Hearts of Iron IV

Hearts of Iron IV

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Why is Hoi4 so slow to get updates?
No release date announcement for Tiger. One 'quarter sized' expansion and one major accompanying patch is an absolutely pathetic amount of content for the entire year of 2017.

It'll be pretty bad if this doesn't come out before the end of the year.

What's with the extreme lack of content? Hell it doesn't even need to be completely new either. Most of us would've been happy with a couple major updates to fix the absolutely earth shatteringly stupid AI.

Seems like as usual Paradox is spending all their resources on making DLC to sell instead of constantly working to improve the game.

We shouldn't have to wait like 5+ ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ months between major patches. As bad as EU4 and CK2 have become with the amount of DLC even they put out major patches in between as well as the aforementioned dlc put out WAY faster.

The Dev team for Hoi4 has done nothing since ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ JUNE!

We get two content packs that are barely the size of Third Rome, and only three big fixes since release? WTF. This game needs MORE updates especially fixes but for some insane reason it's getting WAY less attention that EU4 and CK2

There's a great foundation with the potential for this to sell REALLY well if only Paradox would put the time and effort into it. I don't fault anyone on the dev team other than podcat. Idk what he's been doing for almost 6 months but it certainly doesn't seem like he's been fixing the issues with the game hes ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ in charge of.

Does anyone remember when Paradox was constantly communicating and releasing patches to their games?
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Zobrazeno 1630 z 99 komentářů
Super Fegelein (Zabanován) 24. lis. 2017 v 16.55 
I'm just here waiting for Paradox to get some serious competition. I'd like to see a rival dev that makes this kind of game, and then all this dlc-cancer and unfinished game nonsense will just be a bad memory.
Luftwaffe FJ původně napsal:
I'm just here waiting for Paradox to get some serious competition. I'd like to see a rival dev that makes this kind of game, and then all this dlc-cancer and unfinished game nonsense will just be a bad memory.
We can only hope.
The DLC isn't the problem. I just wish it camne out more often.
I do agree with the OP regarding the rather slow pace of patches for HOI4 and I do hope they will improve on it. But what I definitely do not agree with is all those complaining / whining / raging about the DLC spam of HOI4. And to explain why I'll just list the game histories for the first 18 months of the four games:
2013-08-13 - Europa Universalis IV released 2013-09-24 - Patch 1.2 released 2013-10-29 - Patch 1.3 released 2014-01-14 - Patch 1.4 released (alongside Conquest of Paradise) 2014-02-19 - Patch 1.5 released 2014-05-29 - Patch 1.6 released (alongside Wealth of Nations) 2014-07-16 - Patch 1.7 released (alongside Res Publica) 2014-10-30 - Patch 1.8 released (alongside Art of War) 2014-12-09 - Patch 1.9 released 2015-02-26 - Patch 1.10 released (alongside El Dorado)
2012-02-14 - Crusader Kings II released 2012-02-17 - Patch 1.03 released 2012-03-05 - Patch 1.04 released 2012-04-16 - Patch 1.05 released 2012-06-26 - Patch 1.06 released (alongside Sword of Islam) 2012-10-16 - Patch 1.07 released (alongside Legacy of Rome) 2012-11-15 - Patch 1.08 released (alongside Sunset Invasion) 2013-01-15 - Patch 1.09 released (alongside The Republic) 2013-05-28 - Patch 1.10 released (alongside The Old Gods) 2013-08-13 - Patch 1.11 released
2016-05-09 - Stellaris released 2016-06-01 - Patch 1.1 released 2016-06-27 - Patch 1.2 released 2016-10-20 - Patch 1.3 released (alongside Leviathans) 2016-12-05 - Patch 1.4 released 2017-04-06 - Patch 1.5 released (alongside Utopia) 2017-05-09 - Patch 1.6 released 2017-06-28 - Multiplayer patch released (as Beta patch) 2017-09-21 - Patch 1.8 released (alongside Synthetic Dawn) 2017-10-25 - Patch 1.8.3 released
2016-06-06 - Hearts of Iron IV released 2016-06-30 - Patch 1.1 released 2016-09-16 - Patch 1.2 released 2016-12-15 - Patch 1.3 released (alongside Together for Victory) 2017-06-14 - Patch 1.4 released (alongside Death or Dishonor) 2017-08-21 - Patch 1.4.2 released
Jarl Axel Svarrson původně napsal:
Paradox fanboys incoming

Already got one.

