The Japan Problem

[LukeTheSp00k]

At this point, I am really not sure if anything like what happened in WW2 in the Asia-Pacific could actually happen within HOI's mechanics.

Yes, the Japanese were in way over their heads and were doomed from the start. But they managed initial successes and pushed way farther than anyone expected them to, and it took quite a while to push them back, even with most of their army tied down in China.

The problem is that in HOI IV, there's simply no way to actually model this period of initial success. The game is too free-form and the AI has to be able to adapt its defence - what that means, though, is that while the Japanese struggle to conquer China with most of their men, they ally with Siam, declare war on the British, then get crushed in Southeast Asia in no time and from there it's just a matter of sinking all their ships and invading them. In other words, the game shows what everyone at the time expected would happen. They can't conduct effective amphibious assaults the take the islands of the South Pacific, hell they can't event get into Burma. They might be able to if their forces weren't so diverted to China, but the problem is that the Chinese are far more powerful in the game, due to its necessarily simplistic combat mechanics, than in real life, so the Japanese must use basically all their troops just to not get pushed into the ocean.

The result is that the Pacific doesn't work well unless you artificially boost Japan via the difficulty sliders to roflstomp China - but I shouldn't have to do that.

[KOW Joshyboi]

just spam tanks with japan while your in china and after that you'll need them to smash through the russian bs line, dont bother with the pacific the ai ignore navel invasion rules so you will be just wasting men trying to defend the islands, the islands dont give you anything strategic anyway unless you want to be extremely historical with it but as you said the ai breaks those types of plays anyway

[jpcerutti]

Have you tried playing as a woefully incompetent allied commander until 1942? That might allow you to duplicate Japan's early war victories. =)

Is difficult to devise an AI that can take large pieces of China but not all of it, destroy the US Pacific and British Asian forces and then stop, and to keep a solid truce with Russia until 1945. You have to help it along.

[Nigilius Angelus]

Sorry have to disagree as playing as Japan at the moment on Vetern level and China, SE Asia and India have all capitulated to the IJA abd the navy is holding its own again the US. It helps to build about 12 armoured divisions as they can make all the difference in China. Also you need to build about 20 Marine Divisions for your amphib invasions. Also you need to build coastal forts on your pacific islands which allows them to hold their own againt the US until youre ready to deal with them properly.

[simorautio]

I have never seen in game that Japan take South Asia. :(

[KOW Joshyboi]

Originally posted by simorautio:

I have never seen in game that Japan take South Asia. :(

lol must be bad then

[simorautio]

Originally posted by ╬KOW╬Joshyboi:

Originally posted by simorautio:

I have never seen in game that Japan take South Asia. :(

lol must be bad then

Yes. Indonesia and Malesia was their goal in real life. Not they are not interesting about it. Or maybe they are too weak in game.

[Wayward Son]

Originally posted by TheFilthyCasual:

-snerp-
The result is that the Pacific doesn't work well unless you artificially boost Japan via the difficulty sliders to roflstomp China - but I shouldn't have to do that.

No you shouldn't. But the devs have made it clear that this is the intention with this installment of the franchise, to have a far more balanced, ahistorical and, arguably, entertaining game.

If you're looking for a historical war sim here, you're looking in the wrong place bud.

[<|☥|Inesophet|☥|>]

In reality if memory serves right the japanese launched a massive invasion from the north while at the same time invading Shanghai, Ningbo and Xiamen. From shanghai they pushed through Suzhou, Wuxi, Changzhou and then Finally Nanjing (the capital at the time) At the Same time china has been Plagued by Civil wars and Embargo`s from the major powers. Its Army was disorganized and underquipped to even deal with local uprisings. That obviously changed throughout the war, but those things where a big reason why Japan had historically at first lots of successes. In HOI this complexity cannot really be simulated but they do actually a good job.
If you learn from history and apply similar tactics as japan then you will also get your foot in quite easily. The others mentioned tanks, those certainly turn the tide. Aswell as Air Superiority. You have for the time being absolute naval Supremecy until you get involved with britain or the USA. Using this strength in staging many naval invasions taking a few tiles with units designed to dig in and defend will spread the KMT army Woefully thin. so you can invade from the north. Knocking out Communist china is vital, they churn out division after division and can be a real menace, afterwards push towards Chongqing. Naval invade Shanghai and BLAMO zai jian china.

[p2]

ive had japan on max buff and fail to take over china

[The Toast of Kyiv]

Originally posted by p2:

ive had japan on max buff and fail to take over china

You're doing it wrong, son ...

[p2]

Originally posted by Annudah Shoah:

Originally posted by p2:

ive had japan on max buff and fail to take over china

You're doing it wrong, son ...

no. im really not.

[War Emblem]

A couple points...first, I like the way HOI4 plays in that you aren't just playing thru the parts of WW2 everyone knows. This was a key strength in Vicky2 and EU - each game unfolded differently and you were never sure what was going to happen. They have captured a lot of this in HOI4.

Second - Japan was barely a major power. Remember the movie the Last Samurai? Yah - that wasn't too far in the distance from the start of this game. Japan wasn't even on the radar of the world until they kinda sorta beat the Russians in 1906. Even that was misleading though - the Russians were handicapped by logistical nightmares and their Imperial army and navy was badly in need of reform. So 30 years later Japan has some misguided imperial ambitions that it's economy and manpower can't fulfill. The only reason Japan held on as long as they did is that they had about a 4 year head start on the Americans in ship building. So the US had to build ships for a year and then start executing one of the most complicated campaigns in the world history - serious just imagine all the logistical troubles that went into an island by island advance through the thousands and thousands of miles of Pacific ocean.

In game - Japan is supposed be tough to win at. As you can see from responses some players can and do win with it. It's not an easy button nation.

[LukeTheSp00k]

Originally posted by Wayward Son:

Originally posted by TheFilthyCasual:

-snerp-
The result is that the Pacific doesn't work well unless you artificially boost Japan via the difficulty sliders to roflstomp China - but I shouldn't have to do that.

No you shouldn't. But the devs have made it clear that this is the intention with this installment of the franchise, to have a far more balanced, ahistorical and, arguably, entertaining game.

If you're looking for a historical war sim here, you're looking in the wrong place bud.

How is it entertaining for the Japanese to get stomped everytime and make everything about Europe?

I keep trying to get a fun Australia game but by the time the Japanese DOW the Allies they've had their entire army wiped out by the Chinese. There's no extended campaign in SEA, the Raj just bowls over Thailand and then sits there doing nothing for the rest of the game. Only the Chinese are getting any action. The devs Euro bias is blatant at this point, because only Europe is any fun.

[LukeTheSp00k]

I feel like everyone is missing the point, or I'm being misinterpretted. All these 'tips' on how to play Japan are irrelevent.

Yes it is fun to play AS Japan, but only AS them. The AI cannot handle the country properly, they get BTFO every time, which means playing any country in Asia other than China is a snooze fest since the Chinese just wipe out their army and your only job is to invade Japan itself after dealing with their navy. There's no threat of invasion from them, they never have the troops for it. The whole theatre aborts itself before it really starts and can be finished by 42/3.

[KOW Joshyboi]

Originally posted by p2:

Originally posted by Annudah Shoah:

You're doing it wrong, son ...

no. im really not.

well your failing with japan a country that has rediculous amount of recruitable troops, your bad enough said