Why are the Allies so damn weak and the Axis so damn Strong?

[MxKirin]

Bro i was playing the United States just chilling sleeping building my Navy and Air force and industry till i am awakened by japan attacking the Philippines you know the historical stuff i go over to Asia and Japan has like 70% of China in 1940 with china at 15% to capitulation i go over to Africa and Italy has taken the entire Eastern Part of the continent with Vichy controlling the Western Part then i see German Troops in London like how they get there and now the axis controls the entire Continent of Asia Europe and Africa like why is Britain and France so Incompetent its like i have to join the war at the very start for the allies to have a chance against Germany and this is all in 1940 i mind you 1 year after The Second Great War started on Ironman Mode with Achievements on so i did no strengthening with anybody

[Wingnut]

Originally posted by Big Dicc Marty:

Originally posted by Donut:

Well they did sit by for awhile but did end up joining to help

i think its important to mention that they weren't in the war from the start

no, nuckleheadmcspazamatron

the USA was sending an unfathomable amount of food, guns, ammo, clothes, trucks (1 million to the soviets alone), tanks, planes, raw materials, advanced industrial components, fuel, porn, tobacco, women, turbolasers, and anything else you can think of a war economy might need

they hadn't signed the paper that said "wii fite nao"

but for all intensive porpoises they were at war long before the end of '41

:murica::murica::murica::murica::murica::murica::murica::murica::murica::murica:

Lend lease only began in march 1941.
The first USN ships to start escort duties across the north Atlantic was in september 1941.
The first USN ship sunk in ww2 was in october 1941.
There was only a handlful of USN ships involved in convoy escort in the north Atlantic prior to US entry in ww2.
Lend lease contributed about 27% to the UK economy (largest share of lend lease 43% not including commonwealth 62% including commonwealth countries). Should note that the UK share was so high because a lot of the lend-lease was food not just war supplies.
Lend lease contributed about 14% to the USSR economy (second largest share 27%).

BTW the UK only finished paying off its lend-lease debt (including interest) in december 2006.
The Soviet Union and China did not pay back their lend lease debts.
OTOH the US did bankroll the complete rebuilding of Germany, Japan and Italy after ww2 for free.

Get off your high horse and read a book.

Dont get me wrong. All that help was absolutely crucial. It was the difference between victory and defeat.

[Wingnut]

Originally posted by Noldo:

Well, where to start.
To explain, talking about power, I will be comparing AI vs AI, because human to AI is incomparable.

What makes Allies weak in the game:
Allied AI programmed to fail completelly in the Pacific. Japan hhas aerial dominance and Naval Dominance. Allies should try to find, engage and destroy Japanese Navy. But US Navy ius on a Strike mission on Hawaii, never ever geting to a combat ever. British snd only very small fleets, which get destroyed by the Japanese. On the other hand, Japanese navy is very active even with major fleets. So, on historical, Japan dominates pacific in 47-48, being able to reconquer Malaya at that time no problem. Also, US should surpass and dominate Jpana primarly by naval production, but also by technology, doctrine and logistics in 44 the latest. They don't. When Europe is free from Axis, and there is peace, no European nation ever sends anything against Japan.

AI gives all Axis units under one control, so they get unified logisitics distirbution, unified front & strength distribution, unified attack. For Allies, it mostly doesnt. So Allies are not able to do synchornized attacks, and they commonly overextebnd supply hubs anbd ports. So, when Allies get ever to France, there is a line of 1-2 well supplied Axis units looking on a stock of undersuplied Allied units, belonging to X nations, who will never attack united, or even dare to attack at all.

Production - Historically, US was able to Lendlease most of UK army, Lend-Lease to the SU, and massivlelly outproduce both Axis and Japan. Soviet Union itself was outproducing Germany AF. In game - US military production hardly even catches up with Axis alone, so the US has not enough to send to the Soviet Union.

Allies were able to bombard germany into oblivion - in game - heh.

Historically Germany had severe lack of oil, rubber, tungsten, nickel, (food), trucks, steam engines, ... in game - no problem with anything.

Historically, Germany couldnt afford attack on the west before 04/40.. in game - half a year earlier.

Historically, Germany didnt apply total mobilization before 43-44 - in game - immediatelly.

Historically, German military procurement and production was a total mess till 43, compared to Allies and Soviet union. In game - pure perfection.

