No skills, fine, but where did Traits go?

[76561198157873822]

Just occurred to me that they removed traits- those perks of which you could pick two at character creation, each had a bonus and a malus? They have been in every fallout game. Removing skills at least I understand the logic behind- I still don't like it but whatever.

But they removed Traits and replaced them with... nothing?

From what I can tell the only two that survived as perks were Bloody Mess- which hardly counts because it has just been a straight damage increase with no malus since FO3, and was just-for-fun in FO1+2- and Night Person, which now also has no malus.

Traits were important decisions. You had to ask what kinda guy you wanted to be and what maluses you were willing to accept for more specialization. It was a fun part of character creation- why remove them?

[Straybow]

Malus is antithetical to Bethesda 'character' design

[KoalafiedKiller]

Because old school RPG character creation is out, fluidity is in. Same reason elder scrolls removed major/minor skills, birth signs, and the plethora of racial bonuses.

(Not saying I like the new method)

[Crixus]

Wild wasteland.....I miss you....

[MDuh]

They made it simpler and streamlined for noobs/new to fallout.

[76561198157873822]

Originally posted by Marauder:

Wild wasteland.....I miss you....

me too...

even IF maluses go against their design philosophy (which i find asinine) why couldnt we get some just-for-fun traits like Wild Wasteland? it just seems like gouging a good system for the sake of less work.

After checking the wiki a bit, apparently i misremembered: fallout 3 didnt have traits, but new vegas did. interesting...

[wordwaster]

i miss the reputation traits from fallout 2.

[[FuFo] Mortucus]

wait for the creation kit then the goodie will flow freelyyyyyyyyyyy

[Count_Fuzzball]

Originally posted by KoalafiedKiller:

Because old school RPG character creation is out, fluidity is in. Same reason elder scrolls removed major/minor skills, birth signs, and the plethora of racial bonuses.

(Not saying I like the new method)

I liked the birth signs in Oblivion, they made the character unique, along with the racial bonuses.

I like the idea of Major/Minor skills in principle, but having to keep track of which skills you leveled before your character progressed a level so you could get the perfect +5 stat bonus was a bit of a letdown, imo.

[KoalafiedKiller]

Originally posted by SAS_Sgt_Master:

I like the idea of Major/Minor skills in principle, but having to keep track of which skills you leveled before your character progressed a level so you could get the perfect +5 stat bonus was a bit of a letdown, imo.

I'm not following what you mean here.

[Simpson3k]

Originally posted by Mortucus:

wait for the creation kit then the goodie will flow freelyyyyyyyyyyy

Those modders really have to make miracules true and PERHAPS I buy the next fallout game from the modders directly *shouting in Bethesda´s direction* why paying you if they do the job?

[Crixus]

Originally posted by to go alone:

Originally posted by Marauder:

Wild wasteland.....I miss you....

me too...

even IF maluses go against their design philosophy (which i find asinine) why couldnt we get some just-for-fun traits like Wild Wasteland? it just seems like gouging a good system for the sake of less work.

After checking the wiki a bit, apparently i misremembered: fallout 3 didnt have traits, but new vegas did. interesting...

New vegas had much more than this game and it's much older and made by obsadian. Bethesda could learn from them and should have.

NV had traits and kept skills. Made leveling more fun. Wild wasteland to me was great. Little things liked that made the game more interesting and made me want to adventure more.

Yeah this game has more crafting, wow I have the choice of 2 mods for my melee weapon! and 2 mod slots for armor, how amazing -.- NV just had more weapon choice anyway by far.

[supertrooper225]

Originally posted by Marauder:

Originally posted by to go alone:

me too...

even IF maluses go against their design philosophy (which i find asinine) why couldnt we get some just-for-fun traits like Wild Wasteland? it just seems like gouging a good system for the sake of less work.

After checking the wiki a bit, apparently i misremembered: fallout 3 didnt have traits, but new vegas did. interesting...

New vegas had much more than this game and it's much older and made by obsadian. Bethesda could learn from them and should have.

NV had traits and kept skills. Made leveling more fun. Wild wasteland to me was great. Little things liked that made the game more interesting and made me want to adventure more.

Yeah this game has more crafting, wow I have the choice of 2 mods for my melee weapon! and 2 mod slots for armor, how amazing -.- NV just had more weapon choice anyway by far.

Wow....not really.

New Vegas also had a boring ass environment to play in and tons of useless space.

There are far more than 2 weapon mods. Level your perks up.

[Crixus]

Originally posted by supertrooper225:

Originally posted by Marauder:

New vegas had much more than this game and it's much older and made by obsadian. Bethesda could learn from them and should have.

NV had traits and kept skills. Made leveling more fun. Wild wasteland to me was great. Little things liked that made the game more interesting and made me want to adventure more.

Yeah this game has more crafting, wow I have the choice of 2 mods for my melee weapon! and 2 mod slots for armor, how amazing -.- NV just had more weapon choice anyway by far.

Wow....not really.

New Vegas also had a boring ass environment to play in and tons of useless space.

There are far more than 2 weapon mods. Level your perks up.

Nothing to do with leveling perks, you see all mods just unavailable ones are greyed out. My sword has a choice of serrated blades, some electric attack or both together...Very boring. You should be able to customize the handle, blade and add stuff to it.

Armor crafting is also boring. Just select the strogest mod in both slots and your done.

Weapon crafting is better but still not full of choices, 99% of the time your going to want just the last option since it's usually the strongest.

Fallout new vegas had mods too sure they wasn't great but neither are fallout 4 mods and at least in nv you had such a huge weapon choice.

[Count_Fuzzball]

Originally posted by KoalafiedKiller:

Originally posted by SAS_Sgt_Master:

I like the idea of Major/Minor skills in principle, but having to keep track of which skills you leveled before your character progressed a level so you could get the perfect +5 stat bonus was a bit of a letdown, imo.

I'm not following what you mean here.

You know the way in Oblivion you had to level any of your major skills a certain number of times to gain a level for your character? I think being "punished" for only leveling destruction twice, but leveling blade 13 more times until you gained a level does unnecessarily and unfairly gimp the player. That meant you can only add +2 to Intelligence and +5 to Strength, all other character stats be damned.

The oblivion system required alot more 'out of game' ("metagaming" I think is the buzzword all the cool kids use these days) planning to make sure you leveled 5 different skills evenly throughout a single character's level. *jumps up and down in one spot to raise acrobatics*

[Apoletestry]

I wonder the same thing as well. So I read the Wiki that is on this game and find two interesting things, 1: "The initial plans for Fallout 4 were formed in 2009, when director Todd Howard wanted to explore the world of Fallout before the bombs fell."

I find this confusing since you can still pretty easily determine what "Before The Bombs" was like with environmental storytelling, scattered notes/terminals and maybe the names of some things like towns and buildings e.ct.
Since Fallout was always really good at environmental storytelling even in the very first game.
_______________

And the second interesting thing, 2: "Meanwhile, development on The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim had Bethesda's full attention, and after that game released in 2011, the studio continued to regularly support it until 2013 with updates and DLC.

Could Fallout 4 have been an entirely different game after some or even very little work began directly after they finished Skyrim?

Oh, well it's not like we will ever get a good answer anyways. I just find Game Development, very interesting.