Brotherhood is the most evil faction

[CheeseLord]

Minutemen are good, railroad are stupid idiots, but not evil, institute is somewhat evil, and they do infiltrate cities, and wipe out the occasional settlement, but they are nowhere near as bad as the brotherhood, the brotherhood steals technology from areas that need it to develop, they treat everyone who is a non member like they are mindless idiots, they are almost all mad idiots who use the tech that they've stole, and use it for their own gain, causing the commonwealth to suffer because of it.

[Mennan]

Originally posted by DouglasGrave:

Originally posted by Immortalis:

That's objectively false. The NCR and the Brotherhood did not wage war "to take back enclave tech", they did so because the Brotherhood tried to convince the ascendant NCR to adopt similar policies in containing access to dangerous technologies and only once the NCR flat out refused to even consider it they went to war..

There was the conflict over Helios One, which is arguably linked to the pre-war Enclave through Poseidon Energy (making it Enclave tech).

The conflict over Helios one was a result of the BoS and NCR already being at war.

The BoS(but in reality only Elijah) thought there was Enclave tech there because of the links between Enclave and Poseidon energy. The Rest of the BoS wanted to leave because they knew they couldn't defend Helios One.

The NCR was just there to kill BoS because they are already in a state of open war.
It simply turns out Elijah was right in the end.

[TheSuit]

Brotherhood doesn't take over settlements they - fight evil then leave.
You will never see anywhere in Lore a brotherhood occupied settlement.

They fight existential threats to humanity but not save humanity.

[DouglasGrave]

Originally posted by Mennan:

Originally posted by DouglasGrave:

There was the conflict over Helios One, which is arguably linked to the pre-war Enclave through Poseidon Energy (making it Enclave tech).

The conflict over Helios one was a result of the BoS and NCR already being at war.

The BoS(but in reality only Elijah) thought there was Enclave tech there because of the links between Enclave and Poseidon energy. The Rest of the BoS wanted to leave because they knew they couldn't defend Helios One.

The NCR was just there to kill BoS because they are already in a state of open war.
It simply turns out Elijah was right in the end.

Yes, I'm just noting that it does involved potential Enclave technology, or something like it.

From what I recall, the NCR just wanted it for its potential to provide energy, unaware of its weapon potential, while the Brotherhood knew of its offensive applications (or at least suspected them).

[CheeseLord]

Fyi, before this discussion gets even more derailed, im only talking about f4 brotherhood, the rest are a very mixed bag.

[jerrypocalypse]

Originally posted by DouglasGrave:

From what I recall, the NCR just wanted it for its potential to provide energy, unaware of its weapon potential, while the Brotherhood knew of its offensive applications (or at least suspected them).

This kinda leads into one of my general thoughts about the BoS. They tend to (obviously not always) think of only the weaponized potential of technologies, ignoring the more practical helpful uses that could aid people, given the apocalyptic state of the world. And often they jump to "this needs to be destroyed" instead of working on ways to apply the benefits safely or altering the tech to no longer being able to be weaponized (or at least more difficult to be used in such a way).

To me, this is largely the case in 4, where they only consider the weaponized potential of the synths, rather than also considering practical applications. Like using lower model synths as labor and seeing how Gen 3s can help boost the population of the wasteland to help ward off other hazards.

[DouglasGrave]

Originally posted by jerrypocalypse:

Originally posted by DouglasGrave:

From what I recall, the NCR just wanted it for its potential to provide energy, unaware of its weapon potential, while the Brotherhood knew of its offensive applications (or at least suspected them).

This kinda leads into one of my general thoughts about the BoS. They tend to (obviously not always) think of only the weaponized potential of technologies, ignoring the more practical helpful uses that could aid people, given the apocalyptic state of the world. And often they jump to "this needs to be destroyed" instead of working on ways to apply the benefits safely or altering the tech to no longer being able to be weaponized (or at least more difficult to be used in such a way).

That could also be partly "when all you have is a hammer...", since the Brotherhood began as ex-military, and even now maintains military force as their primary means of addressing problems.

[jerrypocalypse]

Originally posted by DouglasGrave:

Originally posted by jerrypocalypse:

This kinda leads into one of my general thoughts about the BoS. They tend to (obviously not always) think of only the weaponized potential of technologies, ignoring the more practical helpful uses that could aid people, given the apocalyptic state of the world. And often they jump to "this needs to be destroyed" instead of working on ways to apply the benefits safely or altering the tech to no longer being able to be weaponized (or at least more difficult to be used in such a way).

That could also be partly "when all you have is a hammer...", since the Brotherhood began as ex-military, and even now maintains military force as their primary means of addressing problems.

I'm sure that's definitely a large part of it

[Myr]

The Brotherhood of Steel in general are bad for the wasteland and do more bad than good, the fact that Elder Lyons was seen as an "exception" to the status quo by him actually wanting to help people is a big red flag to the organisation as a whole. In Fallout 3 they really were "the good guys" but they weren't acting as they should have been according to their own principles and therefore its not the Brotherhood as a faction being good.

