SCUM
Envid Sep 17, 2021 @ 11:49pm
Thievery and Medical XP Gain
Its a joke and needs a buff. Especially since it got removed from failed attempts. Its insane how much xp i need just to get to basic with a crowbar and impossible to use the practice lockpick tool.
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Showing 1-15 of 22 comments
Deathwhisper Sep 18, 2021 @ 3:13am 
Hi,

the medicine skill is not easy to learn. Basic is easy to achieve by treating the harmless C1 injuries.

The acquisition of experience points for opening locks can be practiced and upgraded in many ways. A practice lock can help a lot, especially at the beginning. But the countless lockers will also help. It is a very often used skill and you can upgrade it accordingly. In contrast to the practice lock, you get experience even if you fail when you try to open a lock within the world.
Envid Sep 18, 2021 @ 7:43pm 
Originally posted by Deathwhisper:
Hi,

the medicine skill is not easy to learn. Basic is easy to achieve by treating the harmless C1 injuries.

The acquisition of experience points for opening locks can be practiced and upgraded in many ways. A practice lock can help a lot, especially at the beginning. But the countless lockers will also help. It is a very often used skill and you can upgrade it accordingly. In contrast to the practice lock, you get experience even if you fail when you try to open a lock within the world.


I could make an entire page about why i disagree but i think ill just keep it short, Because it will just fall on deaf ears. Im well aware of HOW to gain xp and what methods there are. And im telling you its NOT enough. ITS TOO SLOW compared the other skills. And ITS NOT FUN to do these more time efficient methods. Just a chore.
Cylixx Sep 18, 2021 @ 8:17pm 
Originally posted by Envid:
Originally posted by Deathwhisper:
Hi,

the medicine skill is not easy to learn. Basic is easy to achieve by treating the harmless C1 injuries.

The acquisition of experience points for opening locks can be practiced and upgraded in many ways. A practice lock can help a lot, especially at the beginning. But the countless lockers will also help. It is a very often used skill and you can upgrade it accordingly. In contrast to the practice lock, you get experience even if you fail when you try to open a lock within the world.


I could make an entire page about why i disagree but i think ill just keep it short, Because it will just fall on deaf ears. Im well aware of HOW to gain xp and what methods there are. And im telling you its NOT enough. ITS TOO SLOW compared the other skills. And ITS NOT FUN to do these more time efficient methods. Just a chore.

Build your character differently then.

I myself have gone from No Skill, to Advanced Skill in demo just with the practice bomb. I diddle with it when I'm regaining calories or whatever.

Lockpick I've gone from No Skill to Medium Skill with the practice lock. You don't have to spend heaps of time grinding it in one go, just smash a few attempts out when you have a moment with nothing to do.

This game puts a high price on your stats. That's the idea. If they made supercharging every skill practical and incidental - then everyone would just end up at max skill and nothing would mean anything.

I agree that leveling these skills isn't fun, but stats are supposed to really matter here; and because they are so hard to build; they do. Leveling these skills means having a roof over your head, having supplies to sit on your ass.

I don't think you will get much support, as really, having a lockpicking board and practice bomb already trivializes these skills remarkably. I don't bother spending stats on them at the creation stage because of how easy they are to build to Advanced.
Envid Sep 19, 2021 @ 12:25am 
Originally posted by Cylixx:
Originally posted by Envid:


I could make an entire page about why i disagree but i think ill just keep it short, Because it will just fall on deaf ears. Im well aware of HOW to gain xp and what methods there are. And im telling you its NOT enough. ITS TOO SLOW compared the other skills. And ITS NOT FUN to do these more time efficient methods. Just a chore.

Build your character differently then.

I myself have gone from No Skill, to Advanced Skill in demo just with the practice bomb. I diddle with it when I'm regaining calories or whatever.

Lockpick I've gone from No Skill to Medium Skill with the practice lock. You don't have to spend heaps of time grinding it in one go, just smash a few attempts out when you have a moment with nothing to do.

This game puts a high price on your stats. That's the idea. If they made supercharging every skill practical and incidental - then everyone would just end up at max skill and nothing would mean anything.

