Having more players increases chance of world drops

[Cactoos]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2hSvF5Qjpg I wish I knew that some were actually running this to get the cobra faster during the hunt...

[Nakos]

Well... that depends. Assuming you're running a vanilla game, having more players means more total kills, so more total loot, but ...

It's actually less loot per individual kill.

See Paul Hellquist's blog post on the subject: http://www.gearboxsoftware.com/2013/09/inside-the-box-the-borderlands-2-loot-system/

The community patch supposedly increases a lot of drop rates, but ... if they're doing the Loot Hunt, they shouldn't be using that.

[Chispon]

Originally posted by Nakos:

Well... that depends. Assuming you're running a vanilla game, having more players means more total kills, so more total loot, but ...

It's actually less loot per individual kill.

See Paul Hellquist's blog post on the subject: http://www.gearboxsoftware.com/2013/09/inside-the-box-the-borderlands-2-loot-system/

The community patch supposedly increases a lot of drop rates, but ... if they're doing the Loot Hunt, they shouldn't be using that.

I don't know if the OP was joking or he didn't even understand the video he posted.
The video talks about the real effect discovered of the Vault Hunter relic, apparently it decreases the chances of white weapons to drop, so you avoid rolling whites and get higher tiers more often.

[Nakos]

Mm.. haven't looked at the video (don't have the time at the moment).

Sure, the Vault Hunter Relic does do that, but it's a tiny, tiny percentage chance change (according to my understanding): http://borderlands.wikia.com/wiki/Vault_Hunter%27s_Relic

[Chispon]

Originally posted by Nakos:

Mm.. haven't looked at the video (don't have the time at the moment).

Sure, the Vault Hunter Relic does do that, but it's a tiny, tiny percentage chance change (according to my understanding): http://borderlands.wikia.com/wiki/Vault_Hunter%27s_Relic

But I said it decreases, not increases xD
So for example while weapons have a 89% chances to drop, I believe the chances are reduced to 60% with the relic, if I'm not mistaken.

[Nakos]

Did you look at the link?

Rarity	% Before Relic	% After Relic Applied
Common	89.92%	89.5%
Uncommon	8.99%	9.4%
Rare	0.89%	0.9%
Very Rare	0.09%	0.094%
E-tech	0.09%	0.094%
Legendary	0.009%*	0.0094%*

Edit: Better formating, hopefully ...

[z00t]

I think the video is saying that if 4 players all use the relic, a large percentage of white weapons is removed from the loot calculations at the start, so the rarer items have more of a chance to drop simply because they are no longer competing with white items in the calculations.

Enemy dies, the game decides something is to be dropped, then calculates what to drop from the loot pool, but if the loot pool white items are drastically reduced, other rarities get more of a chance, so increased drop rates of non-white rarity items.

That is my understanding of it anyway.

[Mister Torgue Flexington]

Originally posted by z00t:

I think the video is saying that if 4 players all use the relic, a large percentage of white weapons is removed from the loot calculations at the start, so the rarer items have more of a chance to drop simply because they are no longer competing with white items in the calculations.

Enemy dies, the game decides something is to be dropped, then calculates what to drop from the loot pool, but if the loot pool white items are drastically reduced, other rarities get more of a chance, so increased drop rates of non-white rarity items.

That is my understanding of it anyway.

sounds like they might be somewhat useful after all

[Lord Cyphre]

Originally posted by Mister Torgue Flexington:

sounds like they might be somewhat useful after all

Not really in my opinion.

It has no effect on boss droprates, so you're sacrificing efficiency for a slightly better chance at world drops.

Let me quote the pinned comment from that video:

Originally posted by LightChaosman:

Some extra info: "60% less whites" is what it does in the code. What this means in practice: Normally a drop you get from a normal enemy, 89% of them are white, 11% are non-whites. Reducing the rate of whites by "60%" makes it so you get 84% whites, instead of 89% whites, which is where the 5% comes from.
this means you go from 11% chance for non-garbage to 16% non-garbage, effectively boosting the rates by about 50%. How does 60% translate to 5% you ask? math which is too long for a YT comment section.

So you're still going to get more whites than anything else. The effect stacks while multiple relics are active but enemies also get a lot stronger in coop. Do you really want to lose cooldown reduction, bonus elemental damage, firerate, increased ammo capacity and whatnot just to see less whites?

