Your ideal Lone Wolf 12 man team

[Lampros]

Now that I've done some DLC content, and my save got accidentally deleted, I am going to start a new campaign. But I am still iffy on the final 12-man composition. What do you guys run in a Lone Wolf or a Gladiator campaign where you are limited to 12?

I was thinking something like this:

2 shield tanks
2 spearmen (flanks)
2 2H damage dealers
1 Duelist
1 Sergeant
2 Archer/thrower hybrids

I can't figure out what the 2 remaining back-liners will be. Since people are singing praises of handgonnes, perhaps 2 X-bowmen/handgonner hybrids? But that leaves me with literally 0 reach weapon users (except the Sergeant and his lame banner); and I've never run a campaign without at least 2 reach weapon users!

[Hairy Coo]

In 12 man team u dont have a luxury to have situational guys. Imo spearman are very situational, they dont do dmg and in late game its a dmg race. Ur already planning on 2 tanks, thats enough in a team of dudes who dont do dmg. I’d swap spearman for 2h and the last 2 should be lancers imo, they are pretty usefull woth QH and nets/grenades.

[Lampros]

Originally posted by Hairy Coo:

In 12 man team u dont have a luxury to have situational guys. Imo spearman are very situational, they dont do dmg and in late game its a dmg race. Ur already planning on 2 tanks, thats enough in a team of dudes who dont do dmg. I’d swap spearman for 2h and the last 2 should be lancers imo, they are pretty usefull woth QH and nets/grenades.

By "lancers" you mean pure reach weapon guys?

Spearmen use is a habit from fighting a sea of Orcs. In some fights there are just too many of them to kill quickly, so I wanted them to run into my spearwalls and in so doing either die or at least be delayed.

[Scathe]

I like the idea and versatility of a guy who has polearm mastery, cleaver mastery, rotate, and quick hands. may have recover too. with a 2h cleaver, whip, and billhook. he would have high Matk, decent Mdef but not as high as your best frontliners, and good all around stats otherwise. I would have two such guys to allow them to have coverage to rotate 6 of the frontliners out of danger if necessary.

I would have 3 tanks, and not have any men who are considered "spearman" but my tanks might carry a spear. tank on each flank and one in middle.

4 total bros between frontline 2h and duelist.. some of these bros might have a similar build to the polearm+cleaver I mentioned for back line, minus rotate.

I would not shy away from experimenting with a handgonner. that can come at the cost of an archer/thrower I guess.

[Hairy Coo]

Originally posted by Lampros:

Originally posted by Hairy Coo:

In 12 man team u dont have a luxury to have situational guys. Imo spearman are very situational, they dont do dmg and in late game its a dmg race. Ur already planning on 2 tanks, thats enough in a team of dudes who dont do dmg. I’d swap spearman for 2h and the last 2 should be lancers imo, they are pretty usefull woth QH and nets/grenades.

By "lancers" you mean pure reach weapon guys?

Spearmen use is a habit from fighting a sea of Orcs. In some fights there are just too many of them to kill quickly, so I wanted them to run into my spearwalls and in so doing either die or at least be delayed.

Billhoks and qh for nets or even a 2h cleaver for billhok into cleaver chop. I usually buold them nimble and raise their mdf so they can take a few hits if needed (and they usually have to in late game).

You can use tanks to keep orcs busy, give em 2 more shields in your bag, good tabk should hold for long enough. Spearman and tanks kinda have the same idea imo which is to keep thing busy, in regular team u may have em if u like em (i dont personally) but u just cant in 12 menz.

[Lampros]

Originally posted by Scathe:

I like the idea and versatility of a guy who has polearm mastery, cleaver mastery, rotate, and quick hands. may have recover too. with a 2h cleaver, whip, and billhook. he would have high Matk, decent Mdef but not as high as your best frontliners, and good all around stats otherwise. I would have two such guys to allow them to have coverage to rotate 6 of the frontliners out of danger if necessary.

Hmm, I never considered having reach weapon guys as a back-up front-liners, but that sounds like a useful idea indeed! But 3 weapons? So he'd need Bags, too, and that's quite a lot of Perks.

