The reality of nukes and the landscape of the FALLOUT universe.

[garravesh]

I have always wondered why the capitol wasteland was fairly intact. I am sure this new city will be intact as well. Nukes did not fall on Vegas, as we know, so it is just run down and worn out. Looking to places like Hiroshima and Nagasaki there were miles of flattened city. Literally nothing there even the concrete reinforced buildings of the city were virtually nonexistant. Yet we see the Vault man roaming and roaming some more to a scenery of only minorly damaged homes and worse yet some that look like they were not touched at all just neglected.

I am awares of the nature of the canon history of the fallout universe....nukes are less powerful. Still places like DC would have been hit countless times and virtually reduced to cinders.....

While this does make for great visual experiences it takes away, in some small fashion, the feel of a nuked wastelend.

I wonder how this new game will address that......from what i am seeing it will be more of the same.

The wasteleand has always felt far too populated with icons/peopple from the old world...the only exception is Vegas.

Is the voice of "War...war never changes" coming back too?

[Jedi]

引用自 TunnelSnakesRule：

America likely had state of the art counter-nuke systems.

In fallout lore most of the damage came not from the nukes themselves (cities were reasonably well defended) but rather from the radioactive fallout that engulfed the entire Earth for decades after the great war.

That being said the part of DC we saw was likely just outside the blast zone, which would explain the reasonably intact buildings.

In fallout 4 there is an entire area of the game that is just radioactive hell. Godd Howard explained that this is where the nuke hit.

*A* nuke.
There's also the one in Megaton which didn't go off; and the one from NV which malfunctioned or something (Mr.House talks about it)

[garravesh]

引用自 TunnelSnakesRule：

America likely had state of the art counter-nuke systems.

In fallout lore most of the damage came not from the nukes themselves (cities were reasonably well defended) but rather from the radioactive fallout that engulfed the entire Earth for decades after the great war.

That being said the part of DC we saw was likely just outside the blast zone, which would explain the reasonably intact buildings.

In fallout 4 there is an entire area of the game that is just radioactive hell. Godd Howard explained that this is where the nuke hit.

Interesting

[WalrusMan]

引用自 Jedi Masta Moses：

引用自 TunnelSnakesRule：

America likely had state of the art counter-nuke systems.

In fallout lore most of the damage came not from the nukes themselves (cities were reasonably well defended) but rather from the radioactive fallout that engulfed the entire Earth for decades after the great war.

That being said the part of DC we saw was likely just outside the blast zone, which would explain the reasonably intact buildings.

In fallout 4 there is an entire area of the game that is just radioactive hell. Godd Howard explained that this is where the nuke hit.

*A* nuke.
There's also the one in Megaton which didn't go off; and the one from NV which malfunctioned or something (Mr.House talks about it)

It seems that from what Godd has told us and the footage we have seen only one nuke actually hit the relative area of Boston.

[BlackWater]

引用自 sven10077：

引用自 BlackWater：

There is also the possibility that a lot of the bombs used were Enhanced Radiation Weapons, like Neutron Bombs.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neutron_bomb

That could explain why some areas have a lot of radiation but a lot more intact structres, its possible that a mixture of nuclear weapons were used during the exchange.

Possibly, of course if there was a canonical "dude no way in hades can we go through there...the rads they microwave you in seconds" zone it'd be evidence of a cobalt salted bomb...

Nukes are a blast both figuratively and literally

There is a place in the Lonesome Road, with really high levels of radiation called The Couriors Mile, this wasn't the site of a detonation from a enemy bomb since it was a post war event but it could be evidence of ERW's in the Fallout universe. Since the area is relatively intact for being so close to a detonation site and is filled with massive amounts of radiation.

Also what about the site around vault 87, I think a nuke detonated nearby sealing the main entrance but the general area isn't anymore destroyed then most of the area but smothered in radiation. Although its mostly speculation since we just see the after effect since the detonation could have caused a lot of destruction. What do you think about the bomb near Vault 87?

[Kaname]

Curious if mr house was dead or got murdered before the bombs fell would vault 3 vault 21 and other vaults in new vegas have survived the nukes ? I do think vault 3 would be destroyed the ♥♥♥♥ing entrance was out in the open...

[Turkeysammich]

Just change the word "nuke" to "EF5 radiated tornado" and then you won't have issues anymore

[sven10077]

引用自 TunnelSnakesRule：

America likely had state of the art counter-nuke systems.

In fallout lore most of the damage came not from the nukes themselves (cities were reasonably well defended) but rather from the radioactive fallout that engulfed the entire Earth for decades after the great war.

That being said the part of DC we saw was likely just outside the blast zone, which would explain the reasonably intact buildings.

In fallout 4 there is an entire area of the game that is just radioactive hell. Godd Howard explained that this is where the nuke hit.

It's true, FO America would never have signed the ABM treaty with the Soviets and neo-canon says the majority of damage to the US was from Sino SLBM hits....

Though there is no "Reagan" in FO canon I'm certain the impulse of the United States Space Administration would have been to neutralize as much ICBM fun as possible with some form of "brilliant pebbles" SDI solution....

People also tend to forget that friday night games of "Atomic Blast-o vision" had been going on for a decade BEFORE party night 2077...

by the time the Chinese threw down Americans were inured to the panic in far too many cases and civil defense suffered mightily as a result....

[WalrusMan]

引用自 Turkeysammich：

Just change the word "nuke" to "EF5 radiated tornado" and then you won't have issues anymore

The chinese and their damn commie tornado gun.

