I hope for a more linear progression in DS3

[☧ Voievod]

And not like DS 2 where you didn't know where to go next.

[FEZ. TF7]

引用自 Master Thief：

Im just hoping for a better game design than DS 2 where after the Forest of Fallen giants you get transported to the Lost Bastille (which is a higher level zone). That's just bad. More linearity would do the game better and actually atract new players.

I don't think the area's are levelled but enemies scale with your level so area's would get progressively tougher because as you level so does the enemies, i'm currently doing a SL1 playthrough and finished most of the game(DS2:SotFS) as SL1 and there is no difference in terms of difficulty between the 1st area's to the last

[Erebus]

引用自 Empress Misery：

引用自 guering：

Here is all the areas/bosses you have to complete in order:

Things Betwixt>Majula>FOTFG>Lost Bastille/Lost Sinner>Gutter>Black Gulch/The Rotton>Shaded Woods>Tseldora/Freja>Huntmans Copse/Skelton Lords>Harvest Valley>Iron Keep/Old Iron King>Dangleic Castle/Mirror Knight and Twin Dragonriders>Shrine of Amana/Demon of Song>Catacombs/Velstadt>Aldia's Keep/Guardian Dragon>Dragon Memories>Back to Drangleic Castle to kill Watcher and Defender/Nashandra/Aldia.

DS1 had a few interconnected areas but the game was almost entirely fixed in how you played it, you had to ring both bells, you had to fight all 4 Lords. Other than how you got into Blightown and arrived in the parish and two small optional areas there really wasn't any choice at all, everything else was a forced list of tasks.

Even from your list you don't ever have to fight the Lost Sinner, or the Rotten, or Freja or the old Iron King or Aldia if you don't want and it had many more optional areas and bosses.

DS1 would have been better with those kind of options. Not having to go through several of the dull post Anor Londo levels would be great. :p

The actual maps themselves are less linear in DS1. There is only ever one path through a map in DS2 and it is impossible to get lost.

Even the "big" areas like Iron Keep or the poison windmill area which the name of slips my mind are exact paths from point A to point B for the most part. Compare that to the Depths, Blighttown, or the area before Pinwheel and you will see a huge difference. DS1 has shortcuts, paths that have nothing to do with the end-goal (boss), and multiple connections between maps that provide alternate ways through the world.

[Empress Misery]

引用自 Erebus：

The actual maps themselves are less linear in DS1. There is only ever one path through a map in DS2 and it is impossible to get lost.

Even the "big" areas like Iron Keep or the poison windmill area which the name of slips my mind are exact paths from point A to point B for the most part. Compare that to the Depths, Blighttown, or the area before Pinwheel and you will see a huge difference. DS1 has shortcuts, paths that have nothing to do with the end-goal (boss), and multiple connections between maps that provide alternate ways through the world.

The Depths is completely linear other than you could skip a chunk of it to end up futher along the path and one optional area, the'res only one entrance and one exit (exactly the same as the Lost Bastile, but that has more than one entrance and more than one exit and a few more optional areas). Blight town only has one real route the long way compared to The Gutter which has at least 3.

But you miss the point, the game design was entirely linear in DS1. You HAD to do all the Lord battles and HAD to ring both the bells, the slightly different paths didn't matter as you had no choices in doing the tasks. DS2 gives you options in which tasks to do or not do and has far more optional areas and bosses.

There was 32 optional bosses in DS2, and 7 (or 12 with the key and covern) in DS1.

[Erebus]

引用自 Empress Misery：

引用自 Erebus：

The actual maps themselves are less linear in DS1. There is only ever one path through a map in DS2 and it is impossible to get lost.

Even the "big" areas like Iron Keep or the poison windmill area which the name of slips my mind are exact paths from point A to point B for the most part. Compare that to the Depths, Blighttown, or the area before Pinwheel and you will see a huge difference. DS1 has shortcuts, paths that have nothing to do with the end-goal (boss), and multiple connections between maps that provide alternate ways through the world.

The Depths is completely linear other than you could skip a chunk of it to end up futher along the path and one optional area, the'res only one entrance and one exit (exactly the same as the Lost Bastile, but that has more than one entrance and more than one exit and a few more optional areas). Blight town only has one real route the long way compared to The Gutter which has at least 3.

