Suggestion Dragon Lance and Hurricane Pike to also work on melee

[chessboxer]

Hello

why these 2 items are not working on melee heroes
should be working on all heroes
except broom handle there should be more options to increase melee range for melee heroes - with Dragon Lance, then player will decide if he also needs force staff upgrade

[Postal Dude of Cykaland]

Because the range dragon lance gives you is busted. Not to mention Pike would be even more stupid.
Could you imagine a fully kitted Anti-Mage or Ursa with Pike?

[Duchess Minty]

There's a reason that broom handle is the first and only range extender for melee heroes, look back at how many complaints there were about Monkey King having even slightly more range than other melee heroes.

[chessboxer]

Then what is logic of having sniper use lance or pike and extend range even more
Why should there be no option for melee heroes to purchase extend range
It will cost 1 item slot: for example in late game this item could be a waste of item slot on Ursa or other heroes because it is not as powerful as some late game items.
There should be that option for some versatility. Item like broom handle drops randomly and it is limited to 1 per team. No other hero has option to increase melee range for some gameplay type.

The lance item does not provide too much benefit except a slight range increase. Would be good to also work on melee heroes with the force staff as pike.

Could be balanced for Melee / Range separately (Example: 50 for Melee / 100 for Range)
Since range heroes have several combinations to extend range - telescope / bow + lance/pike
for spells you have telescope / optic + lens
so should melee heroes have the broom + lance for some range increase

[Postal Dude of Cykaland]

Originally posted by chessboxing:

then what is logic oh having sniper use lance or pike and extend range even more
why should there be no option for melee heroes to purchase extend range
It will cost 1 item slot: also in late game this item would be a waste of item slot on ursa or other heroes so it is not that powerful as some late game items
there should be that option for some versatility
the item does not provide too much benefit except a slight range increase
could be balanced for Melee / Range separately (Example: 50 for Melee / 100 for Range)
Since range heroes have several combinations to extend range - telescope / bow + lance/pike
for spells you have telescope / optic + lens
so should melee heroes have the broom + lance for some range increase

Because melee heroes are balanced around being up close, whether having a gap closer (IE PA or Void), some sort of other forms of mobility (IE Brood web speed increase) or some sort of long range crowd control.
Play ability draft, draft melee abilities on range heroes (Or hell, just do it on monkey king) and see what happens.

[chessboxer]

Currently Dragon lance is an item that it useless on melee heroes (it provides 140 range only to ranged heroes).
And this could be improved by providing slight range increase to melee heroes as well like 50 range (probably 100 or 140 would be too much as mentioned in the previous posts).

Another issue is that the ability of the Pike (on enemy heroes) does not work the same on melee heroes since they do not attack from range. It is more a push to escape ability that can also be useful. For melee heroes the force staff ability (on enemy heroes )also very useful - but there is no option to use it if you upgrade to Pike.
Maybe an option to separate both abilities when used on enemy heroes - 1 option to push back / 1 option to force in direction - for Pike item would allow combining lance and force staff and have different options for use. I guess this could be done by enabling some abilities similar to Aghanim or toggle option on the item (for example as the Radiance item toggle).

[Duchess Minty]

Originally posted by chessboxing:

Currently Dragon lance is an item that it useless on melee heroes.

Because it's not meant for melee heroes similarly to how battlefury isn't meant for ranged heroes. Instead of trying to justify yourself purchasing dragon lance on melee heroes there are better items for them.

[chessboxer]

Thats fine that some items work better on ranged or melee, but if this is so why is it Lance and not some bow for example then? Lance is a melee weapon and it is a long weapon so its logical to work also on melee heroes as well.
What is the problem to add 50 or 70 range to an item that can be used by all heroes. It is not logical to not have such option in the whole game except finding that random neutral item and at the same time ranged heroes have that extra range option.

[Zagryzaec]

Originally posted by chessboxing:

Then what is logic of having sniper use lance or pike and extend range even more
Why should there be no option for melee heroes to purchase extend range
It will cost 1 item slot: for example in late game this item could be a waste of item slot on Ursa or other heroes because it is not as powerful as some late game items.
There should be that option for some versatility. Item like broom handle drops randomly and it is limited to 1 per team. No other hero has option to increase melee range for some gameplay type.

The lance item does not provide too much benefit except a slight range increase. Would be good to also work on melee heroes with the force staff as pike.

Could be balanced for Melee / Range separately (Example: 50 for Melee / 100 for Range)
Since range heroes have several combinations to extend range - telescope / bow + lance/pike
for spells you have telescope / optic + lens
so should melee heroes have the broom + lance for some range increase

because they are meelee. not ranged

[Duchess Minty]

Originally posted by chessboxing:

It is not logical to not have such option in the whole game except finding that random neutral item and at the same time ranged heroes have that extra range option.

Nothing has to make sense in a real world perspective, especially considering the ingame universe is shaped by and taken care of by beetles.

[zouzoune]

Imagine Monkey King wih Broomhandle + Dragon lance + Vengefull aura. Basicly a ranged hero.

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ursa

[Postal Dude of Cykaland]

Why do you want the items on melee heroes anyway? I think Lance, Pike and a few neutral items are the only ones that majorly benefit ranged heroes while melee heroes have a ton of items already

[Postal Dude of Cykaland]

Originally posted by chessboxing:

Thats fine that some items work better on ranged or melee, but if this is so why is it Lance and not some bow for example then? Lance is a melee weapon and it is a long weapon so its logical to work also on melee heroes as well.
What is the problem to add 50 or 70 range to an item that can be used by all heroes. It is not logical to not have such option in the whole game except finding that random neutral item and at the same time ranged heroes have that extra range option.

Trying to apply logic to items is going to make your head hurt.

[chessboxer]

The suggestion is to have option to buy this range increasing item also for melee heroes.
Since range heroes can buy that option there is no logic for it not to work on melee heroes with some balance change for example:
+140 for range and +70 for melee

I don't think that this will lead to purchasing this item every game for melee heroes as it requires a slot and it provides only 10 strength and 12 agility.
But as for ranged heroes dragon lance / pike is used almost all games for many ranged heroes.
Since force staff is very often necessary for melee heroes as well - dragon lance upgrade could also provide a little more range.