Why don't conveyor segment lengths and pipe segment lengths match??

[25hz]

After putting about 250 hours into the game when it was on Epic, I had a hiatus and just started playing again on Steam. Never used the pipes before. The stackable conveyor and pipe poles were made to stack seamlessly and allow players to mix pipes and belts at will, which is awesome. What isn't awesome is that the pole-to-pole segment length of pipes is longer than the pole-to-pole segment length of belts, so if you laid the pipes first, the belts don't line up.

Why? Why isn't the code edited with a simple different number so that the max segment length of both belts and pipes match? We have to cludge a fix (after pipe systems are built) by stacking poles for the belts on their own and then delete the extras, or we have to delete the pipes and then rebuild them. The other option is to remember that for some arbitrary reason ("arbitrary" meaning how the devs decided what length or number of belts/pipe sections would equal a segment) you have to use a belt to get max segment length, and then switch over and use the pipe pole to set the segment length. Not the end of the world, but with all the things to remember and plan about the game, why include unequal segment lengths when a simple number change could fix the issue?

Additionally, did you code the conveyor section lengths and pipe section lengths to be different values? They are both game objects that "move" items over time, so to try to future proof the code a little, did you make their lengths the same? Is the reason the pipe and belt segment lengths don't match because you coded the pipe and conveyor section lengths to be different or you just picked a different number of sections of each to create a segment of belt/pipe?

At any rate, it's just a number change for the number of belts/pipes in a segment, right? Why not make them equal values?

[Vegas Doc]

SOLUTION: don't stack the two different types of stackable poles.

I've never tried it, but the stackable pipe segments are round, meant only for pipes, not conveyor belts, but maybe you are right. Like I said, never combined the two. I put conveyor belts on their stackable poles, pipes on theirs, so there is no difference in the lengths of the two.

"you don't (can't) put a square peg into round hole" - some very wise man said it a long time ago.

[25hz]

Ok, well, I have them all over the place now and the two types of stackable poles mesh exactly as they should, and obviously by design. Combining the pipes and belts massively cleans up logistic buses, and with some artistic flair (which I lack) you can make very nice looking combinations of pipes and belts.

The stacking works as coded, and works beautifully. The problem that could easily be addressed, is that the segment lengths don't jive. As I said though, the current fix is to lay out a max length conveyor segment, and that is where you put the stacking poles for both pipe and belts.

SOLUTION: Code both segment lengths so they are equal.

CURRENT BAND-AID: Lay out pipe segments using conveyor segment lengths, just in case future expansion might require belts and pipes on the same poles.

[zoiks]

Power cables are also different max length and the inputs and outputs on different buildings rarely line up.

Maybe they wanted to introduce some added complexity... maybe they just didn't have consistent standards in place when creating things. Who knows?

[Verios44]

Pipes were initially designed before the stackable pipe pole was added.

The different segment lengths is not an accident, but design. Even hypertubes are a different length.

For stacking pipes and belts together, its actually simpler than you expect. I like to go pipes, and belts on top of pipes. If a hypertube is added, its at the very top of the stack.

[25hz]

Originally posted by Verios44:

Pipes were initially designed before the stackable pipe pole was added.

The different segment lengths is not an accident, but design. Even hypertubes are a different length.

For stacking pipes and belts together, its actually simpler than you expect. I like to go pipes, and belts on top of pipes. If a hypertube is added, its at the very top of the stack.

I think your use of the word "design" is different than the definition of the word. "By design", in this instance, infers that there is a thought-out purpose behind making every segmented, connectable, transport modality a different length. I try to think as laterally as I can, but I can't see any kind of design purpose for having different transport methods, that ARE designed to be stacked (now), use different segment lengths and not line up by default. I think that zoiks' assessment is the likely cause in that there just wasn't enough communication or consideration and the segment lengths weren't unified. As for "simpler than you expect", I don't understand what is "simpler" than stacking poles the way they were coded to be stacked. As I said, the current fix then, is to plan all the buses around the conveyor segment length. How much simpler can it be until they unify the segment lengths? (rhetorical question)

I haven't gotten to hyper tubes yet, so I guess laying those out will be based on conveyor length too then. As for power poles, I don't really concern myself with those, but I just might try using the wall power nodes and seeing if I can connect those to stackable poles, and then my buses will handle power and materiel, and take one more clutter item (power poles and lines) and add them to the bus. If those wall power nodes CAN'T be added to the sides of stackable poles, then maybe that's another item that could be added to the game or the Fixit shop. Something else to spend tickets on.

