Soviet ai cannot beat ai Germany

[uncle_palpatine]

9 times out of 10 in single player, the Soviet’s get pushed back and usually lose Moscow and/or Leningrad during the Germans invasion. Even after d-day has happened and the Allie’s have pushed into Germany proper, the Germans still always keep a large chunk of the Soviet Union. Why is this?

[Dr. Heavy Pootis-Man]

It depends on what nations you play, when I play South/Central american countries I can see Japan win against china everytime, but when I play as a european nation japan gets pushed back all the way to korea and lose. For me the soviets win every single time, the most recent one I've seen the germans push them to eastern latvia and thats it then they lose romania somehow and then bulgaria and they just get clapped instantly.

[ねえ牛タン食べたい]

too many debuffs for soviet and ai too noob to solve them

[drewbstar]

Originally posted by lat1neff:

too many debuffs for soviet and ai too noob to solve them

This is a big part. The AI doesn't handle purges/focus tree pathing very well.

In addition, the USSR's economy is awful. It starts heavily weakened and has most of its industry concentrated in the areas first to go. The idea is that the Allies need to support the USSR via lend lease but they never do in sufficient quantities.

Plus the whole area is a poorly supplied mix of swamps, hills, and forests. Areas that are hard to fight in unless you have a significant advantage in, say, a massive airforce and better army.

With players you can easily make a few decisions to greatly reduce the problems the AI has to sit on. Purges, industry, military all get attention. It's smart to completely ignore the navy in the focus tree until much later in the game because you need to focus on clearing your debuffs or finishing the 5 year plan. You have a limited number of focuses you can complete before you end up at war with a major, either locking your economy or putting you at a massive disadvantage with your debuffs.

[Gamer Maid]

You should use expert AI. And be ready to make a lot of planes ^^

[CaptainSpacetime]

Germany is ahistorically super-buffed is the reason.

Game wouldn't be much fun if Germany was historically powered since with 20/20 hindsight Germany wouldn't even be able to take out France/the Low Countries.

That plus getting the Soviets on the right foot needs a lot of focus tree stuff that the AI is bad at managing.

[Viceroy Günther von Lichler]

Yeah, in a ironic and not at all unexpected twist the expansion that was all about the USSR also broke it completely.
Buffing them to the max at game start helps a lot, and trading with them to give them extra factories.

[|H|H| Fr3ddi3]

At the end of the day the devs have gone on record numerous times stating that Germany will Beat Russia unless the Allies do enough to stop it, this was said before the DLC landed and there is no reason for that to have changed, the DLC is not about making AI Russia better, it's about giving player Russia a more involved game.

I'm not going to say that you have not done enough to support Russia, I simply do not know if you have or have not.

What I will say is that you cannot sit back and build up for a few years before sending D-Day and expect Russia to be fine with that.

In the real war for the UK that meant doing ALL of the following

Active ground war in Africa.
Coastal raids.
Espionage / sabotage.
Millions in lend lease.
The battle of Britain.
The strategic Bombing Campaigns.
Then eventually the invasion of Italy and D-Day.

People can argue all day long about how useful that all was or that Russia did not need any of it ... I don't care to debate it because it's irrelevant, the only fact that matters is that HOI4 uses that version of the war as it's reference point, ergo, you need to put in that kind of effort yourself to keep Russia in the Fight.

Or at least speeding the timeline along and doing something about Italy a year or 2 earlier.

[CaptainSpacetime]

^^^^
I wish the lend-lease system was more transparent so that you could send the Soviets what they need instead of just guessing at random.

And yeah if you're the allies and the Soviets are getting owned then do something. Stalin whining and moaning about a second front...

[Varenvel The Festive Dinosaur]

Originally posted by |H|H| Fr3ddi3:

At the end of the day the devs have gone on record numerous times stating that Germany will Beat Russia unless the Allies do enough to stop it, this was said before the DLC landed and there is no reason for that to have changed, the DLC is not about making AI Russia better, it's about giving player Russia a more involved game.

I'm not going to say that you have not done enough to support Russia, I simply do not know if you have or have not.

What I will say is that you cannot sit back and build up for a few years before sending D-Day and expect Russia to be fine with that.

