Why do people think Horizons is good?

[Sarnen]

I don't know why people think a mod that leaves you starving, thirsty, and sick at lvl 1 is a good mod. This is like survival mode but with severe autism. I heard it was more immersive, and recommended, but this isn't enhancing my experience or making me feel like a survivalist - its just ruining my game with frustrating ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥, scrambling to play whack a mole to deal with such crippling debuffs instead of doing fun things like shooting bad guys. I liked the idea of rebalancing the whole game and the vanilla survival (because it isn't THIS annoying), but I don't get why people gush over Horizons.

[Yhwach]

I'd have to agree with you there as I'm not the biggest fan, or a fan of Horizon as It's very flawed and brings more tedium to the table compared to regular o'l Survival.
I'll never use it because it just makes the game more unrealistic, unnecessarily hard and detracts from any fun..but hey, people are into that and It's optional.

[Sarnen]

Yeah think I'm going to just uninstall, don't get the hype at all

[big stupid jellyfish]

I mean... what did you expect? All the changes are described right there on the mod page. Survival mode is all about resource managment, Horizon even more so. If you don't enjoy that aspect and just want to 'shoot bad guys' as you put it, it just isn't the right mod for you.

[Hobo Misanthropus]

"Survival mode, but with Severe Autism"

lol'd heartily. You are already one of my favorite people on steam.



I'm a pretty strong critic of mods in general. People treat mods as a monolith, like *poof* mods and suddenly the game is better. But the overwhelming majority of mods are utter garbage. A smaller majority is Memes, and a tiny sliver of mods are specified to such narrow tastes, that you get people borderline evengelicizing over them (Horizons for example)

Frankly, in my thousands of hours messing with mods from Morrowind to Fallout 4 (much less Fallout 4) I've yet to find a single mod that didn't feel like some vanity project. With how easy it is to implement ♥♥♥♥ into Bethesda's games, the mod talent isn't making content, it's making content that actually integrates into the existing package.


That's not to say I don't like Modding the idea, people should be able to ♥♥♥♥ with their game however they want. Just all the lunatics stating it "Makes da gaym betr" are silly. It makes your experience better, it often demonstrably makes the game worse as a whole.

[Jessica.Tea]

I equally love and hate parts of Horizon. . .

If i could just have the rehashed junk/crafting, cooking overhaul and weapon component bits that would be a perfect personalised mod just for me

The survival difficulty aspect although can be hard/extreme is ok but not perfect, i can live with the realism of being constantly hungry or diseased but if there was an option to remove then wouild be nice
Its not perfect but it does way more than other overhaul mods

[nobody willsee this video right?]

Originally posted by Hobo Misanthropus:

"Survival mode, but with Severe Autism"

lol'd heartily. You are already one of my favorite people on steam.



I'm a pretty strong critic of mods in general. People treat mods as a monolith, like *poof* mods and suddenly the game is better. But the overwhelming majority of mods are utter garbage. A smaller majority is Memes, and a tiny sliver of mods are specified to such narrow tastes, that you get people borderline evengelicizing over them (Horizons for example)

Frankly, in my thousands of hours messing with mods from Morrowind to Fallout 4 (much less Fallout 4) I've yet to find a single mod that didn't feel like some vanity project. With how easy it is to implement ♥♥♥♥ into Bethesda's games, the mod talent isn't making content, it's making content that actually integrates into the existing package.


That's not to say I don't like Modding the idea, people should be able to ♥♥♥♥ with their game however they want. Just all the lunatics stating it "Makes da gaym betr" are silly. It makes your experience better, it often demonstrably makes the game worse as a whole.

your point about mods is pretty true, and i like some of them.
however [always with the pesky however] many of them are copies of other mods, posible total theft of code, and then i don't really see the need of them.
some of them i download and install out of curiosity knowing that i don't want THAT in my game, but i want to see what it's liike.
some of the OP weapons are rather cute, one shot the boss monster with a 10mm pistol.
yea that was cute, but even though i want to feel heroic, i didn't want to to be THAT easy.

i like the weaponized christmass tree.
if my character is using it, it's in the way and i can't see it.
but if i give to my companion to use it's really funny to watch.

i like sim settlements because i like the building games like space engineers and city skylines.

the heather companion mod is a good one.

there are more that i like but i wont list 144 of them here.

for me they make the game a bit different, and i've read the description of horizons and decided not to install it.

but there are other major overhaul mods that have my attention.

over all the mod idea is good, and even people making mods i wont use is a good thing because it just might be the motivating facter for themselves or someone else to write a mod that i actaully do want.

maybe i'll dust off my old programming hat and try my hand at it. . . .. . nah.

[Sarnen]

I have plenty of mods I enjoy just fine, but horizon took away fun, not added to it. It made gameplay far more tedious and annoying, rather than fun and engaging. As a low level character especially it was ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ godawful

[Warm Fuzzies™]

Originally posted by Hobo Misanthropus:

"Survival mode, but with Severe Autism"

lol'd heartily. You are already one of my favorite people on steam.



