Help with Garrisons?

[Citizen X]

TLDR: Are garrisons casualties ridiculous, or am I bad?

Im not new to HOI4, but I have not been playing much since BBA. Playing Italy. Feb 20th, Ethiopia is done. 150 men lost. Holding Ethiopia, im losing 54 men daily. By the time resistance is dealt with, it can be up too 1800 men.

Using the tank division Italy starts with and Martial Law from day 1, up until Colonial Police is available, Resistance never AT ANY POINT gets above 10%, HOWEVER, in the time it takes me to complete the focuses needed to solve the problem, Ive already lost tons more men to garrisons then combat.

Any ideas on what else I can do? I always get a spy and run Counter Resistance already. Brutal Occupation has a +100% Damage to Garrison modifier, so I dont think it would help. Focuses take time, and so Id rather not have to spend 280 days completing Ethiopia focuses for +5% and +10% compliance. Like I already mentioned, Ive already lost hundreds of men within the first few months.

Is this level of resistance normal? Am I being picky over 1800 men?
Are there buffs to resistance Paradox added to make "Ethiopia more challenging", and maybe I just missed them? Maybe this was intentional; either way in my opinion I think its too much overall. 54 men daily??

[numero siete]

There is my advice for you. Always, in every game you play at every country just create new division template and add 1 cav to it and switch it to garrison template. It's the best thing you can do to stop resistance everywhere and everytime.

[All talk and no fight]

You are doing something wrong or being picky. Let me go run a test of how I deal with Ethiopia after capitulation and see how much I lose.

In the meantime, are you sure you set the priority for equipment going to garrisons as "high priority"? Are you producing enough tanks to keep up with your choice as tanks as the garrison? Is the garrison even fully filled?

EDIT: My brother in christ you are being way to picky. I also defeat Ethiopia before boarding the train, I runing Secret Police during the war, then switching to local police force after the war, Don't have a spy agency until Feb 1937, and after 1 in game year when I look at last 12 months of activity in Dec 1936 I've lost 5.62K men to garrison activity and 460 guns.
That's nothing to me, it's literally a drop in the ocean. It literally is nothing, because my gameplan still executes perfectly, I'm able to steal corsica and savoy from france before they become Vichy France, then storm the Suez, Somaliland, Malta, Cyprus, Gibraltar etc.
You have done a great job managing resistance, don't worry about the men you've lost. IT will be made up for when Ethiopian compliance reaches 60% compliance and the colonial recruitable bonus kicks in.

[Citizen X]

Originally posted by de_nuke G:

There is my advice for you. Always, in every game you play at every country just create new division template and add 1 cav to it and switch it to garrison template. It's the best thing you can do to stop resistance everywhere and everytime.

1 cav would have less suppression AND less armor, so Im not so sure when i hear people say this. But, I can always give it a shot

[Citizen X]

Originally posted by All talk and no fight:

In the meantime, are you sure you set the priority for equipment going to garrisons as "high priority"? Are you producing enough tanks to keep up with your choice as tanks as the garrison? Is the garrison even fully filled?

EDIT: My brother in christ you are being way to picky... 1 in game year when I look at last 12 months of activity in Dec 1936 I've lost 5.62K men to garrison activity and 460 guns... don't worry about the men you've lost.

I delete several units at the start of the game, including the 3 "tank" divisions in order to make sure I have enough equipment. Garrisons are green bubble; top priority. If what youre experiencing is normal, then I guess i have to be OK with my situation. I put the effort in to reduce casualties during the invasion, just for garrisons to come and eat from my already small resource pool. ♥♥♥♥♥ annoying

Question for you, as Italy player, where do you go after Suez? Africa? Iraq? How do you choose to deal with UK?

[All talk and no fight]

Originally posted by kyleperry19:

I delete several units at the start of the game, including the 3 "tank" divisions in order to make sure I have enough equipment. Garrisons are green bubble; top priority. If what youre experiencing is normal, then I guess i have to be OK with my situation. I put the effort in to reduce casualties during the invasion, just for garrisons to come and eat from my already small resource pool. ♥♥♥♥♥ annoying

Question for you, as Italy player, where do you go after Suez? Africa? Iraq? How do you choose to deal with UK?