In the real war for the UK that meant doing ALL of the following

Active ground war in Africa.
Coastal raids.
Espionage / sabotage.
Millions in lend lease.
The battle of Britain.
The strategic Bombing Campaigns.
Then eventually the invasion of Italy and D-Day.

People can argue all day long about how useful that all was or that Russia did not need any of it ... I don't care to debate it because it's irrelevant, the only fact that matters is that HOI4 uses that version of the war as it's reference point, ergo, you need to put in that kind of effort yourself to keep Russia in the Fight.

Or at least speeding the timeline along and doing something about Italy a year or 2 earlier.

becouse that what happened historicly , russia would lose the war if not incredible amount of land lease they did get (planes and tanks maybe not helped) but they recived trucks , fuel , ammo , radio equipment , food things they desperatly needed

example how big diffrance it makes your seeing..right now in ukraine , without "land lease" and giving away equipment , ukraine very likely would fall in first weeks

not to say allies opened fronts , africa/italy/france , kept preasure on the germans all the time

problem is AI is wierd and sending land lease and how it works is very odd , russia sadly does not get any/enough land lease from AI's

and opening fronts also not works super well from allies

[budisourdog]

The AI also doesn't build railways. Their supply network at the game start is atrocious and once they start getting pushed back they're fighting completely without infastructure, with many factories gone, with less manpower reserves. Their focus tree and economy also got mega nerfed, Germany's for comparison will give it +12 civ factories +10% construction speed some free refineries and 6 mils in the span of like 5 focuses, the Soviets get like 2 civs +5% building +5% repair etc. Germany also rolls over Poland, Czechslovakia and France taking their factories too. Sov AI throws troops and equipment into Spain and China and does useless naval focuses.
Not to mention the stupid paranoia mechanic (with zero grounding in factual reality) you purge your whole staff and can't get any buffs / Germany is pretty much garunteed to employ a staff giving +15% infantry boost +15% tanks +10% attack +8% recovery speed +10% divisions speed.
On top of it all, they get major penalties to airforce and army just handed to them at the start which require 4 or so focuses just to negate.

[Snizzlet]

Heh. Normally I'd agree, OP. But just yesterday I witnessed the most pathetic AI Germany I've ever seen. I played Nationalist Spain, won the SCW, then sat back at watched. Germany failed to even take France out. Got bogged down halfway thru Netherlands. AI USSR declared on Germany in 1939 (!) and Germany initially Barb'd fairly well, got Leningrad and Stalingrad, almost to the Urals, but USSR never cap'd. Eventually the tide turned and axis lost, hard. It was the worst showing for AI axis I've ever seen.

[CaptainSpacetime]

Originally posted by budisourdog:

Not to mention the stupid paranoia mechanic (with zero grounding in factual reality) you purge your whole staff and can't get any buffs

what? stalin literally purged his whole military because he was literally paranoid...

[Space Marine]

Originally posted by CaptainSpacetime:

^^^^
I wish the lend-lease system was more transparent so that you could send the Soviets what they need instead of just guessing at random.

This. That would be a nice way of reworking lend-lease a bit. We also need a better convoy system for lend-lease, instead of depending on the Soviets' convoys, it should use our convoys

[George Smith Patton]

I use a mod that gives the soviets 35 days for all focuses, ussally for myself, however sometimes ill play usa and see the soviets attack poland before germany does. If they didnt have to foght the allies though they would siginifgantly be better with this mod. They get buffed in late game, they just need to survive first. Before nsb, i would send hundreds of us divisions to russia while doing lend lease to help them, the AI isnt very good tbh when it comes to decesion making, like a robot theyll do what theyll told (take focuses even when they dont need too) without having the ability to relize they can get a few things free focus wise if they just be creative.

[George Smith Patton]

Originally posted by WarThunderIsMyReligion:

Originally posted by CaptainSpacetime:

^^^^
I wish the lend-lease system was more transparent so that you could send the Soviets what they need instead of just guessing at random.

This. That would be a nice way of reworking lend-lease a bit. We also need a better convoy system for lend-lease, instead of depending on the Soviets' convoys, it should use our convoys

Yes, this. I hate sending them convoys, its ahistorical and theyll use those convoys to invade germany via the baltic sea instead of using it for supplies...