Originally posted by Scathe:

I would have 3 tanks, and not have any men who are considered "spearman" but my tanks might carry a spear. tank on each flank and one in middle.

The reason for me to take specifically spear specialist tanks was that the spear Perk gives you extra oomph with Spearwall usage. I am not sure if regular Spearwall is worth using without the Perk.

Originally posted by Hairy Coo:

Billhoks and qh for nets or even a 2h cleaver for billhok into cleaver chop. I usually buold them nimble and raise their mdf so they can take a few hits if needed (and they usually have to in late game).

Hmm, looks like reach weapon plus 2H cleaver hybrid is a new thing while I was gone. I guess I should experiment with this as well!

[turtle225]

My Gladiators team has all sorts of goofy stuff and it works. I wouldn't stress so much about ideals. the important part is you have no reserve, so your bros need to be versatile enough to be useful in all encounters.

[Scathe]

Originally posted by Lampros:

Originally posted by Scathe:

I like the idea and versatility of a guy who has polearm mastery, cleaver mastery, rotate, and quick hands. may have recover too. with a 2h cleaver, whip, and billhook. he would have high Matk, decent Mdef but not as high as your best frontliners, and good all around stats otherwise. I would have two such guys to allow them to have coverage to rotate 6 of the frontliners out of danger if necessary.

Hmm, I never considered having reach weapon guys as a back-up front-liners, but that sounds like a useful idea indeed! But 3 weapons? So he'd need Bags, too, and that's quite a lot of Perks.

no, doesn't need bags, 1 active weapon plus two normal bag slots = 3 weapons.

[Lampros]

Originally posted by turtle225:

My Gladiators team has all sorts of goofy stuff and it works. I wouldn't stress so much about ideals. the important part is you have no reserve, so your bros need to be versatile enough to be useful in all encounters.

What's your 12 there, may I ask?

And yeah, everyone has to be reasonably versatile. So I was leveling up Melee Attack slightly even on the archers for the Kraken fight - something like up to 65?

Originally posted by Scathe:

Originally posted by Lampros:

Hmm, I never considered having reach weapon guys as a back-up front-liners, but that sounds like a useful idea indeed! But 3 weapons? So he'd need Bags, too, and that's quite a lot of Perks.

no, doesn't need bags, 1 active weapon plus two normal bag slots = 3 weapons.

Ah, ok. But then that's a lot of accumulated Fatigue; and I also like 2 slots open for bandage and antidotes.

[Hairy Coo]

Originally posted by turtle225:

My Gladiators team has all sorts of goofy stuff and it works. I wouldn't stress so much about ideals. the important part is you have no reserve, so your bros need to be versatile enough to be useful in all encounters.

Yeah...but ur Turtle. Its like taking advice from Mike Tyson who’d say sometimes he goof off on his punches ;)

[Hairy Coo]

Originally posted by Lampros:

Originally posted by Scathe:

I like the idea and versatility of a guy who has polearm mastery, cleaver mastery, rotate, and quick hands. may have recover too. with a 2h cleaver, whip, and billhook. he would have high Matk, decent Mdef but not as high as your best frontliners, and good all around stats otherwise. I would have two such guys to allow them to have coverage to rotate 6 of the frontliners out of danger if necessary.

Hmm, I never considered having reach weapon guys as a back-up front-liners, but that sounds like a useful idea indeed! But 3 weapons? So he'd need Bags, too, and that's quite a lot of Perks.

Originally posted by Scathe:

I would have 3 tanks, and not have any men who are considered "spearman" but my tanks might carry a spear. tank on each flank and one in middle.

The reason for me to take specifically spear specialist tanks was that the spear Perk gives you extra oomph with Spearwall usage. I am not sure if regular Spearwall is worth using without the Perk.

Originally posted by Hairy Coo:

Billhoks and qh for nets or even a 2h cleaver for billhok into cleaver chop. I usually buold them nimble and raise their mdf so they can take a few hits if needed (and they usually have to in late game).

Hmm, looks like reach weapon plus 2H cleaver hybrid is a new thing while I was gone. I guess I should experiment with this as well!