I agree that leveling these skills isn't fun, but stats are supposed to really matter here; and because they are so hard to build; they do. Leveling these skills means having a roof over your head, having supplies to sit on your ass.

I don't think you will get much support, as really, having a lockpicking board and practice bomb already trivializes these skills remarkably. I don't bother spending stats on them at the creation stage because of how easy they are to build to Advanced.
Demo gives decent xp, that was a bad example. I just said SPECIFICALLY Theivery and Medical. The rest of the skills are fine, and yet they too take some time but the XP GAIN on them is FAIR. The XP gain on theivery and medical IS NOT. The changes to XP GAIN to Theivery were just RECENTLY changed. You can NO LONGER gain XP from failed attempts on the practice lock, if you could, id be doing that and would be only complaining about Medical.
Go_Coup Sep 19, 2021 @ 1:04am 
Originally posted by Cylixx:
Build your character differently then.

I myself have gone from No Skill, to Advanced Skill in demo just with the practice bomb. I diddle with it when I'm regaining calories or whatever.

Lockpick I've gone from No Skill to Medium Skill with the practice lock. You don't have to spend heaps of time grinding it in one go, just smash a few attempts out when you have a moment with nothing to do.

This game puts a high price on your stats. That's the idea. If they made supercharging every skill practical and incidental - then everyone would just end up at max skill and nothing would mean anything.

I agree that leveling these skills isn't fun, but stats are supposed to really matter here; and because they are so hard to build; they do. Leveling these skills means having a roof over your head, having supplies to sit on your ass.
This ^

I don't want everyone to be an expert at everything, especially at lock picking.
Dribs Sep 19, 2021 @ 1:39am 
Originally posted by Go_Coup:

I don't want everyone to be an expert at everything, especially at lock picking.

You can just start any character with the skill you need.
CheeseKing  [developer] Sep 19, 2021 @ 3:19am 
Originally posted by Envid:
Its a joke and needs a buff. Especially since it got removed from failed attempts. Its insane how much xp i need just to get to basic with a crowbar and impossible to use the practice lockpick tool.

As they already said, you can start with what skill you like the most and create your character as you like. The higher your medical skill goes and the severity of injuries you treat and which components you use to treat your wounds give a different amount of exp. As for the thievery skill, could you provide us with some examples of what you mean? How much exp you per doing what and what exactly do you think is giving you a low amount of experience?
Envid Sep 19, 2021 @ 10:31am 
Originally posted by CheeseKing:
Originally posted by Envid:
Its a joke and needs a buff. Especially since it got removed from failed attempts. Its insane how much xp i need just to get to basic with a crowbar and impossible to use the practice lockpick tool.

As they already said, you can start with what skill you like the most and create your character as you like. The higher your medical skill goes and the severity of injuries you treat and which components you use to treat your wounds give a different amount of exp. As for the thievery skill, could you provide us with some examples of what you mean? How much exp you per doing what and what exactly do you think is giving you a low amount of experience?

In order to bypass the slowest or hardest or most tedious , you would have to start with those skills, this SHOULD NOT be the reasons to base decisions on. IT should be about what people PREFER instead of whats time efficient. This is a BALANCE issue.

Your the dev, you know exactly at which the rate is per action per xp gain on every skill, yet even some skills benefit from MULTIPLE actions simultaneously, for example awareness + survival + engineering can be leveled together by performing certain actions. Stealth + Camo can do this aswell, Running while carrying alot of weight(endurance).

Ive made a new character and as a new character can see the substantial gains from other skills in a short period of time. IM NOT SAYING i want Advance RIGHT NOW or TOMORROW. Im simply talking about the XP GAIN per action or in some cases per SET of actions for example. If your crawling after 5 seconds in a bush, you get XP for camo. While crouch walking you get xp per every second for stealth. So the xp rates differ from skill to skill and action to action, everyone knows this.

My argument is simply the XP GAIN PER ACTION and how difficult it is to PERFORM that action that in turn SLOWS down even further that XP GAIN.

And the ONLY TWO skills that MATTER in the game currently because they arent the only two, This applies to Melee Weapons , Throwing, and Brawling aswell. BUt no one really cares about brawling , or Throwing(and leveling this skill barely does anything). While MOST will put points into melee weapons because its MUCH EASIER to level Rifles , handguns , Archery. This is A BALANCE ISSUE.