But you miss the point, the game design was entirely linear in DS1. You HAD to do all the Lord battles and HAD to ring both the bells, the slightly different paths didn't matter as you had no choices in doing the tasks. DS2 gives you options in which tasks to do or not do and has far more optional areas and bosses.

There was 32 optional bosses in DS2, and 7 (or 12 with the key and covern) in DS1.

A singular skip (via grinding souls) does not make DS2 "non-linear". It gives you a little illusion of choice and then railroads you right to the end through maps that couldn't be any more transparent in their linearity.

[アゼム]

Hahahahahahahhaha
Hahahahahahahah
HHahahahahaha
No.

[Empress Misery]

引用自 Erebus：

A singular skip (via grinding souls) does not make DS2 "non-linear". It gives you a little illusion of choice and then railroads you right to the end through maps that couldn't be any more transparent in their linearity.

So where's the non linear choices in DS1, the order you ring the bells and the order you aquire the Lord Souls?

[Erebus]

引用自 Empress Misery：

So where's the non linear choices in DS1, the order you ring the bells and the order you aquire the Lord Souls?

The entire way you can progress through the game. Sure there are no major content skips, but there are multiple paths of progression through the world with the only major limitations being the plot progression aspects (lord souls & bells).

There are multiple routes for instance to Darkroot Garden/Basin or Blighttown from the starting area. And large segments of maps that can be explored or ignored. Compare that to say anything past the Shrine of Winter or any of the specific paths to the lord souls. You absolutely have to trudge through Drangleic Castles 1 path. Ditto for Shrine of Amana, Undead Crypt, Aldia's Keep, Dragon Aerie, Dragon Shrine, Huntsman's Copse, and many many other locations. Other than the one singular skip of like half to 2/3's of the base game everything is a straight point A to point B.

The maps are linear enough and simplistic enough I'm having a hard time on google actually finding detailed level maps for DS2. Though Bloodborne, Demon's Souls, and Dark Soul (1) sure as hell have in-depth maps for everything.

[アゼム]

引用自 Empress Misery：

引用自 Erebus：

A singular skip (via grinding souls) does not make DS2 "non-linear". It gives you a little illusion of choice and then railroads you right to the end through maps that couldn't be any more transparent in their linearity.

So where's the non linear choices in DS1, the order you ring the bells and the order you aquire the Lord Souls?

Let me put it this way. Every time I start a new DkS1 character I go from Firelink down to New Londo into the Valley of the Drakes and Blighttown. After that I go through Darkroot Garden and up into the Undead Parish and back down to Firelink via the shortcut. That is completely unusual in terms of what is considered the "normal path"

[Lunacy]

I loved the wrapped world in Dark Souls 1 (and apparently bloodborne) where a single bonfire is good for multiple areas (unlike dark souls 2 which gives you a warpable bonfire every couple of meters)

Like in a NG++ run the first boss I killed was Sif (because I need 3 of his soul for weapons) and Tauros Demon, Capra Demon, and Gaping Dragon are completely skippable.

While DS2 isn't completely linear it starts to feel like it. There's 2 ways to get to lost bastiile so that's nice.

I just feel the atmosphere in DS1. Like you see both Demon Ruins and Ash Lake from the Tomb of Giants. DS2 is like "oh well you can see such and so from here" but that's just the place you head to next from the place you see it at.

[Erebus]

引用自 PacotheFriendlyTaco：

引用自 Empress Misery：

So where's the non linear choices in DS1, the order you ring the bells and the order you aquire the Lord Souls?

Let me put it this way. Every time I start a new DkS1 character I go from Firelink down to New Londo into the Valley of the Drakes and Blighttown. After that I go through Darkroot Garden and up into the Undead Parish and back down to Firelink via the shortcut. That is completely unusual in terms of what is considered the "normal path"

Isn't it also possible to do Sif like first thing, assuming you can survive the trek?

[Empress Misery]

引用自 Erebus：

The entire way you can progress through the game. Sure there are no major content skips, but there are multiple paths of progression through the world with the only major limitations being the plot progression aspects (lord souls & bells).

