Xeon H still not Boardable after 7.10...?

[Kilo_60]

Still at 1600 Board Strength than never goes lower no matter how many boarding attempts and can only board with 16 marines at a time still?

Read through the whole list and still not seeing this issue addressed?

[Venerable_Sin]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von PeaceMaker:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Vinerable_Sin:

Ah, so there's the meat and potatoes. You have to mess with files and aspect ratios. I'm referring to an in game menu that allows you do this. I'm not looking to mess with files and do all kind of modding type of things that most laymen like me wouldn't be interested in doing. That is a work around, not a feature.

I was away or would've replied sooner. It's not a workaround. That's how Egosoft DESIGNED it to be from the beginning. In fact it's better this way.

It's really, REALLY easy.

1. Just grab a picture you like. Anything, just make sure it's in png format which a lot of pics might already be. You know what PNG is right? Please say yes.

2. Find your Documents folder on your pc, then find the Egosoft folder, then find X4 folder in the Egosoft folder and the LOGOS folder in there. You know what i mean, right? great.

3. Drop your pic in the Logos folder.

4. The squarer it is the better. Nothing too long one way. There used to be a strict criteria to sizes but almost anything works now.

Now look in your game, the LOGO you put in will be there. Once you get that you'll be dropping pics in there like a pro. it's actually better than having an ingame thing in my opinion.

Easy.

To me fixing a plasma chamber that creates microchips is very very very easy. Not taking the time to learn how to make a picture and then troubleshooting anything that goes wrong during the process. Sure I can do it or go the extra mile, but do I want to? nah. It's good they gave you a tractor to drive but it's not good they didn't teach you how to drive the tractor. My farmer analogy still stands, it should be fool proof, easy and most importantly FUN. Not looking to troubleshoot after troubleshooting the troubleshooter.

I love that your heart is in the right place. Thank you, please don't think I'm unappreciative or negative in any way. Just giving my 2 cents on the matter. It really isn't that important to me. It would just be nice is all I'm saying.

[Kilo_60]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Caedes91:

The boarding strength of the H is arbitary. No thinking went into it at all, just an allergic reaction of the devs against fun. That's just how their balancing team has always operated. Tedium for the sake of filler content and stretching out playtime.

The ship is crap when weighed against the efforts it requires to get one. Even if you bother getting 16 full 5 elite marines, all with 5 star morale, you can't just board it once, then research to produce it yourself.
No you have to always waste 16 star marines to get one. For a weak, mediocre ship no less. By the time, you have the resources to waste 16 elite marines, you can already build entire fleets made up of much better ships.

You capture one intact, you research its weapons and can build its armament from scratch, but building the fuselage is somehow out of the question?
A hull, that is supposed to be a Terraformer ship, already built centuries ago, therefore making it common tech by the time of X4. Same goes for other Xenon ships.

In the end, these ships get relegated to token ships kept as trophies somewhere safe. They are too bad to be flown by the player, but too precious to be left in AI hands.

The suspicion, that this is to strongarm people, who like the design, but can't "afford" the marines, into purchasing Timelines to unlock one for free, is understandable.

Totally agreed!

Especially the last sentence!

[rpvb3]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von flywlyx:

So now complaining is a crime? It's funy how you blame others for complaining, but the "shut up and go away" logic applies to you as well. If you don't like the complaint, then shut up and go away.

No one said that - other than you of course. Isn't it amazing how people project themselves on others?

The problem is they put it behind a skill or effort wall, like they did the Erlking, and they should have put the Asgard. I've captured 4 H's since they changed the capture difficulty - it is do able and it is hard enough to make each one precious and achievement rather than just something anyone can get any number of with enough attempts with marines that have just barely learned to lace their boots.

They made a huge mistake with the Asgard with it being game ruining OP and far too easy to get, and fortunately they are trying not to repeat it. And someone will write a mod that make this difficult part of the game easy as the do for all the other difficult parts. Its a solo game, the player can mod it to be as easy in the parts they don't like as they want and just have fun playing the parts they do. Shoot there were people raving about the race parts of Timelines - takes all kinds.

[Darklordnj]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von rpvb3:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von flywlyx:

So now complaining is a crime? It's funy how you blame others for complaining, but the "shut up and go away" logic applies to you as well. If you don't like the complaint, then shut up and go away.