Again it does not increase droprates for bosses et. al., so it is of no help while farming for specific items.

However the relic does help with the Cobra as the video explains. That is pretty much the single niche use it has (and it certainly is a very nice niche to fill) but I wouldn't waste a gear slot or backpack space on all my toons just for that.

[Chispon]

Originally posted by Nakos:

Did you look at the link?

Rarity	% Before Relic	% After Relic Applied
Common	89.92%	89.5%
Uncommon	8.99%	9.4%
Rare	0.89%	0.9%
Very Rare	0.09%	0.094%
E-tech	0.09%	0.094%
Legendary	0.009%*	0.0094%*

Edit: Better formating, hopefully ...

Don't know what you were trying to proof, but those numbers might be wrong after all. Wikis are not always true.

[Nodoka]

Originally posted by Mister Torgue Flexington:

Originally posted by z00t:

I think the video is saying that if 4 players all use the relic, a large percentage of white weapons is removed from the loot calculations at the start, so the rarer items have more of a chance to drop simply because they are no longer competing with white items in the calculations.

Enemy dies, the game decides something is to be dropped, then calculates what to drop from the loot pool, but if the loot pool white items are drastically reduced, other rarities get more of a chance, so increased drop rates of non-white rarity items.

That is my understanding of it anyway.

sounds like they might be somewhat useful after all

Not worth to give up a relic slot for it imo.

[Mister Torgue Flexington]

Originally posted by Nodoka100%:

Originally posted by Mister Torgue Flexington:

sounds like they might be somewhat useful after all

Not worth to give up a relic slot for it imo.

well now, I stand corrected

[Cactoos]

Originally posted by Chispon:

I don't know if the OP was joking or he didn't even understand the video he posted.

I honesty did not understand clearly what it does even after I watched the video (Hence why I was silent for the most part).

In a recap, this new info only affects world drops from chests or enemies, and not legendary drops from specific bosses. This ultimately takes up the relic slot utility for increased world drop chances.

My last few "what-ifs": If this increases the chance of getting a cobra from burners, does this affect unique rare drops such as the hive from saturn? Could using the VH relic be useful in places like the Leviathan's Treasure Room or HSS Terminus Chest Room? Would it have any impact on LLMs?

edit: changed title to be more appropriate

[Mister Torgue Flexington]

Originally posted by Cactoos:

Originally posted by Chispon:

I don't know if the OP was joking or he didn't even understand the video he posted.

I honesty did not understand clearly what it does even after I watched the video (Hence why I was silent for the most part).

In a recap, this new info only affects world drops from chests or enemies, and not legendary drops from specific bosses. This ultimately takes up the relic slot utility for increased world drop chances.

My last few "what-ifs": If this increases the chance of getting a cobra from burners, does this affect unique rare drops such as the hive from saturn? Could using the VH relic be useful in places like the Leviathan's Treasure Room or HSS Terminus Chest Room? Would it have any impact on LLMs?

edit: changed title to be more appropriate

now that would be interesting to see

[Lord Cyphre]

Every time one of Pete's burners drops a sniper rifle, if that weapon spawns with purple rarity then it has a .88% chance (not 88%, but 0.88%: that's 88 in 10,000) to be the Cobra.

http://borderlands.wikia.com/wiki/Cobra_(Borderlands_2)

That's why it works for the Cobra,the relic increases your chances of purple drops. It does not affect any other specific item drops whatsoever; it won't help you get any drops from Saturn or LLMs.

The special chests in the Leviathans lair will always reward you with gear of atleast blue rarity. Reducing the chances of finding whites won't do anything to them.

[Nakos]

Originally posted by Chispon:

Don't know what you were trying to proof, but those numbers might be wrong after all. Wikis are not always true.

I'm not trying to prove anything. I'm linking a valid source so that you can educate yourself as to how useful the Relic in question actually is. While wikis certainly can be wrong, the game has been out for 6 years, and the devs have been fairly open about the math behind the numbers. But hey, if you've got a better source, feel free to link it.

You might want to chat with Lord Cyphre first though, because his grasp of the underlying mechanics of the game is pretty much unparalleled amongst the more frequent forum goers, and his explanation coralates pretty closely with those numbers.

The Relic never seemed too useful to me, although the idea that it works better in groups is interesting, it has little impact on me.