Here is a list of weapons I never use.

[橘光]

Look, I'm not your typical "meta" guy, I advocate for weapon variety instead of a tiered system(you need stronger weapons for diff 7-9), and I agree with the nerfs on the basis of I don't want to see power creep.

But still, I'm finding that after the recent changes, there are weapons and strategems that I would never pick up no matter the circumstances, so I'm puzzled as to what the balancing guy is doing right now. Here is a list:

Primaries:
- Liberator Concussive: only viable as a bug breach/bot dropship caller sniper, but it's always better to kill than to stun. If only using to stun, blitzer does everything and kills.
- Diligence: damage just shy of one-shotting devastators(I didn't try this, only read from a spreadsheet, but it's not like DCS's medium pen doesn't help anywhere)
- Breaker Spray&Pray: why when incendiary?
- Exploding Crossbow: no utility(compared to the eruptor), so I usually need to bring an utility support weapon, but then the damage isn't good enough, or skill issue for me.

Funnily enough I do use all support weapons, though some more than others, so here are a few niche picks.
- Stalwart: no primary weapon capable of reliably killing chargers and bile titans. If they move as slow as their automaton counter part then I would happily bring this and kill heavies with strategems. On the other hand machine gun isn't really that useful when fighting bots. If only this was a primary weapon!
- Heavy Machine Gun: 75 round and 7 second reload. I would ditch the third mag for 150 round where you only refill your mag with ammo box.
- Spear: only on bot mission where you're lucky to get on a hill and snipe all the structures, works for me like 1/3 of the time, so bringing it less and less.

Strategems:
- Everything smoke: I just don't do that playstyle, much like everyone I've ever played with. But it seems like eagle smoke strike direct hits does damage?
- Eagle 110mm Rocket Pods: with that lackluster range, damage and pen, I just can't help but wonder what is the supposed target for these? Structures maybe?
- Shield Generator Relay: lasts for like half a minute, and it's not like it deploys instantly, so you couldn't prepare and you couldn't use it in emergency.
- Rocket Sentry: inaccurate, slow, does less damage than the autocannon, imo even worse than the machine gun sentry, which is a direct downgrade.

Feel free to ask me why I bring any of the strategems or weapons you hate, and I would love to know why if you bring these weapons and strategems!

[Nighteyes]

Spear, if used correctly, is pretty amazing at taking down Bile Titan’s in one hit. If it fails to do it in one hit then an orbital rail strike will finish it off.

I agree the rocket pods at absolute trash tier. For taking up a valuable strategem slot, they: 1) don’t one shot a Bile Titan, 2) don’t one shot a Charger, 3) don’t 2 shot them. Maybe they require care with attack angles but I couldn’t figure out how to do so, making them just absolutely useless in a pinch. At minimum they should one shot a charger.

[Wang]

Originally posted by Nighteyes:

Spear, if used correctly, is pretty amazing at taking down Bile Titan’s in one hit. If it fails to do it in one hit then an orbital rail strike will finish it off.

I agree the rocket pods at absolute trash tier. For taking up a valuable strategem slot, they: 1) don’t one shot a Bile Titan, 2) don’t one shot a Charger, 3) don’t 2 shot them. Maybe they require care with attack angles but I couldn’t figure out how to do so, making them just absolutely useless in a pinch. At minimum they should one shot a charger.

Rocket pods are 500 kgs without the damage honestly
blast radius is ♥♥♥♥ and takes the same or even more effort to line it up.

[Nighteyes]

Originally posted by Wang:

Originally posted by Nighteyes:

Spear, if used correctly, is pretty amazing at taking down Bile Titan’s in one hit. If it fails to do it in one hit then an orbital rail strike will finish it off.

I agree the rocket pods at absolute trash tier. For taking up a valuable strategem slot, they: 1) don’t one shot a Bile Titan, 2) don’t one shot a Charger, 3) don’t 2 shot them. Maybe they require care with attack angles but I couldn’t figure out how to do so, making them just absolutely useless in a pinch. At minimum they should one shot a charger.

Rocket pods are 500 kgs without the damage honestly
blast radius is ♥♥♥♥ and takes the same or even more effort to line it up.

Perhaps they are better against bots? But then I could just use airstrike/500kg to destroy hulks/tanks and everything around them.
Or maybe they can destroy fabricators? Since you get like 4 or 5 of them, that's not a bad way to snipe fabricator buildings, IF they focus the building.

[Nighteyes]

After a quick test, rocket pods will take out bot fabricators. They did not take out a hulk while it was in motion. I assume they could take out a tank and a turret since they are large and slow/immobile.

So absolutely useless vs bugs but possibly useful vs bots in specific builds.

