The Current Problems With Creation Club Explained

[RCBlazer]

There's been a lot of back and forth arguing on this subject on the forums, but so far there's no complete list of the problems people are having with Creation Club itself. As one of the people against it in its current state, I feel I should explain what I personally feel is wrong with it and why I feel this way. Know that this comes from a person who has donated to modders before and still enjoys playing unmodded Skyrim on the XBOX 360 and a modded version of Fallout 3 on Steam from time to time.

To start, let's look at what Bethesda itself claims Creation Club is on it's own website, https://creationclub.bethesda.net/en:

Creation Club is a collection of all-new content for both Fallout 4 and Skyrim. It features new items, abilities, and gameplay created by Bethesda Games Studios and outside development partners including the best community creators. Creation Club content is fully curated and compatible with the main game and official add-ons.

According to Bethesda themselves, Creation Club will feature new items, new abilities, and new gameplay. In its current state, Creation Club only does one of those three, the new items. I can't exactly vouch for the quality of the new abilities or gameplay available in Creation Club, as there currently aren't any. To me, this feels like Bethesda shooting themselves in the foot coming right out the door by releasing an unfinished version of the Creation Club at best. After the backlash they received from Skyrim Paid Mods, you would think they would have wanted to avoid a similar backlash with the release of Creation Club, but it feels like they didn't even try to avoid it. Considering the state Fallout 4 was in when it first released (don't pretend to not have encountered bugs and glitches in a Bethesda game, we've all seen them), this makes the Creation Club, which is a Cash Shop, feel rushed out to make a profit, and many others agree.

Bethesda claims Creation Club is fully compatible with the main game and official add-ons, but I'm not sure that's true. I've seen various people on Reddit, the Steam forums, and Bethesda's official Creation Club forum make claims that some of the Creation Club items don't work properly. To their credit, Bethesda has been making constant updates to fix those issues. Unfortunately, this also brings me to my next point.

There can not be any denial that people have had issues with Fallout 4 Script Extender (or F4SE), a tool that helps make many of the mods that are free to download on Nexus ever since Creation Club was released. F4SE has recently updated itself to prevent further updates from Bethesda that do nothing but add new items or fix issues with Creation Club items to avoid further issues. Do I believe Bethesda intended for Creation Club to have this adverse effect on the primary free modding tool? No I don't, but when you think about it, that's actually worse than if malicious intent was the plan.

Bethesda didn't think through what would happen if constant updates were being made that only added new items or fixes issues with said items on Creation Club. These updates are to add items (and possibly new abilities and/or new gameplay, when and if that happens) and fix issues with Creation Club, which is a cash shop in a $30 game where people can still find duplication and XP glitches in the unmodded, most up to date version.

I would be more than happy to see Bethesda make changes to Creation Club that prove to me and everyone else who feels the way I do that it isn't just another cynical Cash Shop in a game that you still have to pay up front just to play. We've already got to deal with Ubisoft, Activision, EA, and WB Games trying to pull those tricks on us. Don't fall down that same dark path Bethesda, because it will cost you a lot of your fans.

[Flippy]

Your only point that has merit is the last one where you hope Fallout 4 and future games dont turn to miscortransactions as a cheap tactic to put it simply.

Fallout 4 has already shown they have a different view concerning mods, content even the game itself built to be modded. They have shown their support for modding, Nexusmods, Bethesda.net, the Creation Kit, Fallout Shelter clearly.

This has made Fallout 4 a fortune. Where as the competition trying to stamp out modding, not offering the editor and such things has proved to be less successfull.

Do the math.

Again, F4SE relies on version number and that is why it is crashing from my understanding. Something to be taken up with them.

[RCBlazer]

Originally posted by Flippy:

Your only point that has merit is the last one where you hope Fallout 4 and future games dont turn to miscortransactions as a cheap tactic to put it simply.

Fallout 4 has already shown they have a different view concerning mods, content even the game itself built to be modded. They have shown their support for modding, Nexusmods, Bethesda.net, the Creation Kit, Fallout Shelter clearly.

This has made Fallout 4 a fortune. Where as the competition trying to stamp out modding, not offering the editor and such things has proved to be less successfull.

Do the math.

Again, F4SE relies on version number and that is why it is crashing from my understanding. Something to be taken up with them.

As I said, even in the most up to date version of Fallout 4 with no mods or Creation Club items purchased, there are still duplication and XP glitches that still work.

[Flippy]

Originally posted by RCBlazer:

Originally posted by Flippy:

Your only point that has merit is the last one where you hope Fallout 4 and future games dont turn to miscortransactions as a cheap tactic to put it simply.

Fallout 4 has already shown they have a different view concerning mods, content even the game itself built to be modded. They have shown their support for modding, Nexusmods, Bethesda.net, the Creation Kit, Fallout Shelter clearly.