Frankly they should have disbanded as the Brotherhood of Steel in the Capital Wasteland and became their own faction similar to the Followers of the Apocalypse. But they didn't and they fell back into the status quo leading to them being bad in Fallout 4.

Also a mentioned by others the Brotherhood in New Vegas is definitely evil, don't simp for Veronica she lives in a fantasy dream which takes innocents dying to wake her up from, and even then she whines at you for nuking the bunker.

[Von Faustien]

Following the events of fallout 2 the NCR launched a fullscale invasion of Nvarro the enclaves mainland vertabird fuel depot and staging ground. after the BOS and NCR hunted down enclave stragglers independently of each other.

The BOS than issued an ultimatum demanding the turn over of all advanced enclave weapons, power armor, vertabirds and tech taken by the ncr to bos control. when the NCR refused the BOS began raiding ncr backed caravans and settlements which shortly escalated from some small scale skirmishes into a full blown war.

The NCR did poorly during the early stages due to the BOS having better training and weapons but after shifting to a war footing were able to close the gap via numbers and rangers who were close to par with the bos in training if not gear. finding themselves on the losing side the BOS dropped open conflict shifting to terrorist strikes and guerrilla warfare most notably hitting the NCR gold reserves sending the wests economy into a tailspin.

The NCR continued the war tracking down and destroying multiple BOS bunkers leaving the westren BOS a broken husk cowering underground.

the BOS started a war with the NCR for the express purpose of taking enclave and other advanced tech for themselves this isnt up for debate and despite the claims of some feline idiots with a worse grasp of the lore than Flippy there was no treaty with the bos that the ncr broke and the bos did not help at navarro.

if we go into the fallout bible and van buren the west coast bos also misused stealth boy tech resulting in large numbers of troops and leaders going mad thats also the origin of the angle vegas went with the night kin.

the westren bos was incomptent in fallout 1 and 2 the post 2 era to vegas they are actively malicious. ♥♥♥♥ we even had a elder kidnap people so he could nlock the secrets of the serria madre to gas the entire western seaboard.

[The Inept European]

If we are talking FO4 only then I don't see a single bad action let alone a reason to call them evil.

They are Idealist altruists bleeding and dying to save the Commonwealth and the world from murderous evil monsters.

Only from pro-Institute pro-synth or pro-RR position can you see them as evil (even then I would just say "enemy") so that's the case that needs to be argued first.

BoS in FO4 are the last best hope for the Commonwealth and for humanity. The MM are parochial local yokels out for themselves and for the other 2 factions humanity is very much disposable.

[evilMoo]

Originally posted by CheeseLord:

Originally posted by dot:

I am so interested in knowing the moral compasses of randoms in steam forums :Horse:

Tbh, if it was real life, and i was the main f4 character, id go with the institute, be a part of humanities future instead of trying to help the commonwealth which is like trying to put out a fire with gasoline.

you put little fires out with water and baking soda/sand. you put big fires out with bombs and sometimes gas. :P

[The Inept European]

And of course the BoS take a pessimistic not optimistic view on the uses and abuses of dangerous technology. Because the rosy assumption of benign stewardship led to the end of civilisation and quite possible the end of the species.

In this respect the BoS stand above their predecessors and their critics: they don't have the hubris to assume they can rise above the weaknesses of human nature and use dangerous technology only for good, eliminating with certainty the existential risks of it being used for bad.

The BoS is pretty much the opposite of evil. It is the only force that stands against evil, as opposed to acting for narrow selfish interests.

[Yellowbeard]

https://i.imgflip.com/5nrjyh.jpg

https://i.imgflip.com/7a3wef.jpg

https://i.imgflip.com/45hp1z.jpg

[Big Moustache]

When exploring super mutant infested ruines, they bring their kids along.

[Bored Peon]

Originally posted by CheeseLord:

the brotherhood steals technology from areas that need it to develop,

Provide an example of:
- What tech they stole.
- Where they stole it from.
- Any dialogue or reference to the fact it was the BOS who stole it.

Originally posted by Pookie101:

The ironic thing is that the while collecting technology thing was apparently started so they could eventually help civilisation rebuild and that goal was eventually mutated into hording technology for the sake of it.

- Where is the warehouse with all this hoarded stuff?
8 or 9 games in the franchise and I have yet to see any warehouse of hoarded tech.

If you guys want to make up your own lore for the game that is fine. However presenting your made up fan fiction lore as being correct is wrong.

Originally posted by Liquid Inc:

Now, where's Bored Peon when you need them?

I did not notice the topic yesterday. I also did not think it would be this soon for another BOS bashing topic while one was already active.

Originally posted by dot:

I am so interested in knowing the moral compasses of randoms in steam forums :Horse:

I can name quite a few who have a broken moral compass. However they would just go cry to moderator if I pointed them out by name. So I will point them out by their actions, they argue with me constantly always provoking it, then playing victim, followed by blaming me usually while quoting forums rules while they break them.