I used to be a fanboy myself when they treated the community with a modicum of respect. After about a year of CK2 it started to change. Ever since then I have seen the company become more like EA or Activision.

Of course they're not that bad but theyve undeniably taken MANY steps down that road.

If you want to believe that holding them accountable for almost no live support when any company, hell even WB Interactive has done a better job with Shadow of War in the first two months than Paradox has done in an entire year.

The dev leadership (podcat) has had the chance to make improvements to base systems. fix massive ai bugs and incredibly unrealistic behavior. Thus far only the bare minimum has been done.

I know they are capable of much more than the pathetic performance so far. Three, THREE major updates since release.

If you really believe that asking for just one more update is unreasonable then you're probably a mindless fanboy worshipping the ground Johann walks on.

I like Paradox games, I love them, I am not however going to refuse to call out ♥♥♥♥♥♥ practices when I see them because of that.

The focus has been entirely shifted to DLC with fixes relegated to said DLC releases. Quality of life adjustments, and general tweaks, even the occasional new mechanic SHOULD NOT be held hostage to the latest DLC release.

If it's a fix needed to improve the experience of the player, especially one that is implemented already as I suspect chain of command already is finished, then it should be released alongside other minor tweaks.

Paradox did this in the past with CK2 before the DLC centric policy took off.

It's pretty clear that this game is the best example of DLC focused policy going to extremes. Reading these dev diaries tells me that the team has been doing quality work but leadership has chosen to not release them but rather bundle them in with the DLC.

AFAIK no other Paradox title has gone such a RIDICULOUSLY long time without any balance patches. Certainly not within the first year after launch. The pattern is there for all to see.


I don't want to be criticizing them like this. I would much rather things be like they were in the old days on the forums. Back when devs responded rather quickly and meaningfully. When major bugs in the AI were considered serious enough to fix ASAP rather than using these fixes to help promote the DLC.

None of this would be so bad if they were actually consistent with their DLC releases!

However Podcat has been unable to come up with a single full sized expansion since release!


It's pretty pathetic that even though Johann has clearly mandated that everythign be based around ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ DLC instead of fixing the game within a reasonable time frame they can't even carry out this DLC centric policy with a degree of competence.

PDX has been lambasted for pumping out DLC constantly, at this point I wish they would with Hoi4. So far, it's been cirtually nothing.

Modders who aren't being paid anything have had more of a positive impact on this game within the first year than the entire dev team.

That's just ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ sad. This disparity is usually present but this time its become so great that its almost like Mount and Blade. Except M&B is explicitly designed for Modders. Hoi4 is ostensibly supported by a live dev team on a consistent timely basis.

Only it isn't.
Luftwaffe FJ původně napsal:
I'm just here waiting for Paradox to get some serious competition. I'd like to see a rival dev that makes this kind of game, and then all this dlc-cancer and unfinished game nonsense will just be a bad memory.

This^

Times a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ million.

As soon as a viable rival appears on the scene these practices will either have to be abandoned or the company will fail.

It will happen bc nothing stays static forever. Eventually, whether its five or ten, or even fifteen years a genuine rival will appear and thereby force Paradox to treat customers like human beings again.
bubbas původně napsal:
I do agree with the OP regarding the rather slow pace of patches for HOI4 and I do hope they will improve on it. But what I definitely do not agree with is all those complaining / whining / raging about the DLC spam of HOI4. And to explain why I'll just list the game histories for the first 18 months of the four games:
2013-08-13 - Europa Universalis IV released 2013-09-24 - Patch 1.2 released 2013-10-29 - Patch 1.3 released 2014-01-14 - Patch 1.4 released (alongside Conquest of Paradise) 2014-02-19 - Patch 1.5 released 2014-05-29 - Patch 1.6 released (alongside Wealth of Nations) 2014-07-16 - Patch 1.7 released (alongside Res Publica) 2014-10-30 - Patch 1.8 released (alongside Art of War) 2014-12-09 - Patch 1.9 released 2015-02-26 - Patch 1.10 released (alongside El Dorado)
2012-02-14 - Crusader Kings II released 2012-02-17 - Patch 1.03 released 2012-03-05 - Patch 1.04 released 2012-04-16 - Patch 1.05 released 2012-06-26 - Patch 1.06 released (alongside Sword of Islam) 2012-10-16 - Patch 1.07 released (alongside Legacy of Rome) 2012-11-15 - Patch 1.08 released (alongside Sunset Invasion) 2013-01-15 - Patch 1.09 released (alongside The Republic) 2013-05-28 - Patch 1.10 released (alongside The Old Gods) 2013-08-13 - Patch 1.11 released
2016-05-09 - Stellaris released 2016-06-01 - Patch 1.1 released 2016-06-27 - Patch 1.2 released 2016-10-20 - Patch 1.3 released (alongside Leviathans) 2016-12-05 - Patch 1.4 released 2017-04-06 - Patch 1.5 released (alongside Utopia) 2017-05-09 - Patch 1.6 released 2017-06-28 - Multiplayer patch released (as Beta patch) 2017-09-21 - Patch 1.8 released (alongside Synthetic Dawn) 2017-10-25 - Patch 1.8.3 released
2016-06-06 - Hearts of Iron IV released 2016-06-30 - Patch 1.1 released 2016-09-16 - Patch 1.2 released 2016-12-15 - Patch 1.3 released (alongside Together for Victory) 2017-06-14 - Patch 1.4 released (alongside Death or Dishonor) 2017-08-21 - Patch 1.4.2 released