[Alice]

I personally run Eagle Smoke and the Shield Relay. Need to break away from enemies? Smoke. Need to destroy a fabricator and not draw too much attention? Smoke. Need a one to three times use 'get the ♥♥♥♥ away from there' for teammates you want to move away from where they're standing that will panic them but not kill them? Smoke.

Need to push up into a base? Relay. Need a bit of breathing room? Relay. Need some cover where there isn't any on an objective that will last *juuust* long enough to push some buttons? Relay. See the team struggling over the hill but in range? Relay them some cover.

I can't express how slept on these options are. Everyone loves big boombs, nobody but me has lateral thinking enough to bring tools to enable the bombs.

Oh my favorite relay use. Gunship tower? Detector tower? Jammer(Once it's down)? Plop a shield relay next to the hellbomb. I've been amused may times by gunships desperately targeting the bomb protected by the shield. It has enough health to last I think like three rocket salvos from gunships, and plenty of machine gun fire. I know it can survive at least 2 strafing runs by gunships. That's long enough to set the bomb off.

I think what people expect from the shield is a portable fortress, when it's really just an 'expendable anti damage' area meant to purchase more breathing room than you're afforded.

Also eagle smoke can destroy fabricators with the impact of the smoke shell itself. So that's neat. Great for people who love to run as a scout clearing sides.

[Alice]

Originally posted by Nighteyes:

After a quick test, rocket pods will take out bot fabricators. They did not take out a hulk while it was in motion. I assume they could take out a tank and a turret since they are large and slow/immobile.

So absolutely useless vs bugs but possibly useful vs bots in specific builds.

Yeah rocket pods are basically for fabs/tanks/bulks under a stun nade or EMS mortar/factory striders.

[Wutever]

Originally posted by Nighteyes:

After a quick test, rocket pods will take out bot fabricators. They did not take out a hulk while it was in motion. I assume they could take out a tank and a turret since they are large and slow/immobile.

So absolutely useless vs bugs but possibly useful vs bots in specific builds.

There's 0 reason to run Pods when Airstrike exists. Fully upgraded Airstrike will delete everything that Pods can kill when they decide not to randomly miss. The only thing that Pods are better against is Cannon Turrets.

However, a single Airstrike will kill an entire bot patrol, up to 3 fabricators depending on base layout and can entirely destroy small and some medium bases, enemies included.

You could run Pods and Airstrike, but then you have nothing that can take out stuff like Detector Towers.

[Nighteyes]

Originally posted by Wutever:

Originally posted by Nighteyes:

After a quick test, rocket pods will take out bot fabricators. They did not take out a hulk while it was in motion. I assume they could take out a tank and a turret since they are large and slow/immobile.

So absolutely useless vs bugs but possibly useful vs bots in specific builds.

There's 0 reason to run Pods when Airstrike exists. Fully upgraded Airstrike will delete everything that Pods can kill when they decide not to randomly miss. The only thing that Pods are better against is Cannon Turrets.

However, a single Airstrike will kill an entire bot patrol, up to 3 fabricators depending on base layout and can entirely destroy small and some medium bases, enemies included.

You could run Pods and Airstrike, but then you have nothing that can take out stuff like Detector Towers.

Yeah, that's really it and the problem with a lot of the design. Some weapons are universally effective while others are niche, making them a hard choice to argue for any loadout other than "I wanna use it this time."

[いか]

Stalwart becomes a god killer at 1100 rpm

[Wutever]

Originally posted by Nighteyes:

Originally posted by Wutever:

There's 0 reason to run Pods when Airstrike exists. Fully upgraded Airstrike will delete everything that Pods can kill when they decide not to randomly miss. The only thing that Pods are better against is Cannon Turrets.

However, a single Airstrike will kill an entire bot patrol, up to 3 fabricators depending on base layout and can entirely destroy small and some medium bases, enemies included.

You could run Pods and Airstrike, but then you have nothing that can take out stuff like Detector Towers.

Yeah, that's really it and the problem with a lot of the design. Some weapons are universally effective while others are niche, making them a hard choice to argue for any loadout other than "I wanna use it this time."

Most of the Eagles and Orbitals are very usable now even if they are niche. Pods aren't niche. They are just bad.

[pzhda'tan]

Rocket sentry has longer up time than AC sentry.

[Nighteyes]

Originally posted by Wutever:

Originally posted by Nighteyes:

Yeah, that's really it and the problem with a lot of the design. Some weapons are universally effective while others are niche, making them a hard choice to argue for any loadout other than "I wanna use it this time."

Most of the Eagles and Orbitals are very usable now even if they are niche. Pods aren't niche. They are just bad.

Having previously only used them against bugs I would have outright agreed with this statement, but after using them against bots, they can destroy stationary targets except hulks (god forbid a hulk is near the building you want to destroy and they target the hulk). They aren’t great but they can be used on turrets and fabs. I even got a kill on a fab walker somehow.