Possible solution to car hoarding - salvage mechanics

[Ernst Stavro Blofeld]

If you could dissasemble cars for things like scrap metal, leather, bolts, rubber and other, think it would really help, even if you could not resist the primal urge to take another car into your base, you would disassemble it there and new car could spawn, what do you think?

[Dribs]

Siamese eredeti hozzászólása:

Right, but not many many times more likely than if they are all tied up in some big group's base though. You chances then are pretty much zero unless you have the means to break the base.

Also, you can be as careful as you want if you can't repair you will lose vehicles it's just going to happen no matter what you do.

I don't love the idea of them not being repairable but the current repair mechanic is way to simplistic to be an effective limiter.

Well, back in those days you could store cars indefinitely. You did not need to "refresh" them or use them at all. You could just leave them in your base and forget about them and they would stay there until you used them or someone robbed them off you. So car hoarding back then was much, much easier. But of course, if you drove them - you would eventually lose cars inevitably. Thats kind of why you stockpiled.

I would not enjoy it if cars became unrepairable. I'm fine with how that mechanic work now, and I'll just have to see if I do the same if it gets expanded upon, or even removed.

[Dribs]

Chef_uk eredeti hozzászólása:

torq eredeti hozzászólása:

On the contrary I would say people was even more careful with them, as there was no guarantee that YOU would find the car that you destroyed as a fresh spawn. It would be many, many times more likely that someone else, random - would find it.

How would the random know a car was about to spawn? They wouldn't hence the chances of them finding one was lower, and even if they did, it wouldn't be long before they blew it up and another spawned in. Nobody was careful with them back then, nobody.

Well, I was. And thats atleast somebody.

As for the other part, a "random" player wouldnt know if a car spawned, but even if you know a new car will spawn fresh on the map, you have no idea where. It could be anywhere on the 100+ spawnpoints around the map. Thats why its more likely that some random person would find it as opposed to it spawning in the exact same sector you are in, near where you frequent. Basically, everyone currently on the map while a car is freshly spawned on a spawn point, has an equal chance of it spawning close to them and them finding it. Which means that its unlikely that it will happen to you. Thats just common sense probability mate. I'm surprised you dont understand it.

[Ye Olde Curmudgeon]

I really like people who boldly state "you are wrong, I am right" without even understand a single word of what they wrote. Not bad indeed.

[Siamese]

torq eredeti hozzászólása:

Siamese eredeti hozzászólása:

Right, but not many many times more likely than if they are all tied up in some big group's base though. You chances then are pretty much zero unless you have the means to break the base.

Also, you can be as careful as you want if you can't repair you will lose vehicles it's just going to happen no matter what you do.

I don't love the idea of them not being repairable but the current repair mechanic is way to simplistic to be an effective limiter.

Well, back in those days you could store cars indefinitely. You did not need to "refresh" them or use them at all. You could just leave them in your base and forget about them and they would stay there until you used them or someone robbed them off you. So car hoarding back then was much, much easier. But of course, if you drove them - you would eventually lose cars inevitably. Thats kind of why you stockpiled.

I would not enjoy it if cars became unrepairable. I'm fine with how that mechanic work now, and I'll just have to see if I do the same if it gets expanded upon, or even removed.

I said nothing about changing the rot timer. The vehicle can both be rotting and unrepairable at the same time.

The devs have said more maintenance will be added with various parts (oil filter) needed, which i think is the way to go but i still think the singular mechanic for repair is overly simple and makes hording easier than it probably ought to be

[Siamese]

torq eredeti hozzászólása:

Chef_uk eredeti hozzászólása:

How would the random know a car was about to spawn? They wouldn't hence the chances of them finding one was lower, and even if they did, it wouldn't be long before they blew it up and another spawned in. Nobody was careful with them back then, nobody.

Well, I was. And thats atleast somebody.

As for the other part, a "random" player wouldnt know if a car spawned, but even if you know a new car will spawn fresh on the map, you have no idea where. It could be anywhere on the 100+ spawnpoints around the map. Thats why its more likely that some random person would find it as opposed to it spawning in the exact same sector you are in, near where you frequent. Basically, everyone currently on the map while a car is freshly spawned on a spawn point, has an equal chance of it spawning close to them and them finding it. Which means that its unlikely that it will happen to you. Thats just common sense probability mate. I'm surprised you dont understand it.

The vehicle doesn't need to be found by it's previous owner to improve the circulation of vehicles. Sure a random person finds it, ok now you have one more different vehicle owner. The point of reducing hording isn't to insure that every single individual has a vehicle it's to insure that the vehicles remain a viable part of the game. By that i mean the WHOLE game not just the base raiding part of it. The more people that have vehicles the more vehicles are likely to be on the roads at any given time which increases the opportunity for others to in turn get the vehicles from those people...and the cycle continues. That's just common sense economics mate.