I'm a pretty strong critic of mods in general. People treat mods as a monolith, like *poof* mods and suddenly the game is better. But the overwhelming majority of mods are utter garbage. A smaller majority is Memes, and a tiny sliver of mods are specified to such narrow tastes, that you get people borderline evengelicizing over them (Horizons for example)

Frankly, in my thousands of hours messing with mods from Morrowind to Fallout 4 (much less Fallout 4) I've yet to find a single mod that didn't feel like some vanity project. With how easy it is to implement ♥♥♥♥ into Bethesda's games, the mod talent isn't making content, it's making content that actually integrates into the existing package.


That's not to say I don't like Modding the idea, people should be able to ♥♥♥♥ with their game however they want. Just all the lunatics stating it "Makes da gaym betr" are silly. It makes your experience better, it often demonstrably makes the game worse as a whole.

Personally, Im of the mind that opinions on mods (not modding but mods themselves) should always be kept to one's self.

At no point should people be saying that mods are this or that. Such opinions are 100% subjective and biased.

Granted, there are a select few that the overall community generally agree that "make the game better", but never are those mods "evengelicized".


As for myself, the only mod I would ever spread the word about, is Cadillac Jack's Radio Shack, but only because I love the music, and having more music to listen to in the game is never bad.

Not to mention George Mckelvey's "My Radiation Baby" is one of the best songs ever to hear while exploring the wastes. Well....at least I think it is lol.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RJUYlzgQwU

[Tyrant]

Horizon is ver very VERY niche and largely incompatable with other mods.
ive been able to reach the same kind of gameplay using Rebalancer and Loot overhaul.

as for mods that make the game better, well as said above already there are only a select few.
Sim settlements kinda does deserve special attention as it helps alot with creating living settlements and now with the latest expansion even whole towns with little input from the player.
and it still allows one to build their own if they want.

but when it comes to guns/armor/cloths/makeup/tatoos/tits/nude/ponies etc etc its down to the player preference.
but there is one goofy mod that i cant be without and it generally gives the Minutemen a better feel.
https://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/8614

''It just works''

[Vinnie Mack]

it is hardcore for those that want a challenge but don't want to go to the Frost extreme. Once you get the knack of the mod, Horizon can be quite immersive. I have the mod for one of my playthroughs. But, like you, i find the mod to be a bit too irritating for my daily run.

[driveby]

I'm still going to give the mod a solid try; but all the additional levels of complexity tacked on to crafting, settlements, & even health management are more than a little irksome.

The food / water situation is pretty ridiculous. I might have to re-activate the mod to lower the timescale to try to deal with it. Personally; I've fasted for 7 days while exercising. The last couple days got a little unpleasant, but I was pushing myself.

The LoneSurvivor under Horizon that, lets face it, looks like he could ♥♥♥♥ his way through a decathalon: needed to consume 5.5lbs of Pork'n"Beans on his first day after waking up just to stop having "debilitating hunger."

Bodyfat exists for a reason and the idea that this post-apocalyptic scarcity mod is based on a 3-meals-a-day model is pretty retarded.

(oh. the timescale option shift actually increases hunger scaling. jesus christ)

[Cherenkov]

I'm currently about to uninstall Horizon.

I was looking for a bit more of a challenge than Fallout's regular difficulties and I was looking forward to the revamped systems for crafting and all the new included ♥♥♥♥, but the mod is absolutely relentless and unforgiving even from level 1.

There's no consistency either, I've now started about 6/7 different playthroughs, and they've all been completely different in how much they ♥♥♥♥ me over at the start. There's no consistency to enemy spawns early on, which is absolutely stupid and can leave you diseased, crippled and ammoless as soon as Red Rocket if you're just unlucky.

Yes, there are some item spawns that are hand-placed but as I said, enemy spawns can and will ♥♥♥♥ you over randomly. You can have the unfortunate time of having rabid mole rats spawn in the Red Rocket Shop and one nibble from them will leave you poisoned; or you can not, and have regular mole rats spawn instead, in which case you're good to go.

I suppose it's my fault for choosing Desolation Mode, but I guess my bottom line is this: It's ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ stupid to try and play through the default content and progress in the questline, explore and just play the game as it was supposed to be played (as an FPS/RPG) when this mod basically turns it into the most hardcore of survival games. What is even the point of including the settlements overhaul mod when you can barely scrounge enough supplies to keep yourself going?

I haven't played it yet, but I honestly think FROST is a much better mod and concept; the developers for that mod went into it with the idea that it wasn't going to be about playing the default game with the survival aspect heavily emphasized. They did away with the story, npcs, etc. and completely overhauled the goal of the game, basically turning it into a different one, at least from an experience perspective. This makes a lot of sense. You're basically just using the Fallout world and engine to play a survival game at that point. Horizon, on the other hand, literally says it in its description that it was made for people to do an entire regular Fallout playthrough of all content with it. I don't know who would want to do that, honestly. If you're looking for a survival experience in the Fallout universe, that's completely fine; so am I. But that's exactly why I think FROST is infinitely better in what it does.