Im not saying it CANT BE DONE. Im saying theres a balance issue where certain skills have such huge advantage TIME WISE.

Now you can have the other skills xp gain on par with theivery/medical and have people decide what skills they want then expect to never have those other skills at advance unless a VERY SUBSTANTIAL time has passed. But then why even give players the choice?
Just seperate all skills as "classes" so people can either be a Medic, a Theif , a Sniper , a Boxer ect ect .

But for a NEW player they will have a false sense of hope that if they for example chose Brawling cause they thought it would be fun and think it would be NOT EASY but TIME Efficient to level the others to where they can CASUALLY level the other skills and be Moderatly good at them, well This DOES work for Rifles/handguns/Archery IF you play the events. But with Melee Weapons theres just too big of a gap and will discourage this new player from ever even worrying about leveling it because it takes TOO LONG.

If you dont believe me i dont know the rules about posting youtube links. But here is proof of how unbalanced it is to level each skill in 1minutes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_XXBmjaToSU&t=1908s

Ignore the Thievery and Demo since you guys removed the XP GAIN from FAILED attempts.
Last edited by Envid; Sep 19, 2021 @ 10:37am
Cylixx Sep 19, 2021 @ 5:14pm 
Wow, rambling. If I was a dev, I legit would not respond to that omg. Who tf has time for your mad ass.
Last edited by Cylixx; Sep 19, 2021 @ 5:14pm
hollow307 Sep 19, 2021 @ 5:32pm 
Build your character differently then.

This.
Envid Sep 19, 2021 @ 10:34pm 
Originally posted by Hollow307:
Build your character differently then.

This.

Again Deaf Ears.
Envid Sep 19, 2021 @ 10:34pm 
Originally posted by Cylixx:
Wow, rambling. If I was a dev, I legit would not respond to that omg. Who tf has time for your mad ass.


Rambling or not. Its the truth.
Cylixx Sep 19, 2021 @ 11:45pm 
Originally posted by Envid:
Originally posted by Cylixx:
Wow, rambling. If I was a dev, I legit would not respond to that omg. Who tf has time for your mad ass.


Rambling or not. Its the truth.

Truth lol. Truth is they can't spend weeks of time balancing every tiny little thing to work well when lots of systems are not even in the released build yet. They would just need to be altered again.

You are acting like all the systems should be working perfectly and all balanced, but things are still going to change. And for that you write an essay about it...

Lot's of things are imbalanced and useless. No point entering with Survival for instance, no point picking half the skills at all really when weighed against others. But the game isn't finished, like... have you even bothered reading up on the devs goals or listened to any interviews? If you want to ramble, get informed first.
kitkat Sep 20, 2021 @ 12:13am 
For the medic skill, I think this is fair. Think of how long people have to study to become a doctor.
Or may I suggest for when sicknesses are implemented that bandaging could cap at medium skill (i.e. no improvement in material use efficiency) but to be able to correctly diagnose (and treat more advanced injuries) you need higher skill?

As for thievery, I guess this is for balance to make you trade a lot of other skills for being able to efficiently raid other people.

So Envid I hear you but I dont agree the xp gain for these two skills should be increased.
marktkm Sep 20, 2021 @ 2:47am 
I can certainly understand wanting a skill to level up faster. I've wanted that myself at times. I disagree that the 'balance' of the skills needs to be based on how fast they level compared to one another, however.

The devs may want some of them to level slower to prevent people from becoming advanced too quickly in the progression of things. They might leave thievery at a slow rate of increase to balance it against how quickly people can get themselves secured in their base locations. They might want medical to level slowly to balance against the benefit it gives in surviving, especially for squads. Or to slow PVP versus a quick patch from an advanced character who did a lot of grinding in it and you're right back into the fight.

Some things might be slow to advance specifically to prevent 'grinding' at all. They've said a number of times that they don't want people grinding their characters into super-soldiers.

As someone mentioned, things aren't nearly finished. There may even be parts of the game incoming that will alter all of this compared to now.
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Date Posted: Sep 17, 2021 @ 11:49pm
Posts: 22