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- I think thats the thing that is bothering some people... at least the platform I played it on and the way I purchased it , it was advertised as a "game where all your choices make a difference and change the story" , which unfortunately is kind of misleading because as you said it's a linear game with no story altering , just dialogue altering.
- you do bring up a good point about how it could be seen as how people can get carried away with their surroundings. However I think the game would have been better if they kept that aspect simple.... they didnt really let their imaginations get away from them (Spoilers!!) : They literally find out they are being followed, get assaulted, have proof of it , find some crazy ass tent with things that no normal person would be able to afford in that period of time ( a WIRELESS TOWER in the 80s!) , all these creepy notes on them, recordings of them that insinuate they've done bad things there , thats not really "letting their imaginations get the best of them in an isolated environment" ... thats "♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ whats going on" material. and then within 30 minutes the intrigue dropped drastically.
- I do agree that its a pretty game and I loved walking around and using the map and exploring. As a game maker myself (not video game but still) , I appreciate almost any work put into any game and in that sense I loved the game. I just feel they made some unfortunate story choices (and inaccurate advertising) that left me feeling unfulfilled...and I'm honestly not too hard to please. They game got crazy interesting and then lackluster within 40 minutes of itself. Like I said it feels like they wrote the plot.... got someplace good... then couldn't figure out where to really go with it so they just did what they could to make it work.
- I mean i did find a lot of extra stuff I think. Found a lot of extra letters and stuff but don't really feel like they did much for the game. Unless I missed something, I feel like they should have done something more with Dave.
- Again if I wasn't clear : I do like the game. I do appreciate it and I enjoyed MOST of the game.
- Really I was hoping that someone might say I missed something but I guess not. I'm trying to see if I missed a concept of the game. I mean if people loved it , then awesome ... im glad. Just something about the pacing the last hour and the ending didn't sit well with me
I think the game was written, not as a special: ooh! let's fight aliens with plasm shooters and stuff, but more as a combination of: 1: What happens when people are all alone for months on end, and What does a Firewatch in general actually do approximately in a summer. Personally, I would've liked some kind of text explaining what happened after, (like at the start) so that evidence is somewhat "important". Or Maybe a confrontation in the end (comletely scripted for all I care), but I guess the game is mostly meant to be "as lifelike as possible", and not: having a special plot twist to make a lot of sense at the end, or make it super special...
Basically: the game is about what your mind does with you, when you are almost all alone out there, and not: what would make a good story, for someone who is all alone out there, and in that sense, no real ending could have satisfied it.
ps: Even though I too was extremely disappointed in the end, I loved the wonderment that I got of: Was my wife the one with dementia, or is it me, all alone in the woods? Is Delilah real, or just...my mind trying to remember things? And that kind of ending could probably also be there, or even different things that I personally cannot fathom, but others could have thought up (also: see aliens with plasm shooters on the top of the message ;))
What I am saying is that you have your way and Campo Santo has theirs. Nobody is right or wrong or better or worse. Just different. If they had done things your way, it wouldn't be the game it is. You probably don't want their advice on the games you re involved in. It's OK to Think about and state what you might like to see in the game, but I think it is more to the point to take it as it is; enjoy it for what it is. And hope for a sequel.
What else could they have done besides go supernatural or full-blown government conspiracy? Even the opening makes it abundantly clear it's about the details and how things will kind of just happen. It's game about three people who ended up trying to escape their various problems, only for, as Delilah states in one of the ending dialogues, "them to be right there in front of you still."
Not everything has to be super fulfilling. The point of this game is showing how bad escapism can turn out, how life can kind of screw up in ways that just ripple outward, etc. It's not about disappointment. I just wish gamers would stop being spoiled with multiple endings. :T There's more to choices than the ending.
***SPOILERS BELOW***
And the storyline of the dead kid and missing father mystery was just exciting enough to be believable and not too over-the-top. It was a shame Henry never got to meet Delilah, but it didn't surprise me either. The type of people who would consider this job are not exactly "people" persons and Delilah in particular was probably an extreme introvert. The thought of meeting Henry after all they shared at a distance was probably just too overwhelming for her to handle.
I for one cannot wait for Campo Santo's next release. Keep up the great work guys!
I feel absolutely the same way, begining was boring (in addition to annoying game design flaws which i would not discuss in this thread, since its story relate), i felt like this game deserve 7 of 10 at start, then something strange started to happen, at 1st i expected some maniac story and that game will go SAW on me, my level of joy started to grow and i was almost about to give this game 8 of 9 and hopped that final twist would be mindblowing just like SAW, then even stranger things started to happen, i started to expect game go X-files with aliens or Twin Peaks with some mysterious ♥♥♥♥ on me, even was excepting Jacob's Ladder kind of revelation at this point i almost forgiven all design flaws and was really expecting epic climatic conclusion... but in the end this game gone LOST, if you know what i mean.
