Why do automatic heavy weapons do so little damage?

[Gracey Face]

My minigun does 20 damage a shot, my rocket launcher does 575. My rocketlauncher 1-3 hit kills everything, whereas my minigun takes several hundred rounds to kill anything.

For example a raider survivalist will die in 1 rocket, 2 if I only clip them with the splash, whereas I have to unload 400+ rounds into thier head to kill them with the minigun. But the difference in dealt damage in both those situations is ludicrous, the minigun putting out 8x the damage the rocket launcher did.

Is there a damage threshold mechanic, which penalises the low damage per shot minigun/flamer? I cant see any mention of it anywhere, and my guy doesnt seem to have one.

Its not that I am missing (though the minigun does miss alot), even when you get so close you cannot possibly miss you still take huge amounts of ammo to kill things. I know automatic rifles dont suffer (at least noticably) from the same problem. It takes the amount of shots you would expect to down something.

[Veya]

Publicado originalmente por SIlverblade-T-E:

Publicado originalmente por Veya:

Some people also argue that the tri-barrel minigun uses the wrong ammo kind, in real life, a tri-barrel minigun[en.wikipedia.org](which the tri-barrel seem very clearly to be based on) uses .50 rounds instead of 7.62x51mm rounds, which should make it a lot more powerful than the "standard" minigun.

Honestly, it would be an interesting trade-off, using the significantly more expensive .50 round to make the minigun a monster of a gun, I would be down to it if I ever cared to use automatic weapons.

A Human could NOT fire a .50 minigun! maybe in power armour but not otherwise, the weight/recoil would be nuts

also, the game weapon uses 5mm ammo which is very small, there is a 5.56mm minigun
and there is a 3 barrel 7.62 mm minigun
3 barrels does NOT -automatically mean .50 cal, it's just a different version
in game it's more accurate/longer range/more damaging but that's because it loses fire rate by comparison, it' snot suddenly hugely better at over all damage, like it would be if it used .50

and also, the idea of pipe rifles firing .50 BMG ammo etc...ludicrous
pipe guns do exist but they're 99% of the time garbage and as likely to blow your hand/face off
the pressures in a gun's chamber are enormous, hence very thick, very specially made barrels etc.
not just a piece of pipe!
pipe guns in .22LR and .38 Special or the like are plausible

You said it yourself that this game is stupidly unrealistic when it comes to weapons at times, would it really be that far-fetched coming from a series with a commie-hating giant robot?

[Shad]

Publicado originalmente por Veya:

Publicado originalmente por SIlverblade-T-E:

A Human could NOT fire a .50 minigun! maybe in power armour but not otherwise, the weight/recoil would be nuts

also, the game weapon uses 5mm ammo which is very small, there is a 5.56mm minigun
and there is a 3 barrel 7.62 mm minigun
3 barrels does NOT -automatically mean .50 cal, it's just a different version
in game it's more accurate/longer range/more damaging but that's because it loses fire rate by comparison, it' snot suddenly hugely better at over all damage, like it would be if it used .50

and also, the idea of pipe rifles firing .50 BMG ammo etc...ludicrous
pipe guns do exist but they're 99% of the time garbage and as likely to blow your hand/face off
the pressures in a gun's chamber are enormous, hence very thick, very specially made barrels etc.
not just a piece of pipe!
pipe guns in .22LR and .38 Special or the like are plausible

You said it yourself that this game is stupidly unrealistic when it comes to weapons at times, would it really be that far-fetched coming from a series with a commie-hating giant robot?

But Liberty Prime is SO immersive!

[Nite69]

get the Commando perk maxed out for auto weapons and rifleman perk maxed out for single shot weapons

I use the Rifle one since I like sneaking and head shot critical kills

[Veya]

Publicado originalmente por =EGC= _Nite_:

get the Commando perk maxed out for auto weapons and rifle perk maxed out for single shot weapons

The Minigun is NOT affected by Commando, Commando is for automatic pistols and rifles ONLY.

[Nite69]

Publicado originalmente por SIlverblade-T-E:

Publicado originalmente por Veya:

Some people also argue that the tri-barrel minigun uses the wrong ammo kind, in real life, a tri-barrel minigun[en.wikipedia.org](which the tri-barrel seem very clearly to be based on) uses .50 rounds instead of 7.62x51mm rounds, which should make it a lot more powerful than the "standard" minigun.

Honestly, it would be an interesting trade-off, using the significantly more expensive .50 round to make the minigun a monster of a gun, I would be down to it if I ever cared to use automatic weapons.

A Human could NOT fire a .50 minigun! maybe in power armour but not otherwise, the weight/recoil would be nuts
you cannot lift and fire a .50 cal "Ma Deuce" (iirc that's 80 pounds weight or 50 for newer ones?), never mind a .50 cal minigun!

