laser to win the last hits.
He's a squishy hero, but that's normal and natural for an intelligence hero right?
With his new teleporting skill, he doesn't have the necessity to purchase boots of travel, which is a huge discount to his future item purchase.
You must surely know how annoying it is to face a tinker that hex's you forever & ever, and that kind of build is easier to access when he doesn't have to waste 2500 on boots.
He's still viable with Laser and Missiles, and March is still available with Shard.
The change is going to be his style of playing hunting instead of farming, with short-cut access to annoying items even faster.
Yeah, I'm partially theory crafting, but people were satisfied with 7.29 Tinker.
I don't understand the change on him at all.

ive seen tinker pos 5 and pos 4 today. is he becoming a support ?

[Water Ｖａｐｏｒ Merchant]

BitterLemons původně napsal:

I don't think Tinker was destroyed as pos-2.
All he really needs is his Laser to win the last hits.
He's a squishy hero, but that's normal and natural for an intelligence hero right?
With his new teleporting skill, he doesn't have the necessity to purchase boots of travel, which is a huge discount to his future item purchase.
You must surely know how annoying it is to face a tinker that hex's you forever & ever, and that kind of build is easier to access when he doesn't have to waste 2500 on boots.
He's still viable with Laser and Missiles, and March is still available with Shard.
The change is going to be his style of playing hunting instead of farming, with short-cut access to annoying items even faster.
Yeah, I'm partially theory crafting, but people were satisfied with 7.29 Tinker.
I don't understand the change on him at all.

Prior to minute 20 he has no reliable way to farm en masse, he can only secure ranged creeps. That's 20 minutes of missing out on snowballing, the enemy will be way ahead on items and levels by that point. That's why he can't really pull off Pos 2 anymore, he can't clear the mid lane quickly enough to really pressure the enemy T1 mid tower, and he loses the right click game hard. Most mid heroes also have some sort of disable, and it's super easy to read his Rearm ability at level 1 because it takes a whole 3 and half seconds to complete, allowing them to interrupt it and stop him from getting off another volley of rockets and laser.

[Hugosz]

Deepbluediver původně napsal:

I don't think it's Valve's goal to entirely remake the game every patch- that tends to screw up balance and upset people who put a lot of time and effort into mastering the previous meta.

So Valve ends up stuck between one group of people who say "they changed it, now it sucks!" and another group of people complaining "they didn't change enough- I'm bored!". It's impossible for them to please everyone.

I'm not expecting them to remake the game but I get the feeling most of these changes are there to artificially inflate the patch notes. It's a way of saying "oh look how many things changed" while in reality not much did. Keep your 1 dmg valve. Seer got a wall of changes but every single one of them is so tiny they don't even add up to a moderate change. It really annoys me.

[Absche]

Hugosz původně napsal:

Deepbluediver původně napsal:

I don't think it's Valve's goal to entirely remake the game every patch- that tends to screw up balance and upset people who put a lot of time and effort into mastering the previous meta.

So Valve ends up stuck between one group of people who say "they changed it, now it sucks!" and another group of people complaining "they didn't change enough- I'm bored!". It's impossible for them to please everyone.

I'm not expecting them to remake the game but I get the feeling most of these changes are there to artificially inflate the patch notes. It's a way of saying "oh look how many things changed" while in reality not much did. Keep your 1 dmg valve. Seer got a wall of changes but every single one of them is so tiny they don't even add up to a moderate change. It really annoys me.

Yes, I would expect them to be more courageous with their main patches. I guess it is a „never change a winning team“ attitude.

[☠ ௹ ☠ ௹ ☠]

Hugosz původně napsal:

Deepbluediver původně napsal:

I don't think it's Valve's goal to entirely remake the game every patch- that tends to screw up balance and upset people who put a lot of time and effort into mastering the previous meta.

So Valve ends up stuck between one group of people who say "they changed it, now it sucks!" and another group of people complaining "they didn't change enough- I'm bored!". It's impossible for them to please everyone.