This has made Fallout 4 a fortune. Where as the competition trying to stamp out modding, not offering the editor and such things has proved to be less successfull.

Do the math.

Again, F4SE relies on version number and that is why it is crashing from my understanding. Something to be taken up with them.

As I said, even in the most up to date version of Fallout 4 with no mods or Creation Club items purchased, there are still duplication and XP glitches that still work.

Yep. I do really have complaints about some bugs stll in game, water breathing and rad immunity for 1 skill point, Nuka World being bad guy only. Different subject though.

[RCBlazer]

Originally posted by Flippy:

Originally posted by RCBlazer:

As I said, even in the most up to date version of Fallout 4 with no mods or Creation Club items purchased, there are still duplication and XP glitches that still work.

Yep. I do really have complaints about some bugs stll in game, water breathing and rad immunity for 1 skill point, Nuka World being bad guy only. Different subject though.

My point is that these glitches still work and have not been patched, yet we have seen updates that fix issues with Creation Club items. Maybe I'm still reeling from what happened with Assassin's Creed Unity, where they released a patch that only fixed problems with the ingame Cash Shop before fixing the glitches where you can fall through the floor into the void below.

[Flippy]

Originally posted by RCBlazer:

Originally posted by Flippy:

Yep. I do really have complaints about some bugs stll in game, water breathing and rad immunity for 1 skill point, Nuka World being bad guy only. Different subject though.

My point is that these glitches still work and have not been patched, yet we have seen updates that fix issues with Creation Club items. Maybe I'm still reeling from what happened with Assassin's Creed Unity, where they released a patch that only fixed problems with the ingame Cash Shop before fixing the glitches where you can fall through the floor into the void below.

Dude if there was as much attention given to some of these things as has been given to the CC it would be great.

This would not be the first time i have noticed the irony of so much attention being put on something with no in game effect at all, meanwhile in game issues are ignored on the games forum. :)

[RCBlazer]

Originally posted by OBEY:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but your position is this one:

1) I want high quality content
2) automatron-sized at a bare minimum
3) For free
4) Implemented exactly the way I personally want it to be implemented.
5) Without day 1 bugs
6) is optional
7) doesn't take more than 1GB of space on my SSD
8) doesn't make my unofficial mods require an update
9) be called the way I want to be called (in a self-derogatory, shoot-yourself-in-the-foot fashion that is sure to create an outrage, like calling it "paid mods")

Am I understanding this correctly?

This is your reasonable list of demands, and until they are met, Bethesda is a greedy, evil company that thinks their costumers are fools and should be boycotted?

I did not say any of that. I am a large fan of Bethesda's games. (I still play unmodded Skyrim on the 360 and play modded Fallout 3 on Steam) What I said is that I want to see Bethesda do better, because I know they can. The Creation Club could add new gameplay and abilities as they claim it will on their own official page for it, and I would praise them for it.

[MortVent]

Originally posted by RCBlazer:

Originally posted by Flippy:

Yep. I do really have complaints about some bugs stll in game, water breathing and rad immunity for 1 skill point, Nuka World being bad guy only. Different subject though.

My point is that these glitches still work and have not been patched, yet we have seen updates that fix issues with Creation Club items. Maybe I'm still reeling from what happened with Assassin's Creed Unity, where they released a patch that only fixed problems with the ingame Cash Shop before fixing the glitches where you can fall through the floor into the void below.

Dude Zork had bugs, most games have bugs.

Even Pong had them..

[Flippy]

Originally posted by MortVent:

Originally posted by RCBlazer:

My point is that these glitches still work and have not been patched, yet we have seen updates that fix issues with Creation Club items. Maybe I'm still reeling from what happened with Assassin's Creed Unity, where they released a patch that only fixed problems with the ingame Cash Shop before fixing the glitches where you can fall through the floor into the void below.

Dude Zork had bugs, most games have bugs.

Even Pong had them..

I am constantly amazed how everything in Fallout 4 works so well. Really.

There are a couple bugs like whats her name from Vault 108 or what ever not going to the settlement when she says she is that could be fixed though.

[RCBlazer]

Originally posted by MortVent:

Originally posted by RCBlazer:

My point is that these glitches still work and have not been patched, yet we have seen updates that fix issues with Creation Club items. Maybe I'm still reeling from what happened with Assassin's Creed Unity, where they released a patch that only fixed problems with the ingame Cash Shop before fixing the glitches where you can fall through the floor into the void below.

Dude Zork had bugs, most games have bugs.

Even Pong had them..

I understand this, but not all bugs and glitches are equal. I can look past a graphical bug where a character model gets frozen in the T pose temporarily, but when it can affect or even break the gameplay, it becomes a problem.

[Lord Poshname Von Plumbingparts]

Do I detect sarcasm Flippy?

[cults]

Let's say you're right, and it's a cynical cash grab.

And? If you like the game and the company, you understand they need profits to make more content, right?

