Expert sphere grid, start

[masternoxx1]

I'd like to hear what other ppl did on the expert sphere grid at the start of the game. I have restarted about 6 times due to screw ups, and think I have finally found some way that I like. Well what I did is moved all chars (except Auron) through the center grid to get lancet and (except for lulu) steal, after using all the power up spheres near the lancet. I waited till all the way until you get the first Lv 1 unlock sphere (after Luca), to move anyone. I moved yuna down wakka's trail as its really nice to have another high agility character with dark and silence attack when you want to steal from enemies. I thought about using Tidus for this, but realized he will do too much damage. Problem is that wakka is needed for the flying enemies so he can't usually inflict the status that incapacitate enemies, allowing easy stealing.

One thing I realized is that its worth it to get the extra strength or magic spheres at the start. For instance if you have to backtrack its definitely worth it at the start. I moved Auron down tidus's path at the start and had to backtrack to get two strength nodes but it was definitely worth it to do so.

Also I did not get Flee with tidus, but did with auron. Reason being I like steal to be the first one on the list under special when the character can steal. Since you have to do it so often. Kind of annoying that flee is listed before steal but thats how it is.

I got the Extract Ability with Khimari only and this seems good, and am moving him down rikku's path for now, I think it is better to have a low agility character with the cure spells, perhaps he can also have the protect / shell / reflect spells.

I realized on my last playthru that all the strength spheres are really important for Yuna to increase summon damage, and its more important than her learning the white magic, which I think I will have Khimari do this time.

[Casurin]

It is mostly irrelevant - backtracking is, specially early game, imo detrimental: Nearly always it just means you spent more levels to gain the same number of stats as if you would just go along the paths.
About who you use for what: Again, hardly matters.
best just progress along the paths and take the sidearms when they are not just 3 empty fields as otherwise you likely hit the end of the path before you have the spheres to unlock them.

[Hinnyuu]

Early on S.lvls are more important than +1/2 stats most of the time, because it's not that easy to get a lot of levels, and everything is fairly spaced out.

My standard route is get everyone down Auron's path in the most efficient manner, preferably via the first few Tidus lines that include Cheer and Haste. The only two exceptions are Kimahri and Lulu. Kimahri I let sit in front of the lvl.1 Sphere Lock until he can get past for Use/Steal, while Lulu goes down Black Magic (her attack animation and overdrive make her least suited for physical damage).

Once everyone gets with the Auron program, I go down until I reach Armor Break. From there, I use Friend/Teleport Spheres (which I usually have some of by the time I get this far) to backtrack to the earlier junction with Tidus' path. I then switch to going down there until I reach Quick Hit, which I usually do around Zanarkand or so. Then I usually pause a little until I have more fast travel spheres, and it's back to Auron for the rest of his path until the end. That's usually the point where I can comfortably farm Omega, and that means S.llvls are plentiful. Freedom of choice from there, usually Wakka's path from the end up until Aim, with one character backtracking along the Tidus route instead to branch off to the top and snag Bribe (possibly earlier, depending on where I am in the story; it's only really needed once I'm in Omega but it's very needed there to get Auto-Haste asap).

Kimahri usually rejoins the main group after his brief foray into Use/Steal on Rikku's path (usually via the top and down by Haste, not by backtracking through the center).

Lulu will dip into White Magic at the earliest convenience, nabbing the Nul spells and Raise asap. There's plenty of intersections between Black and White that make this easy. Grabbing Dispel is also very useful, as are Shell/Protect. She usually has plenty of S.lvls to spare, and needs to park in front of the lvl.3 Sphere Locks securing Double Cast anyway because I tend to get there before I can break the lock. Then it's down to wait some more until Ultima can be unlocked. Important: grab Gravity! It's tremendously useful when catching fiends for the Arena in Omega/Sin.