Well its just easy math with 5ap lance into 4ap hit, it could be anything else that uses 4ap, 2h cleaver just happen to have the most dmg. Mind you it tskes alot of fat to run through the whole fight. Frankly though i find lancers better with just lance and a couple of nets for high def enemies.

[turtle225]

Originally posted by Hairy Coo:

Originally posted by turtle225:

My Gladiators team has all sorts of goofy stuff and it works. I wouldn't stress so much about ideals. the important part is you have no reserve, so your bros need to be versatile enough to be useful in all encounters.

Yeah...but ur Turtle. Its like taking advice from Mike Tyson who’d say sometimes he goof off on his punches ;)

You give me too much credit. I have a lot of game knowledge, but I make plenty of mistakes same as anyone. I've long since stopped caring so much about min-maxing though, because I don't think it is necessary.

Originally posted by Lampros:

What's your 12 there, may I ask?

And yeah, everyone has to be reasonably versatile. So I was leveling up Melee Attack slightly even on the archers for the Kraken fight - something like up to 65?

I have a Lone Wolf on the left, 5 frontliners on the right - Shielded Mace, Duelist Qatal, Duelist Hybrid, 2Hander, Duelist Spear. 6 Backliners - Billhook/Cleaver, Handgonne/Banner, Warbow/Billhook, Polemace, Swordlance/Polehammer, Xbow/Billhook.

Everyone has Fearsome because I wanted to try it out.

If you want to fight Kraken you really want as high skill as you can get to break free, and probably Recover on everyone. I have no desire to fight the Kraken nor do I like Recover so I simply don't fight him.

[Benny]

I don´t believe min maxing is so important in this game, especially not on ironman.

What i did run in my old min max campaign was this:

4 zweihänders
2 tanks
1 sergeant
1 duellist
4 crossbow/polearms

[Lampros]

Originally posted by Hairy Coo:

Well its just easy math with 5ap lance into 4ap hit, it could be anything else that uses 4ap, 2h cleaver just happen to have the most dmg. Mind you it tskes alot of fat to run through the whole fight. Frankly though i find lancers better with just lance and a couple of nets for high def enemies.

Ah, so QH is a must then.

Originally posted by turtle225:

I have a Lone Wolf on the left, 5 frontliners on the right - Shielded Mace, Duelist Qatal, Duelist Hybrid, 2Hander, Duelist Spear. 6 Backliners - Billhook/Cleaver, Handgonne/Banner, Warbow/Billhook, Polemace, Swordlance/Polehammer, Xbow/Billhook.

Everyone has Fearsome because I wanted to try it out.

So as I predicted, 2Hs are quickly being phased out of the game :(

How is the Fearsome - now that you've tested the new version? I've stuck it on one archer and a 1H tank; and I see no appreciable difference. But then a whole team may be different!

Originally posted by turtle225:

If you want to fight Kraken you really want as high skill as you can get to break free, and probably Recover on everyone. I have no desire to fight the Kraken nor do I like Recover so I simply don't fight him.

What's the minimum Melee Attack I want on ranged units for the Kraken?

Originally posted by Benny:

I don´t believe min maxing is so important in this game, especially not on ironman.

What i did run in my old min max campaign was this:

4 zweihänders
2 tanks
1 sergeant
1 duellist
4 crossbow/polearms

Huh? Wouldn't min-maxing be important on iroman, precisely because you cannot re-load?

Anyways, were the tanks or the 2Hs on the flank? I still don't know what's the best composition for the flank protection duty.

[titanopteryx]

Well it depends on if the lone wolf hedge knight can train apprentices. Normally hedge knights can, but for whatever reason the event isn't happening in my lone wolf game. If it does happen, the lone wolf would synergize well with apprentices.

[Lampros]

Originally posted by titanopteryx:

Well it depends on if the lone wolf hedge knight can train apprentices. Normally hedge knights can, but for whatever reason the event isn't happening in my lone wolf game. If it does happen, the lone wolf would synergize well with apprentices.

Lone Wolf cannot train Squires, whereas normal Hedge Knights can. So I suspect the same thing applies across the board.