Everyone in this game is a terrible person.

[Demiser of D]

I really like the game, but I have a hard time playing it for very long, because of how awful all the characters are. I'm honestly struggling to find a single good guy in the entire story, and the game takes deliberate pleasure in brutally murdering every good guy you come across.

Like Helena Pierce. One of the few good, lawful people from the first game. She then gets mutilated, her husband gets killed, and then she gets murdered.

Or take Blue the giant Crystallisk. This thing started out friendly, with the friendly security officer. Who then gets murdered, making the crystallisks murderous as well, and in the end you brutally murder the once-good wild animal.

There is not a single point in the story where I can point at and say, "There. I did something good there."

Eventually the constant grimderp just pushes me to a state of utter lack of caring. I'm not even enjoying myself, because I've sunk below the ability to appreciate anything, good or bad.

It doesn't have to be constant. I get it, we're not heroes, we're Vault Hunters. But does absolutely everything we do HAVE to be twisted around into abject misery? I feel so bad about it I find it impossible to keep playing for too long at a time, or risk sinking into depression.

[Blake]

Originally posted by Demiser of D:

the game takes deliberate pleasure in brutally murdering every good guy you come across.

Its all part of the fun

[Skrubmeister]

The story is what it is. Place is essentially ♥♥♥♥♥♥, shrouded in war with Hyperion. Jack wanted to clean the planet by killing all the bandits. The story technically tries to tell that there isn't such a thing as a hero and it's everyone for themselves. Like real life. Society isn't that much different from this if you cut all the crap. It's a subtle message with a humorous tone. Just be glad it isn't as bad in real life as in the game. If you don't like the grim atmosphere, try a different RPS with a more heroic story.

[Mylar]

I guess this means he got as far as the spoon story.

[Saint.Million]

If you want happiness and unicorns then maybe the Borderlands franchise isn't for you.

But hey, there's double rainbows at least...

[Demiser of D]

Originally posted by copperrein:

Whatever you do...do NOT get Assault on Dragon Keep...
...or at least don't finish it.

Actually, Dragon Keep was one of the few exceptions.

In pretending to be other people, the characters for once display a vestige of humanity, and Tiny Tina actually has a positive character development.

Of course, immediately afterwards they go to kill more people, so it's promptly lost. But still, it was one of a very few nice moments.

Originally posted by Nakos:

Originally posted by Demiser of D:

It doesn't have to be constant. I get it, we're not heroes, we're Vault Hunters. But does absolutely everything we do HAVE to be twisted around into abject misery? I feel so bad about it I find it impossible to keep playing for too long at a time, or risk sinking into depression.

Dude, the title song is literally: This Ain't No Place For A Hero

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VK3fjJqeVu4

That said, yeah, it's a lawless border world, a "hive of scum and villainy" if you will. If it was a NICE place, then it would be a different game, since the point of the game is shooting stuff.

I would argue that Roland is a decent guy. Maya's pretty decent too. So's Claptrap.

But the point remains, that much of it is relative. The Vault Hunters are the heroes because everyone else is worse. Have you never watched Firefly? The sub-genre has considerable appeal.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-sp68GjYL0

Even in Firefly, the main characters occasionally do something for no other reason than because it's the right thing to do. Saving River and Simon, for example. They even acknowledge it in the scene, recognizing that they're doing it for no other reason than to be a hero. Mal is a good guy in a tough universe.

The Vault Hunters, by contrast, are bad people in an even worse universe. The fact the universe is a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ doesn't make their bad actions or greed somehow good.

Roland is good, yeah. Sorta. But he's got all the character of a toilet paper roll and then gets killed. Claptrap is actively an ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥, so again, a lighter shade of black doesn't change it from being black. And Maya's a pov character.

Again, I get it. This is a dark universe. But even bad people can do good things every once in a while. In BL2, they never, ever do.

[x-REYNOLDS-x]

Originally posted by Starbug:

Hope you don't mind but I've taken them liberty of translating your op-ed into gangsta speak.

I really like da game, N' therez Ain't nuthin' but i have a hard time playin' dat ♥♥♥♥ fo' very long, bcuz' o' how tha ♥♥♥♥ awful all da characters r'. I'm honestly strugglin' ta find a single wack thug in tha entire story, n' tha game takes deliberate arousal in brutally murderin' every wack thug yo' come across.

like helena pierce. One o' da few wack, lawful people from da first game. ♥♥♥♥♥♥ then gets mutilated, her ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ husband gets killed, n' then ♥♥♥♥♥♥ gets murdered.

or take blue tha giant crystallisk. Dis thang started out friendly, wit' tha friendly security offica. Who the ♥♥♥♥ then gets murdered, makin' da crystallisks murderous as well ♥♥♥♥♥♥,, n' in da end yo' brutally murda da once-good wild animal.

there be not a single point in tha story Where the ♥♥♥♥ i can point at n' say, "there. I did somethang wack there."

eventually da constant grimderp just pushes me ta a state o' utta lack o' carin'. I'm not even enjoyin' mah dirty ass, bcuz' i've sunk below tha ability ta appreciate anything, wack or shizzle.

dat ♥♥♥♥ doesn't have ta be constant. I git dat ♥♥♥♥, we're not heroes, we're vault hunters. N' therez Ain't nuthin' but does absolutely everythin' we do have ta be twisted 'round da ♥♥♥♥ into abject misery? i feel so shizzle 'bout dat ♥♥♥♥ i find dat ♥♥♥♥ impossible ta keep playin' fo' too long at a time, or risk sinkin' da ♥♥♥♥ into depression.