Historically, German logistics was a nightmare already before the war, in game - no issues.

Historically, Germany was almost broke and its purchase of resources was VERY complicated. In game - no issues.

Historically, German politics had many infigting, and was far from smoot. In Game - aside from some minors way hgihest PP income.

Historically, Germany began to collapse after 6M of losses. In game - 25 M of lossis and rolling! being ble to mobilize 30% of population and having Total Mobilization at the same time.

All mations, which got a reworked tree, got a TON of negative national spiritis - disjointed governments, isolationism, economic crisis, mobilization limitations, corruption, inflation, looming civil wars, etc etc. All of them. Except three - Germany, Italy and Japan. Those have no negative spirits. Because in PDX hearts and brains, fascist societies, unlike stinking democracies, are flawless.

Simply, in the eyes of PDX fascism is FLAWLESS. In every aspect. Democracies are weak, and Soviet union is a laghing stock. PDX even said that they had etuned Axis AI, but didnt tune Allied AI. Germany was left steamroling Soviet union for years, and PDX didnt care.

This game is a wehraboo/neo-nazi fan-fiction.

PDX and some poeple argument that Germany had to be boosted to get a chance. OK. Well, first - that should not mean that AI vs. AI, germany should keep steamrolling SU, and Japan steamroling China, and Allies not being able to defeat Japan and defeat Germany about in 45.

Second - they say it was made so that as an allied player it makes you try. This is a lie. OR - it would ONLY work if you play for the US, and IF you had at least a bit of capacity to save the SU, which you dont.

How does this Axis boost help the balance, when I play for SOviet union,PDX sais that SU without LL is programmed to fail, and Allied AI sends me fk all , even with +80 relations ?

How does this "balance" help when I play some minor fascist or neutral nation out of Europe, and SU collapses, and Allies act like a Zombie caught in some vines (and Axis AI doesnt)?

How does this balance help when you play an Allied or Comintern minor, or even China, and you see Allied major not being able to do anything ? I have been saving SU asa Mexico, as Dutch East Indies, as Canada,as Australia, et c. But I shouldnt!!!

Simply, PDX loves fascist countries, and hates SU.

Edit: The name, Hearts of Iron: that is what Hitler said about Reinhard heydrich, the author of the "final solution", "the Butcher from Prague" - "He has heart of Iron". So, you have the hint already in the name. Also, when you start the game, Germany is already preselected.

So in effect the 'historical' mode should be renamed 'ahistorical' mode and the 'ahistorical' mode should be renamed to 'farcical' mode. LOL.

[Big Moustache]

As USA i bought 13 civs worth of chromium from Soviets in 1937 and kept it until 41. In 41 Germany rolled them completely over, in less than a year taking Moscow Stalingrad and St Petersburg. Paradox likes milking us with dlc, but the game is incapable of handling/dealing with it

[Big [REDACTED] Marty]

Originally posted by Fragoos:

As USA i bought 13 civs worth of chromium from Soviets in 1937 and kept it until 41. In 41 Germany rolled them completely over, in less than a year taking Moscow Stalingrad and St Petersburg. Paradox likes milking us with dlc, but the game is incapable of handling/dealing with it

civs aren't enough, they need fighters, artillery, guns, and yes civs won't hurt either

[9BoltVattery]

honestly this might just be a result of me going from overly cautious to overly aggressive way too quickly, but i went from being able to confidently steamroll the soviets as germany to hitting a brick wall instantly just because i started the war (THROUGH THE FOCUS) less than a year late. went from a k:d ratio with the allies of 30:1 to 1:1 to 1:3 in a single month.
EDIT: for those wondering, the specific statistics in that game were somewhere around 7k germans dead to poland vs 235k poles dead, and later 15k germans dead to the allies and 450k allies dead to germany. i don't remember the specific numbers after the soviets entered, just know it was bad enough to make me immediately delete the save file and sleep for 10 hours


also seriously, i feel like everyone else exaggerates when talking about USA vs Japan in HOI4, because i was able to capitulate and peace out japan as USA before the end of 1940 just from the Panay incident on my first real game as USA (I should note this was before i got MtG, but long after i had gotten WTT, DoD, and TFV)

[Noldo]