Remember how 90% of all intrigues and plot twists in the end of LOST tv series was totally cheapened and ignored and everything happened because smoke just wanted get out of island and his bro wanted to protect giant corc, and whole alternate time line where no plane crash happened appeared to be far fetched purgatory that happened long after ending of story and was completely disjoined? Everything that series set up prior final episode was just a meaningless lie to keep us guessing, and ending was completely out of nowhere irrational far fetched ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ that gave no care about most of story and the only thing it did well - it was unpredictable, and it was unpredictable only because ending of LOST totally did not follow the logic and setup of previous seasons and even episodes of final season, Lindelof (who considered as one of the worst writers because of such a stupid manner of writing endings out of no where and not following logic of begining) just was trying to go "they will never guess" route, instead of following logic, which is a predictable but less dissapointing, and he definetely lacked skill to combine both - logical following of previously set up events, and yet no so obvious conclusion
Absolutely same ♥♥♥♥ heppened in this game, but even worse, LOST has at least some magic mumbo jumbo in the end, this one just so unimaginative and so.... i dont know how to describe this, its like you dating the girl, she says she loves you, she gives tips that tonight you are going to have sex with her, she ask you to come to her home prepared for best thing in your lfie... and when you come, she meets you in sexy lingerie, does sexy talks to you, and even gets in bad with, but when you have uber bonner and wants to begin sex, she says gotch "we breaking up, gtfo from my house".- and there is absolutely no rational foreshadowing of this outcome and everything was going to lead to sex tonight, not to broken heart!
Thats how this game feels in the end! And thats only when you speak about story of relationship of H and D, then dont even freaking meet together! I expected to meet her!
And if you will speak about other part of story, cryptic one its like you know - goverment says that aliens started invasion, people running out of homes in pani, whole country gone "Independance day", but in the end it happens that there are no aliens, no invasion, and some sigarete smoking man wanted to take control over world (yeah, im talking about you - ♥♥♥♥♥♥ X-files season 10 aka revival mini series, that ruined 9 previous seasons and turned them into joke). Or its like Mass Effect 3 and its 3 endings with explosions of different color. Ot its like any of recent Telltale games starting from Walking Dead, which has hell lot of far-fetched forced events happens even despite game set you up to expect something differnt but in the end telltale says big FY in you face and force conclusion that came out of nowhere and where you choice really means nothing and whole expectation of something epic goes to hell ...
...and looking at credits of Firewatch i see hell lot of people from Telltale who was making Walking dead and dumbed down company from once traditional point-n-click developers to QTE cutscenes developers who can only make games with illusion of choice and illusion of epic stories that always ends up most anticlimatic forced way.
Looks like even outside of Telltale they cant think outside of Telltale box and doing same ♥♥♥♥ as they did before and as Lindelof and Carter did in LOST and Xfiles.
They just cheating you like 90% of story time, makes illusion of something grand and epic going on, makes illusion of choice that matters, but in the end they say "FY, eat this far fetched forced ending that nobody expected and that has almost no connection to most of story we told you, and where none of your choices really matters".
I invented special term for telltale and Lindelof type of storytelling and endingscrewing, which also applies to this game:
"narrative fraud"
honestly anyone who pays for book, movie or game, deserve right for refund if such narrative fraud happens in the end.and Im going to claim for refund, since after this narrative fraud game feels like 5\10 - waste of time and narrow-fov caused headache for no justified and satisfying ending.
P.S. - And damn it, thing about photos and evidences if real game design scam! The lie to you by telling that you have to make photo evidences just in case, you believe that is part of game mechanics, that will affect ending, also collection of evidences definetely gives impression like its going to affect ending, and you may end up in jail or may clear your name and prove truth, but no, absolutely no affect! This, and whole set of choices you make during entire game is pure and evil lie, devs of game wants you to belive in presence of game mechanics that does not exist! This is game design fraud as well, this is unaceptable.
Devs can only pay for their crimes by expanding game and releasing EXTENDED EDITION patch where ending is completely rewriten and follows logic of story, where choices leads to different endings, where mechanics of collecting phot and note evidences does exist and also changes conclusion of game dramatically.
P.S. 2 - even if you will forget about all this, existing ending makes no sense and does not feel concluded, the guy who left you final note - where is he? why his motivation so inconsistent, why leaving tape that tells everything? Why setting them up? Why recording them? This just feels like game was half done, and instead of original ending they wrote this in one evening and impemented in month before release.
If they are not going to overhaul story and rewrite ending and add mechanics they claim exist in this game, im not going to buy any of their games again, because if they would not fix this mess i will be sure that they always will mess un endings of their games same way they did back in telltale.
Wrote review about my frustration with this game and described lot of its flaws here:
http://steamcommunity.com/id/voodooman/recommended/383870
unfortunately i ran out of space and cant add more, but there is way more flaws to discuss.