I don't think I said they're spamming dlc for Hoi4. Idk how anyone believes that there's only been two 'half expansions' so far.


In the first couple months as the quoted post shows EVER other paradox game that's recent has been given a slew of updates not necessarily new stuff just patches especially within the first couple months.

What the ♥♥♥♥ is the deal with hoi4? It may have been the most stable but as far as feature complete and ai behavior its by far the worst release in the recent years. So why exactly the pathetically slow pace?

There's got to be something other than DLC at fault here bc both EU4 and CK2 didnt' suffer from this kind of ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

All I can think of is the incredibly apathetic leadership podcat has displayed. For better or worse and overall I think for the better Wiz has been putting out lots of patches alongside lots of dlc for EU4.

In other words at least hes doing SOMETHING.

Frankly it seems like the Hoi4 people are doing nothing in comparison.

It's not like I'd have been unsatisfied if they had done even half as much as the other teams.

But we have only had a MINOR update for Hoi4 which was in ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ SEPTEMBER.

The last major update in JUNE.

For me that UNACCEPTABLE. I dont want any new content other than Chain of Command and I'm more than willing to wait for that if that means the existing game had been up tp 1.6 or 1.7 by now.
I love how everyone just never comments about how DLC=Profit, and they need profit to survive as a compnay, the second us rational Paradox fans talk about how if they dont make DLC and release it with the free patch, theyd have to start during in Call of Duty and release games Yearly
KoA Blue Knight™ původně napsal:
Dedmosh původně napsal:


Stop being so defensive and company worshipping. If you read my post instead of the title you'd see that I'm not saying they should be working themselves to death.

It's easy to take someone's argument to the extreme when they clearly are not in order to make them look bad.

I said there should be more updates. I.e. patches to fix existing issues and give general quality of life improvements. I'd have been happy with just one major patch in 5 months.

But if you think that being spoilt means asking for one patch in 5 months, not new content or an expansion just improvements to the base game and tweaks, then you've got some serious issues.

As I've said smaller companies have been able to pit out way more than just one dlc that isn't even a full sized expansion a year and done so consistently.

Youre like one of those people who defends Star Citizen even when there's reasonable criticism leveled at it.

News flash: there's a difference between what I'm saying which is that they clearly have abandoned live support in favor of making more dlc, and demanding they work day and night to keep me entertained.

You can criticize a company aND its general apathetic nature without advocating for them going to the other extreme and doing back breaking nonstop work.
No i read your post, but no other comments you seem to need to post alot to get your point across which is strange

but you saying u rather just patches to the game without much extra conetent just a more even and patched game, alright dude, but who is gonna pay for that? so they just make patches constant patches to fix the game without releasing alot of DLC but then who is gonna pay the HOI team ?

You want to be a good person and just critise without being a ♥♥♥♥ and i get that, but they have put alot more thought into what they need to do than u have trust me.

they need to make DLC to stay afloat, DLC= profit just releasing patches =no profit


There's a difference between making dlc to make money (which they're havinbg no trouble doing) and fixing the issues of a barely functioning game. IF you think they need to pump out dlc constantly or else they'll go bankrupt then go take a finance course.

People have paid for patches, THEY BOUGHT THE GAME. Buying a game comes with the entirely reasonable expectation that free fixes will be forthcoming especially right after launch. Paradox has not done that. As I've said, smaller companies have been far better about this. PDX has the resources to do this, they just won't let the dev team do their job.