I'm not expecting them to remake the game but I get the feeling most of these changes are there to artificially inflate the patch notes. It's a way of saying "oh look how many things changed" while in reality not much did. Keep your 1 dmg valve. Seer got a wall of changes but every single one of them is so tiny they don't even add up to a moderate change. It really annoys me.

So you wish valve fundamentally changed the game RIGHT BEFORE the main tournament? I thought valve's dev team was bad, but now I see they could have even worse devs that think like you. Your original post proves you have no thought outside of I NEED NEW PATCH OMG OMG OMG IM A BAD PLAYER AND I NEED SOMETHING NEW TO MAKE ME GOOD OMG OMG OMG. Id assume from your comments you are under 2k mmr.....probably why valve doesnt change the game to make you happy

[Absche]

6lood&9ore původně napsal:

Hugosz původně napsal:

I'm not expecting them to remake the game but I get the feeling most of these changes are there to artificially inflate the patch notes. It's a way of saying "oh look how many things changed" while in reality not much did. Keep your 1 dmg valve. Seer got a wall of changes but every single one of them is so tiny they don't even add up to a moderate change. It really annoys me.

So you wish valve fundamentally changed the game RIGHT BEFORE the main tournament? I thought valve's dev team was bad, but now I see they could have even worse devs that think like you. Your original post proves you have no thought outside of I NEED NEW PATCH OMG OMG OMG IM A BAD PLAYER AND I NEED SOMETHING NEW TO MAKE ME GOOD OMG OMG OMG. Id assume from your comments you are under 2k mmr.....probably why valve doesnt change the game to make you happy

Why then doing a main patch just before TI anyway? What I really miss is that they don’t offer the community to test and check the patches in a test server and ask for feed-back before the patch is going life on the main servers.

[☠ ௹ ☠ ௹ ☠]

Absche původně napsal:

6lood&9ore původně napsal:

So you wish valve fundamentally changed the game RIGHT BEFORE the main tournament? I thought valve's dev team was bad, but now I see they could have even worse devs that think like you. Your original post proves you have no thought outside of I NEED NEW PATCH OMG OMG OMG IM A BAD PLAYER AND I NEED SOMETHING NEW TO MAKE ME GOOD OMG OMG OMG. Id assume from your comments you are under 2k mmr.....probably why valve doesnt change the game to make you happy

Why then doing a main patch just before TI anyway? What I really miss is that they don’t offer the community to test and check the patches in a test server and ask for feed-back before the patch is going life on the main servers.

Um because 90% of the player base is bad at the game. Why would they want the feedback of 90% of players that don't even know how to properly play the game? Sounds like a waste of time.

And the patch was implemented for several reasons like making sure TI isn't a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ Brood Mother and TA contest. Or making sure the game isn't secured by 2nd roshan. The changes to tinker and clinkz, in my opinion, should have happened after TI because they are fundamental changes to the heroes, but valve apparently gave a little to everyone. Players like OP got fundamental changes to a few heroes that probably wouldnt of seen TI play otherwise + fundamental changes to the heroes that would have been first phase picked or banned every game at TI, and players like me got consistency through a tournament cycle and are happy that the patch changed the heroes very little overall (as OP pointed out with the 5 mana here and there stuff).

[Djej Funny]

I mean all it did was bring back the split push meta with helm of the overlord so really expect to see beastmasters and lycans everywhere

[☠ ௹ ☠ ௹ ☠]

Djej původně napsal:

I mean all it did was bring back the split push meta with helm of the overlord so really expect to see beastmasters and lycans everywhere

Neither were being picked before and 7.3a could drop nerfing ancient creeps or the helm if it is broken. And zoo meta has a lot of counters now compared to prior years....grimstroke, mars, snap, and hoodwink all provide options for defeating a zoo strat while void spirit has a workable kit as well. And the new clinkz spell also makes clinkz better against zoo than prior patches. I'm not convince helm is broken, but time will tell

[Metatron]

Bye bye miss american bye

[u techies i throw]

Chill, patch will come soon