No one said that - other than you of course. Isn't it amazing how people project themselves on others?

The problem is they put it behind a skill or effort wall, like they did the Erlking, and they should have put the Asgard. I've captured 4 H's since they changed the capture difficulty - it is do able and it is hard enough to make each one precious and achievement rather than just something anyone can get any number of with enough attempts with marines that have just barely learned to lace their boots.

They made a huge mistake with the Asgard with it being game ruining OP and far too easy to get, and fortunately they are trying not to repeat it. And someone will write a mod that make this difficult part of the game easy as the do for all the other difficult parts. Its a solo game, the player can mod it to be as easy in the parts they don't like as they want and just have fun playing the parts they do. Shoot there were people raving about the race parts of Timelines - takes all kinds.

The H is a cool ship, don’t get me wrong. But it shouldn’t be “precious and an achievement” level of difficult to capture. I might agree if we were talking about some other high level Xenon ship like a K or an I, or even the CPU ship if we wanna get crazy. But the H isn’t that level, what you’re saying is that you have to complete terraforming stuff, which has long been an endgame thing in order to get more of a just okay ship, one that is pretty good at an anti-fighter role.

The H shouldn’t be some trophy ship (especially since it’s rarely produced as is by the Xenon) that you have to complete the end game for, if it is supposed to be a trophy ship, then there’s Timelines for that, which is bad in another sense.

And by the way, trying to dismiss things with a “you can mod it” also applies to making things more difficult, so if you truly think boarding things like the Asgard should be harder, then why aren’t you modding it?

The focus should be on Vanilla balancing relative to other ships, in which the H is dismal even compared to ships of its own class (so not even stuff like the Asgard). This is because it out right ignores established boarding rules, with a relatively fixed boarding power that can’t be reduced by the usual tricks/effort and quickly regenerates by the time another boarding attempt is made. The H is the only ship that does this, even the capturable Xenon M and S class still adhere to the rules regarding abandoning ships.

[Kilo_60]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Darklordnj:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von rpvb3:

No one said that - other than you of course. Isn't it amazing how people project themselves on others?

The problem is they put it behind a skill or effort wall, like they did the Erlking, and they should have put the Asgard. I've captured 4 H's since they changed the capture difficulty - it is do able and it is hard enough to make each one precious and achievement rather than just something anyone can get any number of with enough attempts with marines that have just barely learned to lace their boots.

They made a huge mistake with the Asgard with it being game ruining OP and far too easy to get, and fortunately they are trying not to repeat it. And someone will write a mod that make this difficult part of the game easy as the do for all the other difficult parts. Its a solo game, the player can mod it to be as easy in the parts they don't like as they want and just have fun playing the parts they do. Shoot there were people raving about the race parts of Timelines - takes all kinds.

The H is a cool ship, don’t get me wrong. But it shouldn’t be “precious and an achievement” level of difficult to capture. I might agree if we were talking about some other high level Xenon ship like a K or an I, or even the CPU ship if we wanna get crazy. But the H isn’t that level, what you’re saying is that you have to complete terraforming stuff, which has long been an endgame thing in order to get more of a just okay ship, one that is pretty good at an anti-fighter role.

The H shouldn’t be some trophy ship (especially since it’s rarely produced as is by the Xenon) that you have to complete the end game for, if it is supposed to be a trophy ship, then there’s Timelines for that, which is bad in another sense.

And by the way, trying to dismiss things with a “you can mod it” also applies to making things more difficult, so if you truly think boarding things like the Asgard should be harder, then why aren’t you modding it?

The focus should be on Vanilla balancing relative to other ships, in which the H is dismal even compared to ships of its own class (so not even stuff like the Asgard). This is because it out right ignores established boarding rules, with a relatively fixed boarding power that can’t be reduced by the usual tricks/effort and quickly regenerates by the time another boarding attempt is made. The H is the only ship that does this, even the capturable Xenon M and S class still adhere to the rules regarding abandoning ships.

Well said....!

[rpvb3]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Darklordnj:

The H is a cool ship, don’t get me wrong. But it shouldn’t be “precious and an achievement” level of difficult to capture. I might agree if we were talking about some other high level Xenon ship like a K or an I, or even the CPU ship if we wanna get crazy. But the H isn’t that level, what you’re saying is that you have to complete terraforming stuff, which has long been an endgame thing in order to get more of a just okay ship, one that is pretty good at an anti-fighter role.