Here's what I like to do!
-Collabs in the U.K, then Raj, then U.S
After Suez I keep fighting in Africa until I get slightly past the belgian congo since supply is now dreadful, purely for warscore. I invade the U.K just as America joins the allies: I don't want the war to end, because Germany has most of the war score.
Once thats taken care of I take out the Raj with collabs for the sweet, sweet manpower, especially when going down "A greater Italy" path since you can get +15% non-core manpower. once you cap the RAJ you instantly get 10m manpower while still on extensive conscription lol
Finally I try to invade the U.S from the Allied south american territories. I either help Germany beat the Soviets, or I let them take massive damage from the soviets so I can take germany out later. I still need to do some more games, because sometimes Germany can take Leningrad, Moscow, and Stalingrad no problem, some games they never even get very far past Eastern Poland. I'm kinda waiting for the next patch to drop, since they are setting the default occupation law to "military governor" which should help the Germans against Allies and Soviets.

[Icevail]

Here's 3 decent garrison formats for you.

1 cavalry + MP
1 motorized + MP
1 armored car + MP

or

5 cavalry + MP
5 motorized + MP
5 armored cars + MP

Cavalry offers least suppression, but is the cheapest, motorized offers more suppression, but costs more to produce, armored cars offer most suppression, but are expensive to make and take time to tech up and are hardest to damage of all 3 types.

Use 5 units in case you have low stability, which increases the amount of red bar you get on daily basis in occupied zones.

Use either civilian oversight or the local police, and you can ignore the whole system for the rest of the game.

[Mr_Faorry]

Make the cheapest ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ interwar light tank you can and set your garrison division as just 1 light tank battalion. The 80% hardness of the light tank massively cuts casualties taken/ equipment lost and they offer the most suppression too.

So long as you don't go into a tank deficit you should be able to survive on secret police/ local police force without any major problems.

[alation13]

Originally posted by Icevail:

Here's 3 decent garrison formats for you.

1 cavalry + MP
1 motorized + MP
1 armored car + MP

or

5 cavalry + MP
5 motorized + MP
5 armored cars + MP

Cavalry offers least suppression, but is the cheapest, motorized offers more suppression, but costs more to produce, armored cars offer most suppression, but are expensive to make and take time to tech up and are hardest to damage of all 3 types.

Use 5 units in case you have low stability, which increases the amount of red bar you get on daily basis in occupied zones.

Use either civilian oversight or the local police, and you can ignore the whole system for the rest of the game.

I find MP works best with "larger" divisions, so I usually go for 6 cavs +MP.
MP is a flat bonus to EACH cav unit, so 1 cav +MP will use the same amount of support equip as 6 cav +MP. Since small arms are about 10% of the cost of support equipment, they are more cost effective.
As far as I know you don't actually use the entire division if you don't need to, so the combat width etc really doesn't matter. At some time I may try to add some armour for reduced damage, but usually my armour goes straight to my armoured divisions.
Armoured cars are meant to be pretty good, but I don't own the DLC required to build them.

[Citizen X]

Originally posted by Icevail:

Use 5 units in case you have low stability, which increases the amount of red bar you get on daily basis in occupied zones.

Use either civilian oversight or the local police, and you can ignore the whole system for the rest of the game.

If by "red bar", youre referring too Resistance Gain, then I understand that LOW Stability affects resistance and compliance in someway, however, in my particular situation this doesnt apply, because within a day or 2 of capitulating Ethiopia, I have 100% stability. But I do think maybe having more units in the division COULD be a good idea.

Civilian Oversight and Local Police Force both put my Resistance Target above 10%, which would probably cause more casualties. Martial Law keeps the resistance low, for about a month, until the new Colonial Police from Italy's Focus tree is unlocked, which is really good. Its a straight upgrade to Local Police, sitting right below Civilian Oversight.

