BLOCKING JUNGLE WITH WARD

[YUℝℕEℝ0]

There are times when 1 of our teammates rage and trying to feed but not really feeding them,in fact they block our jungle with sentry or obs,how can we destroy our own ward in order for us to farm in our jungle? pls help..THIS IS SEA BTW

[SiEgE]

Publicado originalmente por Miaou:

Publicado originalmente por SiEgE:

You better not do that. That is a pro move that only people you'd play in team would recognize. Otherwise - never do that.

I will keep doing it if it is one of my few chances to stop a hero from snowballing especially the 2 radiant and dire side mid camps which are often chain farmed by a dominating mid.

Any success stories of that actually helping the situation and your team actually starting to fight back? Without you being reported into oblivion, while at it?

I'm not trying to say it will not work. All I mean is that this is very, very dangerous, and may cause a 9 player report.

[Ulthwé]

Publicado originalmente por SiEgE:

Publicado originalmente por Miaou:

I will keep doing it if it is one of my few chances to stop a hero from snowballing especially the 2 radiant and dire side mid camps which are often chain farmed by a dominating mid.

Any success stories of that actually helping the situation and your team actually starting to fight back? Without you being reported into oblivion, while at it?

I can't remember because I play 100 hours a week, a precise game is way too much to ask from me. But I know it helped sometimes, especially these two mid side camps. I've never been reported into oblivion since ages.

[Ulthwé]

Publicado originalmente por SGT_pawn:

Publicado originalmente por Miaou:

I can't remember because I play 100 hours a week.

You might need a shower.

You can keep your contempt for yourself.

[MyName is JUNE]

Publicado originalmente por Miaou:

Publicado originalmente por SiEgE:

Any success stories of that actually helping the situation and your team actually starting to fight back? Without you being reported into oblivion, while at it?

I can't remember because I play 100 hours a week, a precise game is way too much to ask from me. But I know it helped sometimes, especially these two mid side camps. I've never been reported into oblivion since ages.

you need to rest man!!!!! 100 hours a week is too much.

[Sotj]

Publicado originalmente por Miaou:

I do block ally camps sometimes. Especially against brood, am, Naga. Because my team doesn't protect these camps 3/4 of the time this farm goes to an enemy. Still they will find a way to blame you whereas you prevented an early radiance on Naga or Brood taking mid rax at minute 20. People blame me for these blocks but I know what I'm doing. Since then I must say I don't always trust people who say it was wars griefing. And a last thing, to carry players, if you think you farming to maybe win the late game fail most of the time because you will never outfarm a team that controls the map, and you leave your team alone during team right including teamfights under t3 or t4

They shouldn't get into fight if they cannot handle it without carry, they should just stay behind towers and def until team is ready to fight.

[Ulthwé]

Publicado originalmente por Sotj:

Publicado originalmente por Miaou:

I do block ally camps sometimes. Especially against brood, am, Naga. Because my team doesn't protect these camps 3/4 of the time this farm goes to an enemy. Still they will find a way to blame you whereas you prevented an early radiance on Naga or Brood taking mid rax at minute 20. People blame me for these blocks but I know what I'm doing. Since then I must say I don't always trust people who say it was wars griefing. And a last thing, to carry players, if you think you farming to maybe win the late game fail most of the time because you will never outfarm a team that controls the map, and you leave your team alone during team right including teamfights under t3 or t4

They shouldn't get into fight if they cannot handle it without carry, they should just stay behind towers and def until team is ready to fight.

Except there are no towers anymore, they fall one after the another, you don't seem to understand the consequences of playing 4v5 during 20 minutes. If they can't fight, they can't even see, except maybe the t4 for some minute but that's all.

[Sotj]

Publicado originalmente por Miaou:

Publicado originalmente por Sotj:

They shouldn't get into fight if they cannot handle it without carry, they should just stay behind towers and def until team is ready to fight.

Except there are no towers anymore, they fall one after the another, you don't seem to understand the consequences of playing 4v5 during 20 minutes. If they can't fight, they can't even see, except maybe the t4 for some minute but that's all.

Then wait in base or healing pool. I understand this game just fine I been playing it since first dota1 betas.

[Ulthwé]

Publicado originalmente por Sotj:

Publicado originalmente por Miaou:

Except there are no towers anymore, they fall one after the another, you don't seem to understand the consequences of playing 4v5 during 20 minutes. If they can't fight, they can't even see, except maybe the t4 for some minute but that's all.

Then wait in base or healing pool. I understand this game just fine I been playing it since first dota1 betas.

No you don't understand anything if you think you should always back off expecting for the magical comeback from your carry who is farming half the map away if when your barracks are falling.