[Siamese]

torq eredeti hozzászólása:

....

I never said you were in favor of limiting hording (comprehension mate). Its very clear you are in favor of it. I was agreeing with you that it shouldn't be limited with the exception that the system discourage it rather than limit it.

64 vehicles for 1000+ people is plenty scarce without hording. If a group is sitting on 10+ then they are creating a giant gap in the mobility economy. If someone want's to do the kind of "work" you think they should, which lets be clear is just PVP, then vehicles have to be out driving around. Otherwise nothing happens and that's the point. Hording works to decrease PVP options not increase them. No squad of 10 people is out driving around in 10 vehicles. So the contact options for players to get a vehicle slows to a trickle.

To go further to address this argument of hording increasing value i would also add that when a player does get a vehicle they are in fact WAY more likely to not use it simply for fear of losing it because of the over inflated value created by hording. So the hording behavior just encourages more hording behavior.

In the end they can't build the game around this idea that the servers will mostly be low pop so vehicles will need added value. They have to assume full servers with thousands of players when planning these types of balancing issues.

Lastly, i can make a point on a conversation with out you having a point in the conversation.

[marktkm]

Bunny eredeti hozzászólása:

Complete disassembly of vehicles is not planned for the time being.

But...but...my plans for an illegal chop shop in Spickovina...?

[insettoinfetto]

Siamese eredeti hozzászólása:

The point of reducing hording isn't to insure that every single individual has a vehicle it's to insure that the vehicles remain a viable part of the game. By that i mean the WHOLE game not just the base raiding part of it. The more people that have vehicles the more vehicles are likely to be on the roads at any given time which increases the opportunity for others to in turn get the vehicles from those people...and the cycle continues. That's just common sense economics mate.

Well said.

[Dribs]

Siamese eredeti hozzászólása:

If someone want's to do the kind of "work" you think they should, which lets be clear is just PVP, then vehicles have to be out driving around.

I'd call it exploring myself. Go on a journey. Discover yourself. Maybe find a car in the end, either by finding a base, finding a fresh spawn or shooting someone out of it.

Siamese eredeti hozzászólása:

To go further to address this argument of hording increasing value i would also add that when a player does get a vehicle they are in fact WAY more likely to not use it simply for fear of losing it because of the over inflated value created by hording. So the hording behavior just encourages more hording behavior.

Yes, but if you call vehicles a luxury, you call it a luxury because people are hoarding them to keep them from other people. I guess you also stow away jewelry as well right? Maybe people put their valuables in a safe?

I'm not saying its good for having cars driving around the map, but I feel that sort of thing is highly dependent on the server.

And, let me also point out that on every server I'm on, I see it as my mission to liberate all the cars from the clutches of the hoarders (and of course take all their sweet loot for myself). Thats my kind of fun in this game.

Siamese eredeti hozzászólása:

In the end they can't build the game around this idea that the servers will mostly be low pop so vehicles will need added value. They have to assume full servers with thousands of players when planning these types of balancing issues.

Idk man. We'll just have to wait and see.

Siamese eredeti hozzászólása:

Lastly, i can make a point on a conversation with out you having a point in the conversation.

Yeah, but that post you made kind of made me feel like you were projecting some sort of opinion or viewpoint on me, when all I was doing was basically explaining how the game works, and how probable it would be for him to actually find a car that had spawned because he destroyed one. I mean, you quoted me as well. You kind of even said like "this is not the point" and kept going on about what the point actually is, when that wasnt even what I was talking about.

[Siamese]

torq eredeti hozzászólása:

Siamese eredeti hozzászólása:

If someone want's to do the kind of "work" you think they should, which lets be clear is just PVP, then vehicles have to be out driving around.

I'd call it exploring myself. Go on a journey. Discover yourself. Maybe find a car in the end, either by finding a base, finding a fresh spawn or shooting someone out of it.

Siamese eredeti hozzászólása:

To go further to address this argument of hording increasing value i would also add that when a player does get a vehicle they are in fact WAY more likely to not use it simply for fear of losing it because of the over inflated value created by hording. So the hording behavior just encourages more hording behavior.

Yes, but if you call vehicles a luxury, you call it a luxury because people are hoarding them to keep them from other people. I guess you also stow away jewelry as well right? Maybe people put their valuables in a safe?

I'm not saying its good for having cars driving around the map, but I feel that sort of thing is highly dependent on the server.

