Naval spotting.

[amcewen2]

So does your spotting task force and your strike task force have to be in the same fleet or just have to share coverage zones?

[Bored Peon]

Your strike fleet will go after any enemy fleet that is spotted, it does not matter what spotted it. It could be spotted by planes or even spotted by ships/convoys being attacked.

Personally I put my spotting fleet under a different admiral because I aim for having spotting fleets with speeds of 37km or better so they can earn Blockade Runner which gives them concealment and a bonus to Retreat Decision. Simply because while you may set your tiny fleet to low risk, that does not stop huge enemy fleets from intercepting them, then the admiral still has to go through the normal retreat decisions.

If designed right you can actually get a pretty capable fleet with battlecruisers, carriers, and heavy cruisers that all have a speed of 37km or better.

I also sometimes use these fleets as trainers to get the blockade runner for submarine admirals so submarines fleet can get the concealment trait.

[OnlyPhans69]

it doesn't have to be, if I'm just doomstacking task forces under one strong admiral I personally like to give them one task force of like 5-8 light cruisers designed to spot & nothing else & make sure to set only that task force to never engage, however I'd never recommend relying on only that though, it is easy af for even the ai to sink those LC's and leave you scrambling to get some back in there.

[pjd110]

If you want to draw out the enemy fleet use some trashy ships as surface raiders. This draws them out a little better than sub raiders. If you give the enemy fleet a reason to come out and fight they will. If you aren't being engaged then they are probably repairing.

[Bored Peon]

Originally posted by OnlyPhans69:

....it is easy af for even the ai to sink those LC's and leave you scrambling to get some back in there.

Yeah the patrol fleets tend to get spotted the most and take heavy damage every time.

Leaving them set to engage usually aint a problem if you keep it at low risk, the problem comes when they get engaged by an enemy doomstack/strike fleet (which is going to happen on do not engage jsut as well.) They can actually earn quite a bit of xp chasing subs and taking out the enemy escort fleets (which are usually a few destroyers and a few cruisers.)

Usually I found using 10 destroyers and 2-4 light cruisers for a spotting fleet to work well. One light cruiser being a spotting design with scout planes and the other light cruiser being loaded up with light batteries. Later on I will toss in 2 heavy cruisers and a small aircraft carrier (need multiple capital ships to keep carriers floating for those screen penetrations.)

FYI, Early destroyers should just be sent on suicide missions or thrown into an armada strike force as cannon fodder. Destroyer wont last until you have at least 1936 hulls. That 25hp on Early Destroyers makes them drop like flies.

The other thing I forgot to mention, patrol fleets work best under their own admirals because the skills they should learn are not as beneficial to an armada strike fleet.

[Bored Peon]

Originally posted by pjd110:

If you aren't being engaged then they are probably repairing.

I have researched this over the years. If the enemy has naval superiority points in an ocean zone and you never see them then:
- The fleets are sitting in a harbor somewhere on strike or naval invasion mission.
- A fleet sitting in harbor repairing does not give the naval superiority points to sea zones.
- I think the AI sucks at spotting fleets (or your commanders too good at concealment) and the AI simply cannot see your fleets to come out and engage.
- Enemy naval superiority is a combined total of enemy fleets from different countries. Sometimes the AI has a ton of tiny fleets that will not come out to engage because of the risk factor.

The AI having naval superiority while sitting in a harbor has got to be one of the most annoying things about naval combat.

It is too bad they did not do an air raid mission for harbors in the DLC.

[OnlyPhans69]

Originally posted by Bored Peon:

Originally posted by pjd110:

If you aren't being engaged then they are probably repairing.

I have researched this over the years. If the enemy has naval superiority points in an ocean zone and you never see them then:
- The fleets are sitting in a harbor somewhere on strike or naval invasion mission.
- A fleet sitting in harbor repairing does not give the naval superiority points to sea zones.
- I think the AI sucks at spotting fleets (or your commanders too good at concealment) and the AI simply cannot see your fleets to come out and engage.
- Enemy naval superiority is a combined total of enemy fleets from different countries. Sometimes the AI has a ton of tiny fleets that will not come out to engage because of the risk factor.

The AI having naval superiority while sitting in a harbor has got to be one of the most annoying things about naval combat.

It is too bad they did not do an air raid mission for harbors in the DLC.

from what I can tell the AI use their light cruisers and DD's to spot within whatever fleet they're a part of, you know all those times you've chewed through Japan's cruiser fleet & suddenly it seems like the AI gets real historic with deploying their navy? in my experience once they lose "too many" CL's the AI will literally just give up naval supremacy in that area and start focusing on getting whatever naval invasions they have lined up off, or they get super defensive and re-organise their entire navy to get enough ships under one admiral to spot/convoy escort with.

if paradox ever gets the AI to make spotting ships that alone would help the naval side of things so much lol, because as it is now it really isn't hard to level someone like the royal navy with like two carriers, a battlecruiser and some half decent screens and not lose anything significant in the process, it is especially noticeable with the Brits imo because of just how big the royal navy is, if you build literally 1 or 2 cruiser killier BC's to accompany some CV's the AI does not know how to operate its navy against that.
idk what it is but there is something very funny about how the AI sets ships to patrol that seems to completely handicap them, might just be the design/speed of the ships but im not sure.

[Bored Peon]

Originally posted by OnlyPhans69:

idk what it is but there is something very funny about how the AI sets ships to patrol that seems to completely handicap them, might just be the design/speed of the ships but im not sure.

I have reason to believe it is because:

Torpedo spam, and lack of it.
My last game I decided to make my coast guard destroyer have mining gear to lay and clear mines rather than the extra torpedoes. I took a lot more losses of destroyers in that game. Looking at most the AI design ships rarely even have stuff in the top design line, which means they are basically undergeared.

Automatic split off
The AI uses this, I do not know how many times I see the AI break off with capital ships to send them to repair and they get waylaid along the way.

Poor port choices
AI will choose low level ports and put the fleets out of action like forever. It will do the same to you as well, except as a player you can control click the ports to never repair.

[OnlyPhans69]

Originally posted by Bored Peon:

Originally posted by OnlyPhans69:

idk what it is but there is something very funny about how the AI sets ships to patrol that seems to completely handicap them, might just be the design/speed of the ships but im not sure.

I have reason to believe it is because:

Torpedo spam, and lack of it.
My last game I decided to make my coast guard destroyer have mining gear to lay and clear mines rather than the extra torpedoes. I took a lot more losses of destroyers in that game. Looking at most the AI design ships rarely even have stuff in the top design line, which means they are basically undergeared.

Automatic split off
The AI uses this, I do not know how many times I see the AI break off with capital ships to send them to repair and they get waylaid along the way.

Poor port choices
AI will choose low level ports and put the fleets out of action like forever. It will do the same to you as well, except as a player you can control click the ports to never repair.

that first point is super interesting because for me I'll do simple stuff like add the best AA possible to everything, especially my screens & while not immediately noticeable after about 6 months to a year of fighting any major naval power in game, they're pretty much out of carrier naval bombers/cas.
and while I know very well just how broken BB's and BC's can still be the AI is kinda of a joke when it's reduced to just battleships imo.

if they got the AI to design a roach & made them add more AA to things I think they'd make the navy side of things a lot more interesting