But yeah, /rant over. Finally uninstalling after constantly starting new Horizon playthroughs because I kept getting ♥♥♥♥♥♥ beyond any potential enjoyment of the game in the most random and RNG-based ways imaginable. Also, losing progress to the game constantly pulling CTDs on me when reloading Exitsaves (do yourself a favor, and if you play with Horizon, don't exit to main menu and then reload the Exitsave. If you have the same issues that I guess I have, it'll CTD during loadingscreen and delete your exitsave anyway. Quit to desktop instead.)

I'm going to just do a normal playthrough of regular Fallout to finally experience the game's story and content, and then move on to Frost for that survival experience.

[big stupid jellyfish]

Originally posted by Dawn:

I'm going to just do a normal playthrough of regular Fallout to finally experience the game's story and content, and then move on to Frost for that survival experience.

Wait, you installed Horizon for your first playthrough attempts and you used Desolation mode on top of that? Why on earth would you do something like that? Of course you are going to have a bad time.You should never install a complete overhaul mod until you have a good understanding of the vanilla game. That goes for every game, not just F4. Some of the problems you described aren't even related to Horizon.
Afaik Horizon does not add any additional spawns to the vanilla game, all enemy encounters are the same as vanilla. The only exception to that would be the new dynamic encounter system which sends groups of enemies after you if you kill a sufficient number of enemies of that type. That system only really kicks in after the mid-game though.

Idk why you would praise FROST here without having played it, but judging from your complaints here i doubt you would enjoy it very much.If you can't deal with the status effects in Horizon, FROST is going to ♥♥♥♥ you over 10 times worse.
Horizon gives you the necessary tools to deal with pretty much anything the game can throw at you very early on, provided you have a good understanding of the vanilla game and read the documentation on the mod page, of course.

A FROST playthrough can be ended by an unlucky rng roll every time you eat, sleep, or get hit by some creature. You don't have the resources to heal limbs, cure diseases or keep your sanity up early on. Oh, and there are mines everywhere and their timers are way less forgiving than the ones in vanilla/Horizon.
It's a fun experience if you enjoy rogue-likes (no reloading, restart A LOT), but your apparent dislike of rng makes me think it's not for you.

As for your CTD problems: What mod manager are you using? Is Horizon the only mod you have installed? If not, how does your load order look? I'm asking because my current setup includes Horizon and over 150 other mods and i haven't had a crash in over 70 hours, You really shouldn't be having that many problems.

[Honor]

Originally posted by Sarnen:

I don't know why people think a mod that leaves you starving, thirsty, and sick at lvl 1 is a good mod. This is like survival mode but with severe autism. I heard it was more immersive, and recommended, but this isn't enhancing my experience or making me feel like a survivalist - its just ruining my game with frustrating ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥t, scrambling to play whack a mole to deal with such crippling debuffs instead of doing fun things like shooting bad guys. I liked the idea of rebalancing the whole game and the vanilla survival (because it isn't THIS annoying), but I don't get why people gush over Horizons.

Just don't play on Survival difficulty until you set yourself up resource-wise. Problem solved.

[Sarnen]

Originally posted by Warm Fuzzies™:

Originally posted by Hobo Misanthropus:

"Survival mode, but with Severe Autism"

lol'd heartily. You are already one of my favorite people on steam.



I'm a pretty strong critic of mods in general. People treat mods as a monolith, like *poof* mods and suddenly the game is better. But the overwhelming majority of mods are utter garbage. A smaller majority is Memes, and a tiny sliver of mods are specified to such narrow tastes, that you get people borderline evengelicizing over them (Horizons for example)

Frankly, in my thousands of hours messing with mods from Morrowind to Fallout 4 (much less Fallout 4) I've yet to find a single mod that didn't feel like some vanity project. With how easy it is to implement ♥♥♥♥ into Bethesda's games, the mod talent isn't making content, it's making content that actually integrates into the existing package.


That's not to say I don't like Modding the idea, people should be able to ♥♥♥♥ with their game however they want. Just all the lunatics stating it "Makes da gaym betr" are silly. It makes your experience better, it often demonstrably makes the game worse as a whole.

Personally, Im of the mind that opinions on mods (not modding but mods themselves) should always be kept to one's self.

At no point should people be saying that mods are this or that. Such opinions are 100% subjective and biased.

Granted, there are a select few that the overall community generally agree that "make the game better", but never are those mods "evengelicized".


As for myself, the only mod I would ever spread the word about, is Cadillac Jack's Radio Shack, but only because I love the music, and having more music to listen to in the game is never bad.

Not to mention George Mckelvey's "My Radiation Baby" is one of the best songs ever to hear while exploring the wastes. Well....at least I think it is lol.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RJUYlzgQwU

apparently someone necro'd my thread. Anyway, opinions on mods are entirely valid, because that's how people can get a general approximation of the fun factor, just like.. literally any other review. If a game has a metacritic rating of 20% (out of 100%), sure I may enjoy it but there's probably a reason its reviews are that low. Reviews are not the final verdict, but they are absolutely useful as both feedback to mod creators and warnings/incentives to mod users.