[tom]

Publicado originalmente por Yoshino Himekawa:

As frustrating as it is when a salty teammate blocks your own camps because 'stop farming n00b', I can't think of any solution that wouldn't just replace it with new forms of abuse. Allowing players to freely deny ally wards would just create an even worse form of trolling; bad carries would deny valid wards to 'punish' the support for not placing wards exactly where they want. The obvious solution would be to make ally wards deniable if they're blocking a camp, but even that has problems. Blocking camps in the enemy jungle is almost always good, and blocking camps in the ally jungle is almost always bad, but there are exceptions. The biggest one is the large camp near the T1 side lanes. Which team wants to pull, and which team wants to block, depends entirely on where the lane equilibrium is. If the lane is pushing out, you want to pull it, and if it's pushing in, you want to block it, REGARDLESS of whether you are playing offlane or safelane.

This could create a problem even worse than ally camp blocking. As it stands, someone who blocks ally camps is blatantly in the wrong, and will likely be reported by his whole team. However, if ally wards can be denied, that could create a conflict over the large camp; where one player thinks it should be blocked, and the other player thinks it should be stacked / pulled. This would result in a player conflict EVEN THOUGH BOTH PLAYERS ARE TRYING TO WIN, which is far more insidiously disruptive to teamplay than trolling, as neither player is 'wrong'.

Remember, if someone wants to throw, they are going to find a way to do so, no matter what barriers you put in their path. However, trying too hard to patch trolling will either create new forms of trolling (which doesn't fix anything), restrict legitimate play (which is absurd; games shouldn't be balanced around the assumption that one of the players might throw a hissy fit), or create new forms of conflict (the worst of all, as it can cause two legit players to fight).

this.
there is no way to prevent trolling witouth ruining the game.
if someone wants to troll, he'll find a way.

[Sotj]

Publicado originalmente por Miaou:

Publicado originalmente por Sotj:

Then wait in base or healing pool. I understand this game just fine I been playing it since first dota1 betas.

No you don't understand anything if you think you should always back off expecting for the magical comeback from your carry who is farming half the map away if when your barracks are falling.

if carry is just farming while raxes go down, and wont counter attack or def, then it's pretty much done, just take the loss and go next game.

[Ulthwé]

Publicado originalmente por Sotj:

Publicado originalmente por Miaou:

No you don't understand anything if you think you should always back off expecting for the magical comeback from your carry who is farming half the map away if when your barracks are falling.

if carry is just farming while raxes go down, and wont counter attack or def, then it's pretty much done, just take the loss and go next game.

Thx for these advice I never needed. It's already over if he doesn't come do def t2 most of the time anyway. Why do you even comment in the first place when I said blocking camp could be a strategy for the losing team?

[Sotj]

Publicado originalmente por Miaou:

Publicado originalmente por Sotj:

if carry is just farming while raxes go down, and wont counter attack or def, then it's pretty much done, just take the loss and go next game.

Thx for these advice I never needed. It's already over if he doesn't come do def t2 most of the time anyway. Why do you even comment in the first place when I said blocking camp could be a strategy for the losing team?

Because it's just hurting the team, especially if your carry wants to farm those camps. I can see it somehow being ok if enemies are farming your jungle, but should make sure your team is fine w it first.

[Ulthwé]

Publicado originalmente por Sotj:

Publicado originalmente por Miaou:

Thx for these advice I never needed. It's already over if he doesn't come do def t2 most of the time anyway. Why do you even comment in the first place when I said blocking camp could be a strategy for the losing team?

Because it's just hurting the team, especially if your carry wants to farm those camps. I can see it somehow being ok if enemies are farming your jungle, but should make sure your team is fine w it first.

No, the team could disagree, but it doesn't mean they are right.

[Sotj]

Publicado originalmente por Miaou:

Publicado originalmente por Sotj:

Because it's just hurting the team, especially if your carry wants to farm those camps. I can see it somehow being ok if enemies are farming your jungle, but should make sure your team is fine w it first.

No, the team could disagree, but it doesn't mean they are right.

Most likely you will just end up making everyone mad at you, they will report you and they wont join the team fight anyway, since they think you are ♥♥♥♥ and grief them. But ok do what ever works the best for you.

[Ulthwé]

Publicado originalmente por Sotj:

Publicado originalmente por Miaou:

No, the team could disagree, but it doesn't mean they are right.

Most likely you will just end up making everyone mad at you, they will report you and they wont join the team fight anyway, since they think you are ♥♥♥♥ and grief them. But ok do what ever works the best for you.

If they cry because I blocked camps they can't farm anyway, they have a serious issue, and this issue is not me.