The details were there. You were just too busy paying attention to one thing to notice. Seriously, play it again, pay attetion to details, etc. They're not going to rewrite a game to give you your supernatural mystery just because that's what you built it up to be because you missed out on all of the details.
And to your knowledge i paid attention to all that mumbo jumbo you was talking about, and it like like minor irrevelant details, and even after final revelation its very hard to believe that whole huge set-up was made up by one man, because its so far fetched and their is no solid logic behind his actions and hell lof o plot holes.
It is a narrative fraud, because writers of this game used cheap trick, to cheat everyone into believing there is some massive intriguing plot, and in the end i happened to be tiny far-fetched and lackluster. THIS IS A 100% what fraud means.
Its like a false advertising - someone says to you that game will last 100 hours and you end it in 2, or when someone tells you that game would have best graphics ever and shows you screenshots that looks good, but actual product look like something from PS2 era.
Or its like you know - you met 18 girl online, she shows you fake photo where she looks like super hot photo model and you are not aware of fact its fake, she tells you on purpose how good she is, she makes and illusion of that to cheat you, to fell into her trap (actually you mentioned trap itself, fraud is by definion can be desribed as attempt to force someone to fall into a deathtrap by covering its presence and promising something better than this) and then you setting a date and it happens she is fat, ugly, has mustache and she is actually a 45 year old psycho dressed like girl XD
Its a trap! and its a fraud! because is a deliberate deception!
This game useses narrative deliberate deception, as a cheap trick to make an illusion of grander, more immaginative, more interesting, more complex, deeper and wider. more rational and better story than it actually has! it also uses narrative and gameplay deliberate deception, as a cheap trick to make an illusion of impact of choice to end of story.
Thats why its doulbe fraud - narrative and gameplay fraud. The promise you to deliver some of big and expensive scale, but gives you something little and cheap, in so unbelievable fashion so it leads to nothing but frustration.
Cant you use your logic and see it? Dont you feel cheated when game constantly gives you choices, tells you that you need to make photos as evidence to clear your name, and in the end nothing is matter and you dont even have confrontation with bad guy? Dont you feel cheated when game constantly insist on development of relationships between you and deliliah and in the end no matter what you did or said she rejects you and you dont even meet her? Dont you feel cheated when game tells you about fences around huge area of which Deliah is no aware (is this was not secret black project - how come she as boss knows nothing of what happens under her nose?) and when people talk about black helicopters that deliver things there at nigh and in the end none of this explained or have connection to revelation? Dont you feel cheated when girls suddenly vanish, and their clothes and tent torn appart like there was a fight, and then game suddenly tells you their are ok and just did something funny and left their closes and all the stuff to be torn appart by nobody knows who? Dont you feel that all of conclusions to interesting story arks are far-fetched and not believable?
If you answered no to at least half of questions, congrats, you are Neinstein, and not as smart as you think your are, because you cant see obvious far fetching, plot holes and cant even get definition of word "fraud".
P.S. - oh i see you dont even own the game. Troll detected.
Also: it's called Let's Plays. :V I have watched about five people play through the game now. But sure, I'm a troll, not the person whining that it didn't go exactly their way.
In this game it would work if it would set everything as simple murder or accidental death, and then boom it happens that it was alien conspiracy - this works because it goes from small to large progressively. This however wouldn't not work if there would be plot hole that would make contradiction and not so smooth transition between expectations and real resolution of story.
In this game everything is opposite it goes from large to small and makes a lot of contradiction between what you expect and their resolution, that's why you feel cheated can't believe resolution and understand that it's really cheap.
MGS 2 is example of plot twists that works, because no contradiction and because it goes from small to large, but this is when you speak about ending of plant chapter which tells you about bigger conspiracy with AI involved and also giving clues that whole game is just VR simulation.
Yet MGS 2 is also example of twist that doesn't work. Biggest reason why many fans hate it despite it best of series in general is because their expectations after tanker episode was ruined and gone from large to small very cheap way, when Snake was replaced by Raiden. There was no logical setup for this, and Raiden was small resolution comparing to snake, because nobody cares about new girlish character and everyone wants to follow snake adventure and game was expected to be about solid snake.
You the pattern of good and bad twist? Going from real colonel to AI fake colonel is a good twist, going from snake to Raiden is a bad twist, for 1st twist many people love MGS 2 and for second many people hate it. Ippersonally love game in general because 1st twist paid more than expected for sins of 2nd twist, and because chronological order of twists was bad 1st good in the end.
I need scissors! 61! (c)
This AI twist was so epic that I gave this game forgiveness for ♥♥♥♥♥♥ twistabout raiden in a middmiddle of game. twists are not universal if you as writer lack understanding and sense of what twist is going to be good, you will ruin story and will make most of people hate it, this apply to firewatch.