There aren't multiple paths of progression at all, as there's only 1 path of progressing. Ring 2 bells, get 4 souls, finish game.

The maps in DS1 aren't generally any more straight from point A to B than those in DS2, just give the illusion of it by occasionally having a few connections to other linear maps. Areas like Sen's Fortress, The Depths, Lost Izalith, The Catacombs, Tomb of the Giants, Kiln of the First Flame, Crystal Cave, etc. only have one entrance and exit and are even more non optional. There's a very few maps with options to go to other areas, but theres no choice of direction at all (also interestingly theres 9 areas of DS1 with more than 1 area linked and 10 in DS2), it's not some big open world game. There also isn't a "singular skip" of 2/3rds of the game, there's multiple skips of as much or as little as you want to. You could skip lots of the PvE by focussing on PvP if you wanted, an option unavailibe in the more rigid DS1.

Demon's Souls maps are probably the most linear in the series. The entire game is a hub point and then A to B to C (to D) levels which are for the most part curved lines with a shortcut or occasionally long path 1 and skip path 2. You can find detailed maps pretty easily for DS2 if you look though ( for example http://darksouls2.wiki.fextralife.com/file/view/GutterMapbyTratchen.png )

[Erebus]

引用自 Empress Misery：

( for example http://darksouls2.wiki.fextralife.com/file/view/GutterMapbyTratchen.png )

That was literally the only map I found, and here compare it to Blighttown's map: http://www.kouryakubo.com/darksouls_en/image/maps/map07_blighttown_en.gif

[Empress Misery]

引用自 PacotheFriendlyTaco：

Let me put it this way. Every time I start a new DkS1 character I go from Firelink down to New Londo into the Valley of the Drakes and Blighttown. After that I go through Darkroot Garden and up into the Undead Parish and back down to Firelink via the shortcut. That is completely unusual in terms of what is considered the "normal path"

Thats not really that unusual, the Burg has basicaly nothing interesting in it. But still, you're locked into ringing two bells then fighting 4 bosses. There's no do PvP for a few hours and never bother with the Bells and Lords option.

[Empress Misery]

引用自 Erebus：

That was literally the only map I found, and here compare it to Blighttown's map: http://www.kouryakubo.com/darksouls_en/image/maps/map07_blighttown_en.gif

One is a big line, the other has multiple paths and is in DS2.

Here's the same site doing the DS2 equivilent.

http://www.kouryakubo.com/darksouls2/image/maps/map17_thegutter.png

Theres all the others here, just not in English. http://www.kouryakubo.com/darksouls2/index.html (its the "攻略マップ と 出現する敵" section in the main area) and has all of them.

DS1 doesn't really have a map anything like this.

http://www.kouryakubo.com/darksouls2/image/maps/map301_frozeneleumloyce.png

[Josh]

引用自 Empress Misery：

引用自 guering：

Here is all the areas/bosses you have to complete in order:

Things Betwixt>Majula>FOTFG>Lost Bastille/Lost Sinner>Gutter>Black Gulch/The Rotton>Shaded Woods>Tseldora/Freja>Huntmans Copse/Skelton Lords>Harvest Valley>Iron Keep/Old Iron King>Dangleic Castle/Mirror Knight and Twin Dragonriders>Shrine of Amana/Demon of Song>Catacombs/Velstadt>Aldia's Keep/Guardian Dragon>Dragon Memories>Back to Drangleic Castle to kill Watcher and Defender/Nashandra/Aldia.

DS1 had a few interconnected areas but the game was almost entirely fixed in how you played it, you had to ring both bells, you had to fight all 4 Lords. Other than how you got into Blightown and arrived in the parish and two small optional areas there really wasn't any choice at all, everything else was a forced list of tasks.

Even from your list you don't ever have to fight the Lost Sinner, or the Rotten, or Freja or the old Iron King or Aldia if you don't want and it had many more optional areas and bosses.

DS1 would have been better with those kind of options. Not having to go through several of the dull post Anor Londo levels would be great. :p

lmao the realeast post about "linear" gameplay in this entire discussion