To the ppl complaining about skills removal and limited dialogue...

[W1ne-Ton Hammer]

This is what i got to say.

In fallout: NV you have multiple choices, but everytime you pick an option, 80% of the game content is locked.

For example, join the yes man and and 3 other main quest path are locked. Join the Brother hood of steel and there's nothing you can do with the NCR.
There's more like that.

So in order to do everything in fallout NV, you must replay the game atleast 4 times with 4 different characters.
I don't have time for this since i wish to move on to the next game earlier and if i already feel attached with my main, i don't want to recreate him again just to chose a different path.

...

As for the removal of the skill system, ask yourself. Does it make sense to become godly with skill level 100 energy weapon and shooting on sponges none stop with your automatic rifle because you have 0 skill on it? No.
In fallout 4, you can be good with all type of weapon. Perks is only there to make you become more versitile with them, but you can still use anything you like based on your gameplay preference during the moment.

The demolition skill was ridiculous as-well. So if i have no demoltion skill, grenades deals almost no damage? That was the problem. spending a few points on a few skills while leaving every other skills behind puts a hard limit on what you can do.

With the addion of thrown weapon in fallout: That's one more thing you can't do right at all if you have no melee skill.

Beside, in a fallout game, i usually raise my speechcraft, lockpick, computer and medical at 40. Why? Just to gain access to as much content as possible in my first playthrough.
I don't like to replay a game a thousounds of time just because i was unable to gain access to passage or a secret before. In fallout 4, it's not as bad.

Using nothing, but energy weapon at level 100 as my only combat skill was not fun for me, but when you play on survival difficulty, that's what you had to do.

...

In fallout 4, i can use any gun, i can throw grenades, i can use any stance(range or melee, even knuckles when ever i feel like it), i can use the super armor (I don't need no heavy armored skill for that). I can do all of that and i don't feel too limited. Perks only make those become better, but not un-usable or completely useless.
I don't like games that forces me down with too many requirement just to unlock a path. Fallout 3 and NV had plenty of those problems.

[Bozo the drunk]

Fair enough. To each his own.

Myself, I have no interest in console button mashers. I like having to think ahead about the consequences of my actions. I like being rewarded for making intelligent decisions. I like having an intricate, unpredictable plot where my decisions matter.

But, yep, I guess there's not much money in all of that...

[Arsenic_Touch]

So you pretty much described fallout 4 with the main quest line. How is that an argument?

As for the skill system, it actually gave meaning to your progression that you actually have to think about your build, something that is actually pretty integral to RPGs.

In fallout 4 it's not as bad, it's not even there, they removed all meaningful speech checks outside of the DLC and even then there aren't as many as one would hoped.

So you haven't actually argued anything positive, just things that you happen to like because you don't "have time" or you don't want to think too hard. This pretty much screams "I'm happy they dumbed down the game because I'm lazy"

[Panda-Bishop]

Originally posted by W1ne-Ton Hammer:

I don't have time for this since i wish to move on to the next game earlier and if i already feel attached with my main, i don't want to recreate him again just to chose a different path.

Yeah, well, that's you.

Me? I like to see a game with huge replayability, to be able to make several different characters and actually see the game allow them to have different stories.

We have different tastes, I don't agree with you that this change is for the better.

As for the removal of the skill system, ask yourself. Does it make sense to become godly with skill level 100 energy weapon and shooting on sponges none stop with your automatic rifle because you have 0 skill on it?

[...]

Using nothing, but energy weapon at level 100 as my only combat skill was not fun for me, but when you play on survival difficulty, that's what you had to do.

That's not an argument to completely remove skills, that's an argument to make skills more sensible and weapons more balanced, which I can get behind.

Just removing all skills is giving up on trying to make it work. Nobody likes a quitter.

I don't like games that forces me down with too many requirement just to unlock a path. Fallout 3 and NV had plenty of those problems.

What you call problems, we call features. We're complaining about features that we liked being removed, which is our right, as is your right to complain about features you liked being removed.

Nobody should ever tell you to accept something you dislike just because they like it.

[Tearfulstab]

been having fun in fallout 4, but its very limited in what kind of characters you can make that feels unique mostly because of the voice work you will always play a middle classs white guy.

worst part is the removal of the skill system, after that the fallout series just feels like skyrim, atleast before it was unique.

about the combat this is just another mediocre shooter, and cant really be compared on an rp level with the original fallout games, fallout 1+2 before they changed the series for the more shooter feel.

best thing about fallout 4 is the sandbox and graphics, i would probebly not have put 900 hours into it if not for the great mods out there

i liked fallout more back when it was a isometric rpg and not a dumbed down shooter.

[W1ne-Ton Hammer]

Originally posted by Tearfulstab:

i liked fallout more back when it was a isometric rpg and not a dumbed down shooter.

Do you play on survival?

[W1ne-Ton Hammer]

Originally posted by Bozo the drunk:

Fair enough. To each his own.

Myself, I have no interest in console button mashers. I like having to think ahead about the consequences of my actions. I like being rewarded for making intelligent decisions. I like having an intricate, unpredictable plot where my decisions matter.

But, yep, I guess there's not much money in all of that...

Fallout 3 and NV are more like button masher than fallout 4 for several reasons.
You think because it has more RPG elements that it must be less of a button masher. That don't make any sense.

In fallout 3/NV, melee combat and gun fights are nothing, but button mashers. You don't really need a brain to be good.