[BlackWater]

引用自 TunnelSnakesRule：

引用自 Turkeysammich：

Just change the word "nuke" to "EF5 radiated tornado" and then you won't have issues anymore

The chinese and their damn commie tornado gun.

That would be pretty crazy, I wonder how that could be done? Maybe by detonating a dirty bomb inside a large tornado.

[ArtemFC]

Remember the Japanese had Huts for Houses and "Paper Walls". Hell the Fire Bombings of 100's of cities in Japan Killed more people I think. Look at some Videos on Youtube of the US testing Nuke Damage. In one of them, the detonate a Nuke that is surrounded by Warships and they didn't just Vanish and they were "Ground Zero". What things are made of determines the amount of Devastation as well a distance from ground zero.

[armaghgeddon™]

引用自 garravesh：

I dont see a radioactive wasteland as boring because it is flat......they just need to be more creative and not using the idea of weaker nukes, what rubbish, as a reason to why virtually every building is intact to some degree when nukes were defintely flying over DC and on to DC.

The metro/subways are extrodinary places to tell tales like METRO. The topside is unlivable except for short runs.

In Fallout there would be places of virtually nothing just rubbish and ruins from the old world...places to find resources to rebuild society....but certainly not intact things like the Capitol building and the other very famous land marks......

My point is not to berate the game....just to have conversation as to why, what, how when etc.

What seems to have happened is one of 3 things.

1) Most of the nukes where ERWs, which means they have vastly reduced blast power but huge amounts of radioactive discharge and thus fallout. By 2770's however, a large amount of this fallout would've been able to either fade away or spread out. We have no evidence on how fallout works on such timescales so it's all guesswork.

2) Nukes are ♥♥♥♥ in the FO universe, meaning that they simply missed because of poor targeting and their lack of power just blew over the outhouse and left the farmstead intact, or they just failed to explode (like The One in F:NV)

3) People rebuilt on a scale far surpassing what we originally suspected, or the Pre-War buildings were reinforced by new materials we don't know about. Perhaps a concrete analogue to Saturnite like you find in New Vegas?

[WalrusMan]

引用自 |MLGEESUZ| Soul-Eating Sergeant：

引用自 garravesh：

I dont see a radioactive wasteland as boring because it is flat......they just need to be more creative and not using the idea of weaker nukes, what rubbish, as a reason to why virtually every building is intact to some degree when nukes were defintely flying over DC and on to DC.

The metro/subways are extrodinary places to tell tales like METRO. The topside is unlivable except for short runs.

In Fallout there would be places of virtually nothing just rubbish and ruins from the old world...places to find resources to rebuild society....but certainly not intact things like the Capitol building and the other very famous land marks......

My point is not to berate the game....just to have conversation as to why, what, how when etc.

What seems to have happened is one of 3 things.

1) Most of the nukes where ERWs, which means they have vastly reduced blast power but huge amounts of radioactive discharge and thus fallout. By 2770's however, a large amount of this fallout would've been able to either fade away or spread out. We have no evidence on how fallout works on such timescales so it's all guesswork.

2) Nukes are ♥♥♥♥ in the FO universe, meaning that they simply missed because of poor targeting and their lack of power just blew over the outhouse and left the farmstead intact, or they just failed to explode (like The One in F:NV)

3) People rebuilt on a scale far surpassing what we originally suspected, or the Pre-War buildings were reinforced by new materials we don't know about. Perhaps a concrete analogue to Saturnite like you find in New Vegas?

*2270

[sven10077]

引用自 bobk90：

Remember the Japanese had Huts for Houses and "Paper Walls". Hell the Fire Bombings of 100's of cities in Japan Killed more people I think. Look at some Videos on Youtube of the US testing Nuke Damage. In one of them, the detonate a Nuke that is surrounded by Warships and they didn't just Vanish and they were "Ground Zero". What things are made of determines the amount of Devastation as well a distance from ground zero.

Which gets us back to "wildly overestimate the lethality of an exchange"...

Here's a blast from the past...

"The House in the Middle"

https://youtu.be/pGJcwaUWNZg

Want to have your house be more like Andale than Vault 87?

Keep your yard clean, have white curtains, and white paint that is backed by good primer...

hardly jokes either...remember the FO America never suffered from the willful decision our socialists made in the early 70s to make nuclear war less survivable through gutting civil defense.

[garravesh]

引用自 bobk90：

Remember the Japanese had Huts for Houses and "Paper Walls". Hell the Fire Bombings of 100's of cities in Japan Killed more people I think. Look at some Videos on Youtube of the US testing Nuke Damage. In one of them, the detonate a Nuke that is surrounded by Warships and they didn't just Vanish and they were "Ground Zero". What things are made of determines the amount of Devastation as well a distance from ground zero.

Well look to the teaser of the game.....the nuke hits and a firestorm ensues yet you look at the homes with the vault dweller......they look fairly intact......intact to the point if making me feel it is absurd......the firestorm should have done a lot more damage IMO.....

yes the japanese had much different building styles BUT their concrete reinforced buildings were destroyed as well....virtually unrecogniazable. and the Hiroshima bomb was a MISS and landed in a valley way off target and that shielded much of the blast

[sven10077]

引用自 bobk90：

Remember the Japanese had Huts for Houses and "Paper Walls". Hell the Fire Bombings of 100's of cities in Japan Killed more people I think. Look at some Videos on Youtube of the US testing Nuke Damage. In one of them, the detonate a Nuke that is surrounded by Warships and they didn't just Vanish and they were "Ground Zero". What things are made of determines the amount of Devastation as well a distance from ground zero.

and yes the firebombings of Dresden and Tokyo killed more people than the Atomic bombings.