Better? No?

At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a funny post. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no internet points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

[trukr]

Originally posted by x-REYNOLDS-x:

At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a funny post. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no internet points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

I see what you did there, and recognized it by the seventh word. That, was pretty funny.

[Nakos]

Originally posted by Demiser of D:

Even in Firefly, the main characters occasionally do something for no other reason than because it's the right thing to do. Saving River and Simon, for example. They even acknowledge it in the scene, recognizing that they're doing it for no other reason than to be a hero. Mal is a good guy in a tough universe.

The Vault Hunters, by contrast, are bad people in an even worse universe. The fact the universe is a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ doesn't make their bad actions or greed somehow good.

Roland is good, yeah. Sorta. But he's got all the character of a toilet paper roll and then gets killed. Claptrap is actively an ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥, so again, a lighter shade of black doesn't change it from being black. And Maya's a pov character.

Again, I get it. This is a dark universe. But even bad people can do good things every once in a while. In BL2, they never, ever do.

<shrugs>

Roland is actively a force for good on Pandora, he establishes a Sanctuary town and does everything he can to keep the people there safe. Your initial complaint was that no one was good. When that's your initial complaint, you don't get to dismiss Roland's selfless, altruistic actions simply because you don't like him. Or even because you think he's poorly written.

Lilith goes out of her way to rescue civilians from the Cultists in Frostburn Canyon.

No matter what you think of them as people, Lilith, Mordecai and Brick all work to try to preserve Roland's vision (at considerable cost to themselves) following his death.

The fact that Maya is a PoV character doesn't change her backstory. (She overthrows a religious tyrant, and then comes to Pandora seeking knowledge).

Even Salvador rescues his home town from the Jackbooted invaders.

If you don't WANT to like the game you don't have to, that's your decision. But there are forces for good in the game, you can't just dismiss those.

It's set on a lawless border world because a game in a happy friendly place where everyone was nice to each other wouldn't work (given the type of game it is (one where you shoot people)). You're supposed to be the "new sheriff in town". There are good people, and even altruistic ones in the game. But your business is with the bad ones. That's the genre.

[[R] Nerva]

Pandora is a gritty, brutal place where the best you can really hope for is to either have a gun bigger than the next guy's, or know someone who does. Heroism is relative, jackasses are everywhere, and even most of the wildlife would be content to see you dead.

Originally posted by Demiser of D:

Again, I get it. This is a dark universe. But even bad people can do good things every once in a while. In BL2, they never, ever do.

That's patently false. You're deliberately ignoring what good actions the player characters of BL2 actually do

The very same character that perpetuates a massacre of one of the two biggest feuding clans on Pandora can also help a starving pet skag find a home.

The very same character that shot Blue in the Caustic Caverns to reclaim some porn can save a town from dying of the Skull Shivers and both shield a town from Hyperion aggression and get rid of a horrible misogynist in the process.

When you shoot Doc Mercy in Three Horns, and get your first experience with an E-Tech weapon, you're shooting a bastard of a doctor that, in the words of Zed, "is more interested in makin' wounds than treatin' 'em."

You free Lynchwood from the tyranny of its newly Hyperion-appointed Sheriff. Admittedly, this is after robbing the place's bank, but considering that the place is almost entirely populated by various kinds of bandit, I doubt any of the money in it was legitimately obtained.

A bit more morally gray, but you help Tiny Tina get revenge on the guy who sold her family into slavery to Hyperion and scarred her for life, and help Mordecai get revenge for the death of Bloodwing. Killing Lynchwood's sheriff gets revenge for the murder of Brick's pet dog.

Your efforts save Sanctuary from being bombed from orbit by Jack on two occasions.

If you don't finger a suspect, you can solve a murder in Sanctuary and get the right person punished. You can also resolve a dispute before it turns violent. Both of these are at the request of Sanctuary's sheriff.

That's just a few of the good things you can do. Sure, yeah, you do a lot of terrible crap too, but it's like the game's opening song says - Pandora's no place for heroes. Heroes on Pandora quickly wind up in graves, or turn into villains. Instead, you do good where you can and look out for yourself at all other times.

If you want to play an unambiguous hero... you're playing the wrong game.

[Ignorance]

Depression is a healthy mind's reaction to an unhealthy world.

[trukr]

Originally posted by ---(((Ignorance)))---:

Depression is a healthy mind's reaction to an unhealthy world.

Or, a weak mind to a tough world.

[Vilda]

dude, i hate to bring it to you but everyone has their own opinion about this game. I love this game so i didnt even take my time reading your hate as im sure many of others did so as well.
0 F*CKS GIVEN MAH DUDE

[Vader]

Simple...play another game then...atleast BL has its own identity and personally im fine with that.
To many games now are copy and past with a different title.
And most games that are made now have to make everyone happy or appeal to a certain crowd.

Put it this way if you have a football game...it should be football....nothing else and yet so many want it to be what they want.

I think BL is one of the few games for me that stands out because they made it their way and thats that.
Fans are fans because of that reason.
Take a look at the gaming market of how many studios do it there way...not many...but i can assure you they are some of the best games around.

[TreyUwU]

If you're having a depression while playing a video game, you might need to go out and see some people

Games are maybe taking too much of your life