I rememeber seeing an episode of sons of guns where a custom built hand held 50 cal minigun was made, the dude that wanted it was able to handle it fine.

[Shad]

Publicado originalmente por =EGC= _Nite_:

Publicado originalmente por SIlverblade-T-E:

A Human could NOT fire a .50 minigun! maybe in power armour but not otherwise, the weight/recoil would be nuts
you cannot lift and fire a .50 cal "Ma Deuce" (iirc that's 80 pounds weight or 50 for newer ones?), never mind a .50 cal minigun!

I rememeber seeing an episode of sons of guns where a custom built hand held 50 cal minigun was made, the dude that wanted it was able to handle it fine.

I like that show, and i remember that episode.
If you're strong enough, you'd be able to handle a weapon like that, just don't throw your back out.

[Josh]

Publicado originalmente por Not A Cop:

You can shoot a lot of bullets with a minigun in a short ammount of time vs shooting one missle at a time.

It balances itself out that way.

Not with a quad barreled, targetting computer missile launcher.

Took down a mirelurk queen on survival with 4 missiles. So easy.

[Draa]

The Dillon Aero Minigun fires between 2000 - 6000 rounds per minute. Let's assume the high end of 6000p/m for FO4's minigun and that's 100 rounds per second. With 16 damage per round that's 1600 damage per second. Even at the low end (2000 r/m) it would be 530+ p/s damage. Not too bad if that's what it's based on but you'd still have to hold target to get that much damage per second. If you could find ammo that is.

[madocs]

Publicado originalmente por Veya:

A Minigun needs a Legendary prefix like "Bleeding", "Explosive" or "Irradiated" to be powerful, if you have one of those prefixes, it is an excellent weapon, but if you don't, the DR system makes it hard for it to be viable at all.

This!! Then they are OP!!! lol

[Urizen]

Heavy weapons are affected by Heavy Gunner perk. Requires 5 str.

[Jayavarman VII]

Publicado originalmente por Veya:

Publicado originalmente por =EGC= _Nite_:

get the Commando perk maxed out for auto weapons and rifle perk maxed out for single shot weapons

The Minigun is NOT affected by Commando, Commando is for automatic pistols and rifles ONLY.

Wait what.. Isn't rifle for ranger perk and not commando.

[Veya]

Publicado originalmente por Novelty:

Publicado originalmente por Veya:

The Minigun is NOT affected by Commando, Commando is for automatic pistols and rifles ONLY.

Wait what.. Isn't rifle for ranger perk and not commando.

Rifleman is for semi-automatic and bolt-action rifles.

Commando is for automatic rifles and pistols

Gunslinger is for semi-automatic pistols and revolvers.

Modding a weapon can change which perk it is affected by.

[Gracey Face]

I was looking up the way DR and damage works in this game. And essentially automatic weapons are penalised heavily, but the minigun is sort of a "perfect storm" of penalties.

The damage reduction not damage threshold, but depends on the difference between incoming damage and protection. If the incoming damage is equal to the DR, the end damage is 50%, the less damage you do compared to the resistance, the more % reduction they get. As an example a lvl 50 mob will have around 150 ballistic protection, which against a 20 damage gatling gun slug means ~75% DR.

Additionally, the range modifier reduces your potential damage down to half once you get to 2x the range from the enemy, which is a thing because the minigun has pretty terrible range. So that 50% reduction makes my damage applied 10, versus that same 150 defence this means around 82% DR. Of course, with a minigun you will be missing most of your shots at this kind of distance.

And then you have the difficulty based damage mod on top of that.



Meanwhile explosive weapons have both high per hit damage and high range values, meaning they dont give two ♥♥♥♥♥ about damage resistance :D.

[Hex]

Publicado originalmente por Useless!:

I was looking up the way DR and damage works in this game. And essentially automatic weapons are penalised heavily, but the minigun is sort of a "perfect storm" of penalties.

The damage reduction not damage threshold, but depends on the difference between incoming damage and protection. If the incoming damage is equal to the DR, the end damage is 50%, the less damage you do compared to the resistance, the more % reduction they get.

Additionally, the range modifier reduces your potential damage down to half, which is a thing because the minigun has pretty terrible range.

Meanwhile explosive weapons have both high per hit damage and high range values, meaning they dont give two ♥♥♥♥♥ about damage resistance essentially :D.

All this.

However, once you get a minigun with a special bonus like explosive ammo or bleed... ♥♥♥♥ gets real. :)

Or even "ignore 30% armour" will make it a monster.

[Peter Pan]

It's due to the armor system.

Automatic and mini guns rely on their sheer output of bullets to do "DPS", but in order to prevent them from being too powerful, they reduce the damage per bullet.

But that means they are only effective against enemies with weak armor. Enemies with good armor will reduce the bullets to little damage.

Think back to the Starcraft games where the Behemoth can soak up marine bullets.

But yeah it's definitely a balance issue.