The H shouldn’t be some trophy ship (especially since it’s rarely produced as is by the Xenon) that you have to complete the end game for, if it is supposed to be a trophy ship, then there’s Timelines for that, which is bad in another sense.

And by the way, trying to dismiss things with a “you can mod it” also applies to making things more difficult, so if you truly think boarding things like the Asgard should be harder, then why aren’t you modding it?

The focus should be on Vanilla balancing relative to other ships, in which the H is dismal even compared to ships of its own class (so not even stuff like the Asgard). This is because it out right ignores established boarding rules, with a relatively fixed boarding power that can’t be reduced by the usual tricks/effort and quickly regenerates by the time another boarding attempt is made. The H is the only ship that does this, even the capturable Xenon M and S class still adhere to the rules regarding abandoning ships.

Fair enough about the Asgard, but since I don't mod and don't use 3rd party mods its just as easy to just never get one. I haven't set foot in Terran or PIO territory since the end of the Covert Ops, my one 'fill shortages' outreach vessel sent in the very first days of this save is still plugging along, raising my relationship but they really have nothing I want or need beyond their shields and drives. Sort of like many others are with the Avarice DLC content.

And we'll just have to disagree with the terraformer L ship. I think it having not a crew but self-repairing boarding resistance is completely reasonable and having it so a player can't just cheese it down with one star troops is a welcome change.

I guess I keep responding because of the thread title - they are completely boardable, just that some don't want to 'pay the price' that it takes. But I guess we've talked this out. Maybe they will compromise and lower the 1600 to something a crew of 3 stars could accomplish (like I said in the beta the value was originally 1750). But please don't make it cheesable - way too many things in the game are.

[¥aeko]

The only reason its so difficult to board is: so that you buy the DLC. (since it gives you an H)

From a pure gameplay-perspective:

- finding an H already is hard, since they arent built that often (and tend to suicide into things, so you have a small timeframe only)
- you have to mop up all the xenon around it, constantly, but not the H itself
- then you have to get your boarding crews there (preferably in one piece)

It would already be annoying to capture if it wasnt artificially made harder to do... but hey, you can always pay 15 bucks to get one for "free". (Dont we all love the feeling of "accomplishment" after having "paid around" artificially worsened gameplay? Its awesome, sooo much fun.)

This is a typical "create a problem, to sell the solution" type of thing. (Many games make something grindy or inconvenient, just to sell you the "skip" for it...)

I dont know if this was an accident (bad communication inside egosoft and lack of awareness) or greed. (One could argue that its "greed", since it wasnt fixed yet, over 2 months.)

Really sour "taste" that you can just pay around it.

EDIT:
PS: The fix to this "pay for convenience" would be:

- put a damaged and abandoned H somewhere in a (base game) xenon sector, like the odysseus

That would remove the "pay for it" aspect.

Alternatively:

- come up with unique rewards for Timelines?

[Kilo_60]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von ¥aeko:

The only reason its so difficult to board is: so that you buy the DLC. (since it gives you an H)

From a pure gameplay-perspective:

- finding an H already is hard, since they arent built that often (and tend to suicide into things, so you have a small timeframe only)
- you have to mop up all the xenon around it, constantly, but not the H itself
- then you have to get your boarding crews there (preferably in one piece)

It would already be annoying to capture if it wasnt artificially made harder to do... but hey, you can always pay 15 bucks to get one for "free". (Dont we all love the feeling of "accomplishment" after having "paid around" artificially worsened gameplay? Its awesome, sooo much fun.)

This is a typical "create a problem, to sell the solution" type of thing. (Many games make something grindy or inconvenient, just to sell you the "skip" for it...)

I dont know if this was an accident (bad communication inside egosoft and lack of awareness) or greed. (One could argue that its "greed", since it wasnt fixed yet, over 2 months.)

Really sour "taste" that you can just pay around it.

EDIT:
PS: The fix to this "pay for convenience" would be:

- put a damaged and abandoned H somewhere in a (base game) xenon sector, like the odysseus

That would remove the "pay for it" aspect.