Originally posted by 9VoltBattery:

honestly this might just be a result of me going from overly cautious to overly aggressive way too quickly, but i went from being able to confidently steamroll the soviets as germany to hitting a brick wall instantly just because i started the war (THROUGH THE FOCUS) less than a year late. went from a k:d ratio with the allies of 30:1 to 1:1 to 1:3 in a single month.
EDIT: for those wondering, the specific statistics in that game were somewhere around 7k germans dead to poland vs 235k poles dead, and later 15k germans dead to the allies and 450k allies dead to germany. i don't remember the specific numbers after the soviets entered, just know it was bad enough to make me immediately delete the save file and sleep for 10 hours


also seriously, i feel like everyone else exaggerates when talking about USA vs Japan in HOI4, because i was able to capitulate and peace out japan as USA before the end of 1940 just from the Panay incident on my first real game as USA (I should note this was before i got MtG, but long after i had gotten WTT, DoD, and TFV)

I think the problem is not "not being able as a human to [fill in here yourself]", but AI not being able to achieve what it historically did, where these AI failures tend to be balanced strongly in favour of Axis way beyond random.

[akistarplayz]

Originally posted by TasteDasRainbow:

Axis have stronger early game
Allies have stronger late game
Axis win early or Allies win late
without balance like that there is literally no ww2

No but everytime i play axis still wins in late game germany always takes over soviet union in 1942 and brits in 1944 or 1945

[Doctadeth]

US has to support the allies by Lend-leasing and volunteering until you get pearl harbor. Typically on historical, Japan will always go after China first (R*pe of Nanking and all that), and then start down the US tree from there. Combine that with Germany typically being good early game, and yes, Germany will steamroll most of Europe before the US can intervene....which again is Historical. Get into allies as a major player, land in Ireland and push over to the British isle, from there over the channel. then push over into germany.

Also depends on what difficulty you have.

[Blind]

Originally posted by Trooperz:

Bro i was playing the United States just chilling sleeping building my Navy and Air force and industry till i am awakened by japan attacking the Philippines you know the historical stuff i go over to Asia and Japan has like 70% of China in 1940 with china at 15% to capitulation i go over to Africa and Italy has taken the entire Eastern Part of the continent with Vichy controlling the Western Part then i see German Troops in London like how they get there and now the axis controls the entire Continent of Asia Europe and Africa like why is Britain and France so Incompetent its like i have to join the war at the very start for the allies to have a chance against Germany and this is all in 1940 i mind you 1 year after The Second Great War started on Ironman Mode with Achievements on so i did no strengthening with anybody

It definitely takes practice and for a while I struggled a lot on recruit just because I didn't fully understand all the mechanics. Recently on my umpteenth play through and 200 hours in I finally decided to really delve into the navy because I'd been avoiding it at all cost. There is so much to learn about organizing different theatres, different patrol constitutions, and territory coverage in accordance with naval supremacy. The US definitly has the capability from the get go to take on Japan in the ocean while aiding the EU.
In the end, I think Air superiority is really what allows things to move forward and back.
Also playing the political game is huge and utilizing the focus tree to help other contries defend without sending troops. One of the biggest things I noticed for helping china vs japan was feeding them fuel as soon as I could and sending trucks or other equipment I could spare. The other thing you can do is instill democracy in neutral countries like yugoslavia, romania, turkey, etc.

[Honcho]

I’ve yet to see axis invade the uk

[SGT Spack 7]

reason why Germany is so strong is they have an out of date focus tree with virtually no drawbacks that allow them land and equipment for free which most other countries don't have.

you have the left side
puppet the second most oil rich country in Europe romania
and puppet hungary with aluminium
6 months and you get 8civs i think from the industrial focuses
can get tank research very quick

on the historical focus tree which you can easily rush in 37 you get to eat Austria
the only country that can actually hold against the Germans the Czechs
Yugo
and Greece
potentially for free gaining all their equipment

unhistorical they have the fastest civil war in the game which you can start on the first focus not even the Japanese with their equally date tree can do it that fast.
whereas the soviets uk USA takes till what 37 or later before they can do it

reforming the central powers in which case they get Austria Hungary back as a decent ally
Poland usually as well
italy
and your polish cores for free

or you can marry the worlds strongest country with the worlds strongest naval power with the British alliance

or do the democratic killjoy option where the ai builds the super boring alliance squashes the soviets and border gores the soviet union

thier is no debuffs or really any downsides to the German focus tree other than the RNG element