In fallout 4, the melee system is like Chivalry which is far from a button masher. You don't just toss grenades because you are a pro demolition man, you toss grenade because you actually need them which is an other point to say that it's not a button masher.
When you play on survival, constantly using med kits will make you become thirsty, hungry, tired or desease added which mean, you can't button mash med kits on survival

You can have your opinion on skill removal and all that, but there's a difference between having opinions and being wrong. You are being wrong for calling FO4 a button masher.
Of course, if you play on easy, any game can feel that way.

[W1ne-Ton Hammer]

As to not respond for everyone else on an other note, i remember most ppl complained about Fallout NV because you had too many path to chose. Chosing a path locks you away from 80% of the whole game. That's what most ppl complained about. So based on that, when they made fallout 4, they wanted to fix that.

I guess Bethesda can't please everyone, but the funny part is, the last person i've seen reviewing fallout 4 said one thing: Going back to New vegas. How many hours he has on Fallout 4: 300+ too lol.

So again, Bethesda can't only please everyone, but at the same time, who the hell replays fallout NV 4+ times just to do every quests possible? Not everyone that's for sure.
Plus fallout is not the only game, i play dark souls too. I don't have to play dark souls twice and i'm not complaining: i just have to wait for the next installement.

[TwinChops]

I liked NV more then 4, the lack of RPG in 4 is to much. Cant ask about backgrounds and stuff (thats mostly a problem of the Voiced Actor, and Money).
Then the Removal of the Skill System, why the hell did they take out the RPG of an RPG?

Story Wise, NV with its DLC wins too. MAYBE Nuka WOrld will change this, but i guess not.
I mean come on, the first 10 min in Owb are so freaking funny. The rest ofc too!

And what i dont get is, why you say i need to play 4 one time, and NV 4 times for all endings.
Did you really play F4? As i recall you can choose ONE of Four endings. But OK ....

[W1ne-Ton Hammer]

Originally posted by Metylan:

I liked NV more then 4, the lack of RPG in 4 is to much. Cant ask about backgrounds and stuff (thats mostly a problem of the Voiced Actor, and Money).
Then the Removal of the Skill System, why the hell did they take out the RPG of an RPG?

Story Wise, NV with its DLC wins too. MAYBE Nuka WOrld will change this, but i guess not.
I mean come on, the first 10 min in Owb are so freaking funny. The rest ofc too!

And what i dont get is, why you say i need to play 4 one time, and NV 4 times for all endings.
Did you really play F4? As i recall you can choose ONE of Four endings. But OK ....

I never said all endings, i said that you get locked away from too many stuff to do. There's a difference.

In FO4, if you join the yes man, you get locked away from 80% of the game from the get go: after barely 3 hours or so.

Ending is not gameplay anyway so that's never a problem. Being locked away from 80% of the journey is a problem in a video game.

[Happygamer]

In Fallout NV you can change your commitment to the various factions at several points in the game.

[omegazeda]

Originally posted by W1ne-Ton Hammer:

Originally posted by Tearfulstab:

i liked fallout more back when it was a isometric rpg and not a dumbed down shooter.

Do you play on survival?

LOL for my lvl 120 character survival is cakewalk!

[W1ne-Ton Hammer]

Originally posted by omegazeda:

Originally posted by W1ne-Ton Hammer:

Do you play on survival?

LOL for my lvl 120 character survival is cakewalk!

I'd go and pick this collection of hardcore survival mod then. I once tried to play with all of them, but even that was too hard for me so i had to give up.

[Tyrant]

Originally posted by W1ne-Ton Hammer:

This is what i got to say.

In fallout: NV you have multiple choices, but everytime you pick an option, 80% of the game content is locked.

For example, join the yes man and and 3 other main quest path are locked. Join the Brother hood of steel and there's nothing you can do with the NCR.
There's more like that.

So in order to do everything in fallout NV, you must replay the game atleast 4 times with 4 different characters.
I don't have time for this since i wish to move on to the next game earlier and if i already feel attached with my main, i don't want to recreate him again just to chose a different path.

it about consequences
if i choose this i loose that, its something that adds to the replayability

lategame in FO4 it does force you to select paths.

and force you to replay the entire game? umm no ever heard of branching saves?
then again i suppose you dont know of the console command to make named saves.
once you find yourself at a situation where you have to go one way or the other you can create a custom save and then reload it later and go the other direction if you wanted to.

[W1ne-Ton Hammer]

Originally posted by Tyrant:

Originally posted by W1ne-Ton Hammer:

This is what i got to say.

In fallout: NV you have multiple choices, but everytime you pick an option, 80% of the game content is locked.

For example, join the yes man and and 3 other main quest path are locked. Join the Brother hood of steel and there's nothing you can do with the NCR.
There's more like that.

So in order to do everything in fallout NV, you must replay the game atleast 4 times with 4 different characters.
I don't have time for this since i wish to move on to the next game earlier and if i already feel attached with my main, i don't want to recreate him again just to chose a different path.

it about consequences
if i choose this i loose that, its something that adds to the replayability

lategame in FO4 it does force you to select paths.

and force you to replay the entire game? umm no ever heard of branching saves?
then again i suppose you dont know of the console command to make named saves.
once you find yourself at a situation where you have to go one way or the other you can create a custom save and then reload it later and go the other direction if you wanted to.

The perk system follows the same logic. You can't take every perks so you must chose in what you wish to be good. IT does not mean you will deal 1 damage with a hand gun just because you have 0 perks related to that action.

In my opinion, being forced to replay the game just to use everything i want is a flaw.
So in FO 4, i can be minimally good at everything, but way better at a few things based on my perks.

[Doc Clarke]

You are quite right - pick one path and another s locked - that's called "a conseqence" it's one of the axioms of a good RPG.
It's why I replay the games so often.

I thought everyone knew that?