What's the point of Route B? [Spoilers]

[Ren]

I just "finished" the game on route C. I'm don't plan on continuing with the game any longer, I've got the general gist of the story.

And with that being said, why does the 2nd playthrough even exist? There's only a tiny tiny amount of differences and honestly the game just could have switched perspectives during those specific parts and it would have made just as much sense and have the same effect.

9s's fighting sucks donkey♥♥♥♥♥♥ And having to replay so much of the same content just seems like tedious padding. And after seeing ending C I don't understand why the game needed to be designed how it is.

Can anyone please explain to me what the point is besides to bump up the playtime counter?

[Aemony]

Give a different perspective along with new quests that goes more in-depth in the lore.

Also, chapter select to the last chapter and select the other alternative so you obtain ending D and E.

You haven't really finished the game until you do so, and it's like a couple of minutes work at best (chapter select takes you to the choice at the end directly).

Edit: "I'm don't plan on continuing with the game any longer" in this scenario is akin to having ran all the way up to the finish line and then all of a sudden stop half a meter away and call it a day because you can't be bothered to move the last half a meter.

Literally; because that's how short of a distance you have to having gotten the actual real ending of the game. It's a single choice away.

[myhr2]

@ OP : it's more than giving you another perspective, because you're right, they aren't much differences, and they could have been presented while avoiding much of the repetition.

That being said, there is a reason, it's to illustrate better the concept of endless cycle, of repetition. I know it's kinda an unpopular way of doing so, judging by the number of criticism this route gets, and by the criticism other art pieces got for trying to recreate this feeling of infinity, this longing feeling of deja-vu, of "what is all that for?". Another example is the first part of the second season of Haruhi Suzumiya, the Endless Eight.

Is it worth it? It's highly debatable, and will vary from individual from individual. On one side, there is the complain that this is indeed time that is wasted repeated something you have already experienced, or close enough. On the other though, I would like to state that, repetition is not always a loss of time :
- first, of course, repetition of something you enjoy can be totally worth it, or even sought after. That's why we read a book, watch a film, or even have a nice discussion with the same friend again and again. Is it pointless? Mostly, yes, after all, even when we can dig deeper and get something new out of something we already have experienced, we much more often get more from first experiencing something fresh and new. Not always the case, of course, but pretty common I'd say.
- second, and maybe more relevant to the way things were handled in Nier : Automata, to achieve meaning or even to just entertain is not always equal to having fun. Sometimes, you don't learn through fun or pleasure, but through hardship and perseverance. Sometimes, it's worth it to take a peek at what if would be to not take a shortcut, to experience something truly painful, to better understand a concept. Now, I'm not advocating self-inflicted suffering in general, ok? What I'm trying to say is that sometimes, an artist will try to provoke a certain feeling in you, and maybe using unconventional or even questionable means, and it's up to you to say "no, here is the limit I draw, I don't like this."
In Nier : Automata's case, I think this intent was well-balanced with the added cutscenes, the changes of viewpoint, the changes in gameplay (hacking mini-game and 9S distinct moveset), the different sidequests, giving a feeling of repetition without being boring.
But it remains subjective. My balance is not yours, and one of the previously mentioned elements may throw you one side or the other (the hacking mini-game has some detractors for example, whereas I really liked it, so of course we'll have a different feeling about route B)

That being said, there is a reason, and it's not adding some hours to the game's length. Remove route B, and you have 30ish hours of game, more than honorable for a game of that genre, so that argument is very questionable. No, it's clear to me that it is to emulate this infinite cycle of life and death that the Yorha androïds are trapped in. As stated right at the beginning of the game.

[Ren]

Originally posted by Aemony:

Give a different perspective along with new quests that goes more in-depth in the lore.

And that couldn't be accomplished by just forcing me to switch back and forth during a single playthrough? Instead of making me replay a chunk of the game twice? And sit through cutscenes where the majority of them are unchanged?

Originally posted by Aemony:

Edit: "I'm don't plan on continuing with the game any longer" in this scenario is akin to having ran all the way up to the finish line and then all of a sudden stop half a meter away and call it a day because you can't be bothered to move the last half a meter.

Literally; because that's how short of a distance you have to having gotten the actual real ending of the game. It's a single choice away.

I'm aware. I honestly was powering through the last 15 hours or so and really not enjoying my time at all. There were a few great story moments but pretty much everything about the gameplay dragged the game down for me.

@Myhr

I was more so talking about the main story playtime. I tried a few sidequests early on and discovered quite a few of them are a waste of time and just ended up sticking to the main story. And if you ignore all the sidequests it's pretty easy to finish the game in under 20 hours. And route B probably took at least 3-4 of those.

The gameplay started becoming a chore for me around the 10 hour mark. And while I know a lot of people find the combat enjoyable enough and did like doing the side content, I was only invested to see the story. It just seemed like a really poor excuse to make you sit through so much content twice especially when the game already encourages you to replay things with chapter select.

[lessthanoff]

"I was more so talking about the main story playtime. I tried a few sidequests early on and discovered quite a few of them are a waste of time and just ended up sticking to the main story."

You tried "a few" of them and then discovered that "quite a few" of them were a waste of time? Quite a few of the few you did, or quite a few of *all* of them? Because if it's the latter, then I'm left wondering how you know they're a waste of time if you haven't even done them.