Alternatively:

- come up with unique rewards for Timelines?

I totally agree it's TOTAL "Greed", at this point, since the Dev's already mentioned they are aware of the issue in my first post on this, and it's an easy fix, but they still refuse to do anything about it after coming up with a patch with 300+ fixes with a majority just for the Timelines DLC but not touching the H at all...

[Donauwelle]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von ¥aeko:

I dont know if this was an accident (bad communication inside egosoft and lack of awareness) or greed. (One could argue that its "greed", since it wasnt fixed yet, over 2 months.)

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Kilo_60:

I totally agree it's TOTAL "Greed", at this point, since the Dev's already mentioned they are aware of the issue in my first post on this

Aww nah,
you know i love to dump a lil on Ego but Greed?
Imho i guess its the opposite.
CEO has some serious `68er idealist vibes.
Not greed, stubborn idealism.

Id set my money on anything from "iN h0u5e 3ng1n3 and s**y tools"
over "CEO constantly scrapping work / switching prios" to "No real Team / Project Management" but i really really wouldnt call Egosoft/Bernd greedy.
His vision is that of a cute lil Family having X as their baby and Fans who "support" them rather then a Company with a product and customers, those.... those are evil.

[Venerable_Sin]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Donauwelle:

His vision is that of a cute lil Family having X as their baby and Fans who "support" them rather then a Company with a product and customers, those.... those are evil.

I can agree with the in house tools and engines being limited, but how do you explain the Timelines DLC other than an ego trip and a money grab hidden behind a promise to improve the base game with it's data metric acquisition?

[flywlyx]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von rpvb3:

No one said that - other than you of course. Isn't it amazing how people project themselves on others?

So this is not you? Or does "don't complain" have another meaning?

Ursprünglich geschrieben von rpvb3:

Ha! Of course you can play the game the way you want, but don't complain about its not playable the way you want.

Let me make this easier for you to understand: Of course you can view the forum the way you want, but don't complain about others complaining the way you don't want.

[flywlyx]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Vinerable_Sin:

I can agree with the in house tools and engines being limited, but how do you explain the Timelines DLC other than an ego trip and a money grab hidden behind a promise to improve the base game with it's data metric acquisition?

7.0 improves a lot, but it also has the same issue—Egosoft’s priorities are completely messed up. They don't seem to care about what customers are looking for. If Bernad says to go east, they go east without question.

[Donauwelle]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Vinerable_Sin:

but how do you explain the Timelines DLC other than an ego trip and a money grab hidden behind a promise to improve the base game with it's data metric acquisition?

Honestly, i think Egos statement regarding Timelines beeing a Hobby product was indeed the main-reason behind this.
Guess that was just CEO and a few from "the old staff" who really really wanted to re-do some of the old stuff.

Really not trying to white-knight here,
but Egosoft.... nah
Ive got the serious impression that they mostly just really really bad in anything
PR, Marketing, Team and Task- management, and all this is prob just "Evil-Greedy-Corporate" stuff for them.
"Wouldnt be Egosoft anymore" or some Nostalgia Wall tattoo stuff...

[rpvb3]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von flywlyx:

So this is not you? Or does "don't complain" have another meaning?

You said don't complain, of course people can complain but lying and wanting the game to dumbed down to their level for all, yeah I'll complain about that.

Of course you can view the forum the way you want, but don't complain about others complaining the way you don't want.

yeah like I'm taking your advice. ;) But compromises are a thing, about asking they take the H resistances down from 25 3 star marine equivalent to just 16 - that would be a boarding resistance of 1024 and is completely do able with VIG starters and a few runs through the SCA destroyer capture routine. Would that make it easy enough?

[SirProsik]

Except 7.10 is worse than 6.2 as far as basic game stability. 6.2 is not stuttering where as I have 1 second or more pauses at my PHQ when I try to do stuff like put things in storage or modify ships etc. Whenever I go to my PHQ I have to live with my finger over the pause button :(

Everything is pretty much the same like M ships colliding IS and L ships getting stuck together IS. L ships STILL colliding at Piers trying to double or triple park.

I fly an L SCA ship to be repaired and reconfigured etc. While EVA using repair laser one of my mining ships shoves me out of the way flying right through the geometry of the ship I am working on. :(