You come in with the idea that it's a cynical cash grab, and anytime we tell you it isn't and refute your "explanations" for why it is, you just move the goalpost.

You've yet to name any valid reason why CC is a cynical cashgrab, you just assume it is first, come up with excuses second.

Again, nexusmods.com, go there if you want free mod, this isn't what this is intended to be.

Yes, it's not complete, so? Even if they don't reach the objective they set out to reach, how is that a valid reason to hate Beth/CC? You're not entitled to anything they promise, you haven't paid for anything you didn't want to pay for.

Are you new to gaming? Have you not heard of lootboxes, skin gambling, vaporwave crowdfunding? You think THIS is a cynical cashgrab? How melodramatic. What a "fan" you are to accuse a company you're a fan of of taking that route, when their entire business model is the complete opposite and has been so for their entire 10+ year long life.

You have literally no reason to jump to any of the conclusions you've jumped to, all of this is fear mongering and slippery slope fallacies. What kind of fan is so afraid of a company turning on them without any evidence?

These days, it seems CC is causing people to have erectile dynsfunction and causing global warming. Everybody that is anti-CC is losing their mind like liberals on nov. 8th, 2016. This unreasonable panic is honestly tiresome.

We already know the why of the CC. If you don't know it by now, you're willfully ignorant and you're here to find dirt on Bethesda, not find the truth.

Bethesda is your new russian collusion conspiracy: you must investigate because you know it's true. Evidence? W-well, it-it's everywhere you... you.... DRUMPFK- I mean BETHESDRONE!

Come on now.

Edit:

Don't fall down that same dark path Bethesda, because it will cost you a lot of your fans.

I mean, look at this. All your arguments are based on fear. You admit Bethesda hasn't done any of that, and yet, this is still a machiavellian plot to end you, somehow? But you're not biased against Beth, no!

[RCBlazer]

Originally posted by OBEY:

Let's say you're right, and it's a cynical cash grab.

And? If you like the game and the company, you understand they need profits to make more content, right?

You come in with the idea that it's a cynical cash grab, and anytime we tell you it isn't and refute your "explanations" for why it is, you just move the goalpost.

You've yet to name any valid reason why CC is a cynical cashgrab, you just assume it is first, come up with excuses second.

Again, nexusmods.com, go there if you want free mod, this isn't what this is intended to be.

Yes, it's not complete, so? Even if they don't reach the objective they set out to reach, how is that a valid reason to hate Beth/CC? You're not entitled to anything they promise, you haven't paid for anything you didn't want to pay for.

Are you new to gaming? Have you not heard of lootboxes, skin gambling, vapowave crowdfunding? You think THIS is a cynical cashgrab? How melodramatic. What a "fan" you are to accuse a company you're a fan of of taking that route, when their entire business model is the complete opposite and has been so for their entire 10+ year long life.

You have literally no reason to jump to any of the conclusions you've jumped to, all of this is fear mongering and slippery slope fallacies. What kind of fan is so afraid of a company turning on them without any evidence?

These days, it seems CC is causing people to have erectile dynsfunction and causing global warming. Everybody that is anti-CC is losing their mind like liberals on nov. 8th, 2016. This unreasonable panic is honestly tiresome.

We already know the why of the CC. If you don't know it by now, you're willfully ignorant and you're here to find dirt on Bethesda, not find the truth.

Bethesda is your new russian collusion conspiracy: you must investigate because you know it's true. Evidence? W-well, it-it's everywhere you... you.... DRUMPFK- I mean BETHESDRONE!

Come on now.

Once again, you assume I'm just turning against Bethesda, saying "Oh they only want my money, so screw them!" but I'm not. I want to see the Creation Club get better. I don't want to see it fail, or to have the negative backlash it has.

[cults]

None of what you said are "problems" with CC.

There are no objective problems with CC.

They're problems with the quality of the content inside of it, etc. so on. But not the feature itself. - AKA whining.

[Nick Naughty]

Bethesda split the modding community during the paid mods trial of skyrim.

After discussion with Valve, and listening to our community, paid mods are being removed from Steam Workshop. Even though we had the best intentions, the feedback has been clear – this is not a feature you want. Your support means everything to us, and we hear you.

With players demanding for more official content, Bethesda decides to put paid mods back in action.

Its like no, they are two different things, the community said no to paid mods, but we still want more official content.

[cults]

Originally posted by Nick Naughty:

Bethesda split the modding community during the paid mods trial of skyrim.

After discussion with Valve, and listening to our community, paid mods are being removed from Steam Workshop. Even though we had the best intentions, the feedback has been clear – this is not a feature you want. Your support means everything to us, and we hear you.

With players demanding for more official content, Bethesda decides to put paid mods back in action.

Its like no, they are two different things, the community said no to paid mods, but we still want more official content.

Yes, you want freebies, automatron-sized freebies.

You're entitled.

They give you what you want all the time, and it's never good enough for you.