Anyways, you're objectively wrong regardless, because most of the side quests add not only to the stories of the machines/androids and how they live and coexist, but they also add vital character development to 2B, 9S and A2 -- to the extent that I don't think it would be possible to properly understand the full extent of their characters and their motivations without having done them. There are even a few side quests that heavily foreshadow major events that occur in the main story, as well as side quests that will add additional lines of dialogue into parts of the main story.

[lessthanoff]

As for why Route B exists, the best answer I can give you (which may or may not be the truth -- I don't know for sure what Yoko Taro or the devs had in mind with any certainty) is that it was set up to lull longtime fans of Yoko Taro games into thinking his style hasn't really changed from the original NieR (making players replay the same parts of the game to get a different perspective on events, which then leads directly into other endings), only to surprise them with Route C, which is the secret second half of the game and completely new content. The original NieR had the player do something very similar to Routes A/B, where you had to replay the second half of the game with differences in the story in order to see all the endings, but there was no continuation after that point like there is in Automata.

You have to take into consideration that Yoko Taro games have always been very niche, and up until Automata, only a dedicated cult following (for the most part) played them. So Route C being there was, I assume, supposed to be a huge subversion of their expectations, since something like Route B is pretty much what longtime fans of his games already expected.

[myhr2]

Originally posted by York:

@Myhr

I was more so talking about the main story playtime. I tried a few sidequests early on and discovered quite a few of them are a waste of time and just ended up sticking to the main story. And if you ignore all the sidequests it's pretty easy to finish the game in under 20 hours. And route B probably took at least 3-4 of those.

The gameplay started becoming a chore for me around the 10 hour mark. And while I know a lot of people find the combat enjoyable enough and did like doing the side content, I was only invested to see the story. It just seemed like a really poor excuse to make you sit through so much content twice especially when the game already encourages you to replay things with chapter select.

I can see your point about sidequests, mechanically speaking, but as far as world-building and character writing goes, they're far from wasted time. Again, that is subjective, of course, but each sidequest has something to say, a concept to throw at you. Criticism of reducing your life to your accomplishements with the Race robot, futility of searching the meaning of life with the suicidal robots, showing cracks in the Yorha organisation with the deserters quest, and so on and so on.

Even 16 hours can be plentiful, if you enjoy them. I don't see many people complaining about Portal 1 and 2, or Metal Gear : Revengance lenght. And you may argue that they have less "filler" than Nier : Automata, but, as a J-RPG fan, an liking diablo-like games...repetitivity can be interesting, or even fun.

This indeed all boils down to your enjoyement of the gameplay, and if you indeed got fed-up of it after 10 hours, then...this game just wasn't for you, simple as that, or maybe, more accuratly, it didn't click with you as much as it did with me, and there is little to do about it.

Game devs will make choices, you will enjoy them or not, tastes and colors. I just wanted to point out that, unlike what you're suggesting, there are factual elements that can be pointed at to show that route B is not "just length for length", repetition for the sake of giving the illusion of being a bigger game. There is meaning to it, it fits with the core themes of the game, and there are tangible elements that show that the dev just didn't design a "new game + with a couple features". As I said, changes in gameplay, cutscenes, sidequests, are here, and, imho, denote of efforts put into route B. Yes, it's pretty much like route A...but only if you ignore a lot of little pieces. And then there is route C that further demonstrate the continuation of the efforts of the devs.

No really, "route B is only there to lazily add length", sorry, I don't see it. You may not enjoy the choices that were made, and you are entitled to your opinion, but there were choices, and meaningful ones.

[Ren]

I finished a 90 hour playthrough of persona 5 about two weeks ago. Yes, I understand what JRPGs are, yes, sometimes I can find repetition enjoyable.

I did not find it enjoyable here.

I'm not interested in debating whether or not the sidequests are worth doing. I honesty hated my time with the game and I have zero intention of returning to it. I was merely here asking about route B to see if people who genuinely enjoy the game could give a good reason for it to exist how it does. I'm typically much more of a gameplay above story person.

Glad you guys enjoyed it, absolutely was not for me.

[myhr2]

Fair enough.

[[reaVerNL@Rumble]ᚱᛖᚨᚠᛖᚱ]

Originally posted by York:

I finished a 90 hour playthrough of persona 5 about two weeks ago. Yes, I understand what JRPGs are, yes, sometimes I can find repetition enjoyable.

I did not find it enjoyable here.

I'm not interested in debating whether or not the sidequests are worth doing. I honesty hated my time with the game and I have zero intention of returning to it. I was merely here asking about route B to see if people who genuinely enjoy the game could give a good reason for it to exist how it does. I'm typically much more of a gameplay above story person.

Glad you guys enjoyed it, absolutely was not for me.

Same basic story with different gameplay. Both route A and route B essentially prepare you to be able to use 9S and A2 in route C and route C exploits this by swapping between them on a whim during the last few fights. Route B also adds additional lore of which it would make sense for 9S to be more susceptible to.

So storywise it helps fill in some of the blanks and gameplaywise it prepares you for route C. Additionally, I felt it also helped a bit with character building as 9S' workload is very hard to judge as 2B; yet when playing 9S you will know how he contributed to every fight the both of them were in. It kinda gives you an appreciation for his presence.