Discard decks are ruining the game

[Seigmoraig]

The German discard cards are way too oppressive in this game. The combination of discard, skipping draw, and return to hand mechanics are too much all together and they need to be fundamentally changed if they are to be a healthy part of this game.

All of these concepts have been thoroughly explored in MTG and other CCGs and have been deemed unfun and are no longer a part of standard play. Land Destruction isn't fun, random discard isn't fun, skipping draw steps is even worse.

Presently in Kards discard decks end up playing solitaire while the opposing player languishes alone in Kards prison because he is completely and totally starved of resources.
The only to fix this would be to first change ALL discard cards from random to player chosen. (This includes Bletchley Park because seriously as it is right now it might as well just read "you win" and save everyone some time. The player should get to choose in what order the cards go on top of the deck). Cards like Wolfpack, U-375 and Annihilation should let the player choose what they discard.
Cards that remove draw steps shouldn't exist at all or should be symmetrical. In addition, cards like U-16 which is already a player chosen discard should come into effect before the draw step so that is isn't a pseudo draw skip.

[ancientsociety79]

+1

Completely agree. I just surrender when facing a discard deck, since I don't care about rank.

[Garuda]

Originally posted by ancientsociety79:

+1

Completely agree. I just surrender when facing a discard deck, since I don't care about rank.

+ 2

I completely agree with both OP and this post here! I surrender once I see these decks, too.

This has been mentioned for many months, but the devs seem to like this mechanic (aka boredom).

[Warchild698]

Also U-375 always discards my draw cards first. Sniff sniff.

[Pa]

I tried that Brit/German discard/no draw deck and I felt bad after playing 2 games, imagine playing that all the time and enjoying it. Not to mention resistance decks.

They should remove all "attack the hand" mechanics (resistance, discard) since they became so toxic and broken. Even if you win against them, you have to waste 20-30 minutes constantly under "pressure".

This game became "hand" vs "hand", units on the field are almost useless.

[rd_bigdog]

I think the discard meta is not horrible. I mean don't get me wrong, I hate playing against it. But every card game has this archetype of discard/mill effect. I would like to see more nations have ways to deal with it. USA has the M4A1 which is a superb card to have vs discard. But the other nations do not really have any decent counters to it.

[Seigmoraig]

Originally posted by rd_bigdog:

I think the discard meta is not horrible. I mean don't get me wrong, I hate playing against it. But every card game has this archetype of discard/mill effect. I would like to see more nations have ways to deal with it. USA has the M4A1 which is a superb card to have vs discard. But the other nations do not really have any decent counters to it.

I don't inherently have a problem with discard/mill being in the game, The main problem is it being random discard, if it was all player chosen it would be much more manageable.
Also as an important thing to note, paper card games like MTG can support discard/mill strategies because it can be countered with recursion effects that either reanimate creatures from the graveyard zone to the battlefield or return them back to hand from the graveyard.
MTG also very little ways to force players to skip their draw step. The only effects like this are self inflicted (Necropotence, Yawgmoth's Bargain etc)

M4A1 is nice and all but when you are playing against random discard effects it just ends up getting binned and there is nothing you can do about it

[jzak]

I've been complaining about discard since July.

Because it isn't a problem on the ladder the developers are unlikely to adjust/nerf any of the discard cards if anything they have buffed discard decks.

The same can be said about resistance decks - even though developers have said they are going to adjust resistance. I cannot say the recent changes are a nerf or a buff. Either way because resistance isn't a problem on the ladder I'm not sure we will see any major changes.

[Sudhir]

The Devs have repeatedly reinforced their love for "process" decks. Interaction between players isn't the priority in this game. I hate them too, but if you want a game that's more based on move>countermove, this game isn't for you.

[DANILO]

Developers have already weakened this type of deck.
But it's still very powerful.. It is frustrating and time consuming to play against this type of strategy. This seems to me to be a flaw in game design.
The game has many cards that when someone uses it is practically guaranteed victory.
An example of this is that German artillery that takes out EVERYTHING that the opponent has on the field.

[WeltonCitan]

Originally posted by DANILO:

Developers have already weakened this type of deck.
But it's still very powerful.. It is frustrating and time consuming to play against this type of strategy. This seems to me to be a flaw in game design.
The game has many cards that when someone uses it is practically guaranteed victory.
An example of this is that German artillery that takes out EVERYTHING that the opponent has on the field.

The gun just retreat them, you may still have unit if you have units on frontlin, a late card, and costly to fire each round. Strong, I agree, but not game breaking, as I personally use it many times.

[Seigmoraig]

Originally posted by DANILO:

Developers have already weakened this type of deck.
But it's still very powerful.. It is frustrating and time consuming to play against this type of strategy. This seems to me to be a flaw in game design.
The game has many cards that when someone uses it is practically guaranteed victory.
An example of this is that German artillery that takes out EVERYTHING that the opponent has on the field.

Leopold is very strong indeed but he isn't as back breaking as other things in the game. I would still rather have Leopold as a thing in every game I play than have to suffer through watching my opponent play solitaire because I can't draw and my hand is empty.
The worst offender is Bletchley Park, seriously it could just read "you win the game".

[DANILO]

Originally posted by IdeaWelton:

Originally posted by DANILO:

Developers have already weakened this type of deck.
But it's still very powerful.. It is frustrating and time consuming to play against this type of strategy. This seems to me to be a flaw in game design.
The game has many cards that when someone uses it is practically guaranteed victory.
An example of this is that German artillery that takes out EVERYTHING that the opponent has on the field.

The gun just retreat them, you may still have unit if you have units on frontlin, a late card, and costly to fire each round. Strong, I agree, but not game breaking, as I personally use it many times.

He sends everything the opponent has on the field to the hand, even if it's on the front line.
If the opponent is unable to remove the artillery immediately, defeat is certain.
It is a card that simply wins the game if you use it.

[Garuda]

Originally posted by DANILO:

He sends everything the opponent has on the field to the hand, even if it's on the front line. If the opponent is unable to remove the artillery immediately, defeat is certain. It is a card that simply wins the game if you use it.

I have already won a lot of games vs Leopold, however I have won none against Bletchly Park. The former is just another powerful card, the latter always wins the game.

[Shaia_Tempari]

At least there's some counterplay unlike Russian supply chain/art cancer decks.

[Void]

Originally posted by Garuda:

Originally posted by DANILO:

He sends everything the opponent has on the field to the hand, even if it's on the front line. If the opponent is unable to remove the artillery immediately, defeat is certain. It is a card that simply wins the game if you use it.

I have already won a lot of games vs Leopold, however I have won none against Bletchly Park. The former is just another powerful card, the latter always wins the game.

^ Bletchley > Leo any time. remove Leo and thats it - but Bletchley removes your ability to do anything