I'm perfectly fine with DLC, I don't hate it like a lot of other people do with Paradox. My issue is when compared to all the games they've released this generation there's been NO major patches not tied to a DLC; and there's only been TWO DLC. I don't count the hotfix update Redball Express bc the game was so broken even Paradox couldn't ignore it and did the bare minumum before going on vacation.

The idea that releasing patches without some accompanying necessary purchase is ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥. That's the kind of thinking that has led to loot boxces being stuck in everything now.


When you make a purchase for a good especially a game said game is supposed to function. The reasoning behind your post is almost mind bogling in how stupid it is. So I now have to pay Paradox for EVERY major patch they make from now on? Otherwise they go bankrupt?

This from a company that has been getting along just fine patching their games without releasing an accompanying dlc for many years in the past?

DId you play Crusader Kings 1? Or any of the other major games in the first generation? They were patched without demanding extra cash from the customer. That service, FIXING THE GAME and supporting it is INCLUDED IN THE INITIAL PURCHASE.
KoA Blue Knight™ původně napsal:
I love how everyone just never comments about how DLC=Profit, and they need profit to survive as a compnay, the second us rational Paradox fans talk about how if they dont make DLC and release it with the free patch, theyd have to start during in Call of Duty and release games Yearly

Go buy more lootboxes in Battlefront 2 then EA might go bankrupt otherwise from running all those servers and keeping a live support team running if you don't
Dedmosh původně napsal:
KoA Blue Knight™ původně napsal:
I love how everyone just never comments about how DLC=Profit, and they need profit to survive as a compnay, the second us rational Paradox fans talk about how if they dont make DLC and release it with the free patch, theyd have to start during in Call of Duty and release games Yearly

Go buy more lootboxes in Battlefront 2 then EA might go bankrupt otherwise from running all those servers and keeping a live support team running if you don't
Funny thing about that is csgo uses lootboxes to keep servers up but Valve aren't ♥♥♥♥ heads about it.
Dedmosh původně napsal:
bubbas původně napsal:
I do agree with the OP regarding the rather slow pace of patches for HOI4 and I do hope they will improve on it.

But what I definitely do not agree with is all those complaining / whining / raging about the DLC spam of HOI4. And to explain why I'll just list the game histories for the first 18 months of the four games:
I don't think I said they're spamming dlc for Hoi4. Idk how anyone believes that there's only been two 'half expansions' so far.
I didn't say you did, but others certainly have. With an addition of two pressings of enter as shown above, it looks more clear now I hope.
Stonecrusher III původně napsal:
This trend that it is acceptable to release unfinished games with day 1 DLCs, basicly having costumers as beta testers is our fault. We buy the games, buy the day one DLCs, make them rich(positive reinforcement), find bugs for them and praise and make excuses. like they are a small team but needs extra money cause tens of thousands buy the game at full price and that is not enough to support them. They need more money for focus trees of countries that played a decent role in WW2. Its not only Paradox, Civ 6 is doing the same. Dovetail does the same with their train sims. Car mech sim 18 had two day one DLCs and was unplayable so much so that the Devs apologized.
It won't end until we stop buying DLCs of games that aren't at the point of adding "extra" or are unfinished.
Every paradox game was released in full and had all the content that wanted, they are now littereally making NEW content, that they have to code into the game
Paradox used to be one of my favourite game developer / publishers (since CK 1) , but they have definitely taken quite a few steps down the road that EA took. Not surprising, especially once they floated on the stock market in 2016.

Inevitably, financial considerations, stock market value, etc outweigh all other considerations, where ever increasing profit margins are the holy grail and have to be achieved by delivering less while charging more.

I don't blame them, nearly every company once they grow large and successful goes down the same road (to varying degrees). Paradox Interactive's profits have risen astonomically in the last 2 years (it could well be valued at over 1 billion USD now, it floated at 420 million USD). At the same time they're investment in QA, DLC cost to content ratio, development time to non-profit making patches, etc seems to have decreased. Effectively cashing in on some of the consumer good will and reputation they earned over many years from their long time followers.

While they're no EA yet, it's worth remembering that EA in the 80's and 90's used to be a decent company that made some fantastic games, before they turned into a cash cow. Whether Paradox continue following the road EA took or turn back at some point remains to be seen.
^ I would love for Paradox to go crazy with DLCs for HOI IV. The problem is the lack of updates, not the DLC.
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Datum zveřejnění: 22. lis. 2017 v 22.52
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