Im trying to min max my garrison casualties. Currently im not happy with the 1.8k men being lost. Im using 4x cav, 2x mot, 1 LT tank, This division is largest division, and the only one to include an armor for Italy at the start of the game. Take into consideration that this 'Ethiopia situation' all takes place within the first 4-5 months of the game, where XP is limited and production is too. Italy doesnt start the game with an armored car production line, but it does start with a SUPER garbage LT tank line. LT tank is also cheaper to produce than the armored car (def needs re-balance) It also has 80% hardness, up from 65% with the armored car.

Its a difficult balance; the war and occupation happen so fast, I think its hard to implement strategies that require resources to be invested. However, I do think that adding more units of cavalry or motorized TO the already existing divisions is a possibility. It will be interesting to see if adding MORE men results in LESS casualties.

[Citizen X]

Originally posted by Mr_Faorry:

Make the cheapest ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ interwar light tank you can and set your garrison division as just 1 light tank battalion. The 80% hardness of the light tank massively cuts casualties taken/ equipment lost and they offer the most suppression too.

So long as you don't go into a tank deficit you should be able to survive on secret police/ local police force without any major problems.

Im already using the "tank" division Italy starts the game with. It includes LT tank. Yes, I understand that the cavalry and motorized take away from the overall percentage. I can try using this single tank template you mention to see if that makes a difference. Suppression would be lower overall, but maybe the hardness will result in LESS casualties. I think adding additional tank units to the Italian one maybe good as well.

[All talk and no fight]

As I said I think you are min-maxing this too much, however your strategy of flipping between martial law and then local or secret police, then colonial police does work. The resistance target itself obviously goes down the more compliant the country is:

I'm almost certain you are doing better a job garrisoning Ethiopia then 99% of other players

[Citizen X]

Originally posted by alation13:

I find MP works best with "larger" divisions, so I usually go for 6 cavs...
As far as I know you don't actually use the entire division if you don't need to, so the combat width etc really doesn't matter. At some time I may try to add some armour for reduced damage... Armoured cars are meant to be pretty good...

MP does sound great. I would like to use it, however, because this situation takes place so early in the game, it cost research and xp, and only comes online after 180 days. For future occupation, MP is great.

Armored cars should be alot better. Unfortunately, they are just too expensive. At 4 production cost, its almost double a truck, and you can easily design a Basic LT Tank for 4 cost that exceeds in all areas. Its disappointing. They should cost 2.75

[Citizen X]

Originally posted by All talk and no fight:

As I said I think you are min-maxing this too much, however your strategy of flipping between martial law and then local or secret police, then colonial police does work. The resistance target itself obviously goes down the more compliant the country is:

I'm almost certain you are doing better a job garrisoning Ethiopia then 99% of other players

Correct, I could decide to complete focuses that give me that compliance early on. I appreciate your responses; obviously, I cant tell how Im doing in comparison to others unless I ask. 54 men lost a day sounds crazy to me, but if thats what everyone else is experiencing too then it makes sense.

[Panda V4]

Local Police Force for the reduced damage to garrisons.

Garrison formats before researching MP
1 cavalry - without NSB DLC
1 cheap tank - with NSB DLC

Garrison formats after researching MP
25 cavalry +MP - without NSB DLC
25 cheap tanks +MP - with NSB DLC

Make sure that at no point you are lacking equipment for the garrisons.

[alation13]

Originally posted by Panda V4:

Local Police Force for the reduced damage to garrisons.

Garrison formats before researching MP
1 cavalry - without NSB DLC
1 cheap tank - with NSB DLC

Garrison formats after researching MP
25 cavalry +MP - without NSB DLC
25 cheap tanks +MP - with NSB DLC

Make sure that at no point you are lacking equipment for the garrisons.

OK so that is why cavs + MP are the most effective with the testing I have done. I don't have any DLC after MtG.