And, let me also point out that on every server I'm on, I see it as my mission to liberate all the cars from the clutches of the hoarders (and of course take all their sweet loot for myself). Thats my kind of fun in this game.

Siamese eredeti hozzászólása:

In the end they can't build the game around this idea that the servers will mostly be low pop so vehicles will need added value. They have to assume full servers with thousands of players when planning these types of balancing issues.

Idk man. We'll just have to wait and see.

Siamese eredeti hozzászólása:

Lastly, i can make a point on a conversation with out you having a point in the conversation.

Yeah, but that post you made kind of made me feel like you were projecting some sort of opinion or viewpoint on me, when all I was doing was basically explaining how the game works, and how probable it would be for him to actually find a car that had spawned because he destroyed one. I mean, you quoted me as well. You kind of even said like "this is not the point" and kept going on about what the point actually is, when that wasnt even what I was talking about.

"..Well, work could be a lot of things. Camping bridges, camping gas stations, dumping on to one randomly on the road and killing the drivers, or stealing it from a garage or a base...",

Your words, All these options are PVP options, not simply exploring but actively taking a vehicle away from another player. The point is, there should be greater options for non-pvp related acquisition. Which brings me to the discussion you and Chef-uk had that i weighed in on. He is talking about cars being destroyed and being placed in random circulation and you are in response as basically taking the stance that doesn't help people who's vehicle is destroyed because it's random and no one will be insured to get the vehicle back, which is true and not being disputed. That's where i expanded on the discussion by adding the bit about mobility economy to enhance further the point HE and not you were trying to make. I simply responded to the last post between the two of you. Since you were making a remark at the end that struck me as pompous i decided to take a jab at you for the same. If that made it seem focused at you it may be that you put too much weight on your own value in the conversation even though there was a third party.

That's one misunderstanding now another...I'm calling it a luxury because it's a luxury not for the reason you are presenting me with for why I'm calling it a luxury. The reason i gave is the reason i gave, but you didn't quote that part of the post. Because hording generates scarcity doesn't make hording the only thing that adds value. As has already been stated several times 64 vehicles on a server with 1000+ members is going to create scarcity even if every one of the 64 vehicles are owned by a different person. Hording just makes the situation worse. "i guess we'll see" isn't how games get developed. You don't develop a game PLANNING for low server pop...that would be plain stupid. Imagine that logic applied to almost any other part of the game. It would result in disaster. The systems in place have to be accountable to the reality of a the game being successful or it will never be successful. Hording is a behavior that exists regardless of server pop and has a directly proportional impact on the server the more people are on it. It's as if you think people who want to have a vehicle should either PVP or play on low pop servers. Which i must say isn't terribly different than your views on other topics..."play on my terms or play on another server" it what it sounds like.

[HunterKiller]

Bunny eredeti hozzászólása:

Complete disassembly of vehicles is not planned for the time being.

Good. Thanks.

[TacShooter]

I think it should take A LOT longer to repair a vehicle, too.

[insettoinfetto]

MS. Green Label eredeti hozzászólása:

and remember when the next wipe comes be online or all the cars will be gone within 1-2 hours for the next 6 months until the following wipe

takes minutes for groups to spawn grab a car at the nearest town then drive to the next one and hide it, then they will build a base and gather them all up when normal people sleep

might be a bit harder with the map expansion but there you go, this is how it is

+100

That's the point. Something that will still happen in future, no matter how big the map will be or the vehicles cap limit.

[Dribs]

insettoinfetto eredeti hozzászólása:

MS. Green Label eredeti hozzászólása:

and remember when the next wipe comes be online or all the cars will be gone within 1-2 hours for the next 6 months until the following wipe

takes minutes for groups to spawn grab a car at the nearest town then drive to the next one and hide it, then they will build a base and gather them all up when normal people sleep

might be a bit harder with the map expansion but there you go, this is how it is

+100

That's the point. Something that will still happen in future, no matter how big the map will be or the vehicles cap limit.

Its how it is, and as long as thats the way it works I dont really have a problem with it.

As a fresh start on any server, at any point - part of the initial challenge, is getting a car. I enjoy that challenge. Its part of why I enjoy the game.

And in that context I might as well mention that a fresh start on a new server, is the absolute most enjoyable part of this game in my opinion. I think its sad that, at least what it seems like to me, that the majority of people only have eyes for the end goal, watching their boxes fill up with piles of loot they'll never really use - when its the absolute beginning thats the most fun and interesting.

If you sit in your ivory tower with all the loot, what is there to do right?

Anyway, just a small digression there, and just simply my opinion.

[Father Lamb]

Want a car? Chime in to your "INNER STALKER" CheekiBreeki and steal it the best way you can!