[DrNewcenstein]

I can kinda see from a material cost standpoint that belts and pipes and power lines and hypertubes would be different lengths, but at the same time, it does interfere with stacking everything that can be stacked neatly, at least if you'd prefer to run everything at maximum length for whatever reason. I mean, sure it costs the same amount of pipe to run two segments that are 30 feet long as it does one pipe that is 60 feet long, it's just faster to run a pipe to its limit, and use that as a measure of how far apart to set supports.

Especially on sky bridges/foundations. You set down the first one on a joint, then march off 6 joints, and place a stackable support on the 7th joint for pipes. For belts, it's 9 or 11 (can't recall). Or was that for power lines? Either way, you could tailor everything for the shortest runner, if you've planned everything out to the letter well beforehand.
But that involves planning everything out beforehand, otherwise you end up with pipes on one side of the foundation bridge and conveyors on the other side, with hypertubes down the middle, and falling to your death (or at least, near fatal wounding) as you try to position the supports.

Yes, you can stack HTs on top of pipes, but that's not the point.

[DaBa]

That's just how it is. If you want everything to match, just use the shortest measure. Voila, you can now stack everything together.

[Vegas Doc]

...bottom line, if you don't connect them they won't work as intended. If your plan "A" fails, then go to plan "B". Sometimes a little preparation will go a long way, by preparation I mean try it for a bit, if it's not working then watch some "experts" do it on YouTube or something, like reading posts here for example. Then formulate plan "B" with a plan "C" already in formulation as a backup, etc. etc.

If you fail enough times, but learn from those failures, then you are bound to "figure it out", make it happen, then with some constructive self criticism and adjustments it will also become easier, more experience etc. I think that a slower pace after you've done a few playthroughs, really paying attention to the small details, works great. Good luck on your adventure.

[Systemz]

just go by the max length of belts then - 7 tiles.

its just something youll have to remember, i made the same mistake with my hypertubes and will have to redo a whole logistics artery to my factory because of it.

[Grandaddypurple]

Originally posted by Systemz:

just go by the max length of belts then - 7 tiles.

It's 6 tiles though

[Evilsod]

Is that really something you want to be doing either way?

It's a valid QoL problem.
It's already annoying as ♥♥♥♥ that you can't place down stackable poles when you drag out conveyors/pipes/tubes. If you're trying to make any long or large scale arrangement even using just a single type, the tools we have are just plain tedious.
If you want to stack different types them on top of each other (which I can't say I've done yet to have noticed myself), you've got an even more tedious time ahead of you.

It's not like it would break the game if the max distance on tube/pipes was increased to match conveyors to make stacking them all together a little easier.

[Vegas Doc]

There is some kind of Mod, hate to use that word, that has a huge conveyor belt, like across the whole " sorta flat (not a round sphere or globe)" planet I think, but I haven't tried it, and then there are the teleporters too, don't even use conveyors, just beam it there I guess, what a concept! So, no limit on the length of the conveyor belt, might be what you're looking for.

When someone loves a game so much, that they research the game, break it down, make some mods, and share it with the player community for free, I think that means that it's a successful game. I play Skyrim, and they "mod the living heck" out of that game, some of them are really good too.

[Jeslis]

Just an update on this; This came up in 1 of the dev streams. (Conveyor vs Pipe vs Hypertube and length limits).. they are aware and will most likely normalize this in the future.

[DrNewcenstein]

Originally posted by Jeslis:

Just an update on this; This came up in 1 of the dev streams. (Conveyor vs Pipe vs Hypertube and length limits).. they are aware and will most likely normalize this in the future.

"...and the trees are all kept equal by hatchet, axe, and saw"

I would like to see an option as to which type of support gets laid down when you're running a line - stackable or single.

[DaBa]

Originally posted by Jeslis:

Just an update on this; This came up in 1 of the dev streams. (Conveyor vs Pipe vs Hypertube and length limits).. they are aware and will most likely normalize this in the future.

Makes sense, it's not really contributing to anything useful. Also, longer conveyor belt segments would be welcome and make the building process easier.