[masternoxx1]

Cool to hear what others have done. I still don't think backtracking is not too bad after all you can move 4 spaces for 1, if you plan it out, does not really hurt you much considering now you can get overkills or whatever. For instance now I am just past the mid-level firaga etc spells and I think I'll take lulu down the protect path, but I have to sidetrack to get a magic +4, but it seems highly worth it as there are no other magic nodes anywhere nearby on her path.
I definitely thought about how if you are stat maxing it would be best to take all down one path, but it makes the game tedious and less fun IMO. So my compromise was to use the buff spheres in the middle and take everyone through there. I like them all to have their original identity somewhat.
Yeah there are a lot of spots where I am like wondering should I do that, like for instance now my Tidus/Auron are both next to a level 1 lock with a magic +4 behind it. Which you have to backtrack to. I'm thinking I'm not going to get that one since I don't think (?) the magic stat affects haste or slow spells.
Also I'm going to use a luck sphere at some point. I realized its not good to put these anywhere but on a side node. But since I only have 1 fortune sphere who should I use it on? thanks =)

[Hinnyuu]

Optimizing with stat-maxing in mind is actually fairly irrelevant. S.lvls are abundant at endgame, even without the AP trick. Just clearing Omega up and down will give you more than you will be able to handle with the available spheres.

Optimizing paths is far more important early on, because S.lvls are the bottleneck there. If you fight a good amount, you'll easily get to 99 of each stat sphere eventually because you simply can't spend them fast enough. Backtracking makes this even more problematic, which is why I personally try to limit it to specific cases; with Lulu I'm more likely to do it, for example, because she tends to end up bottlenecked by lvl.3/4 Key Spheres rather than S.lvls (at least in the way I level her).

Ultimately, though, it's an individual decision based on what you want your characters to do, and when you want them to do that. YMMV, and it's not like the game is hard enough to really punish you for a detour or two.

[Casurin]

It is by no way important, but if you are already looking into optimizing your leveling then backtracking is (in most cases) just not good.

It is kinda like the difference of needing 25 hours or 24 hours to beat the game - irrelevant unless you really do want to optimise.

[masternoxx1]

One thing I am not going to backtrack for, is black magic abilities. It's tempting to get drain and demi by backtracking, but you will get like 5-10 black magic spheres if you fight the bosses and get overkills. So I'm keeping that in mind this time.
Oh wait they have to be activated by another char... I guess I am going to have to backtrack for demi a few spaces.
This expert sphere grid is highly annoying when you have borderline OCD. Not even joking.

So I got the luck sphere, whom should I use it on, I am thinking Tidus.

[Casurin]

Well, i dislike this "expert" grid anyway - nothing about it is expert imo. It is just a mess and bit smaller than the normal one.

[Hinnyuu]

Originally posted by Casurin:

Well, i dislike this "expert" grid anyway - nothing about it is expert imo. It is just a mess and bit smaller than the normal one.

I think the nomenclature is a bit off, yes. But I prefer it anyway because it allows me to more easily build characters in different ways. The fact that it's smaller isn't relevant, because nobody fills it out completely anyway - unless it's for the achievement, in which case being smaller is an advantage. In terms of gameplay power it literally doesn't matter.

[DigginTiger]

I agree with everything "casurin" said.

i try to not backtrack. I prefer keeping a few unspent level (khimari + lulu mostly) than going back and forth.
And although there is some kind of freedom on the expert sphere grid i always take the standard one. This "expert" grid doesn't feel expert to me either.

Do as you like, it doesn't matter much indeed.

[masternoxx1]

Expert sphere grid can be annoying. But I just keep lots of saves in case.
I basically replayed this game in part, because of the expert sphere grid, as I thought the game might be more challenging? But also a big part of it was the japanese voice.

I went through the Bio area without getting it because I tried it out, and this is the FF where Bio does no damage. It seems also that you can access Bio from the end of Wakka's sphere grid so I will probably do that instead.

I did get demi thanks for the advice there.

[Casurin]

Originally posted by Hinnyuu:

~~snip~~

Yeah, the extra-nodes are pretty much useless in nearly every way, and it does make it easier to go for custom builds, but the way it is structured is meh.
I always wished they had made it a real expert grid - skills harder to reach, maybe force people to choose between different paths with one-way passages or such so that you can not so easily backtrack. Or just add a few girds with different focuses to be more unique.

In the end all characters can have the stats pretty much maxed anyways, so it mostly is just the normal game that is affected a bit.

[masternoxx1]

I actually went back and did not get the demi, with lulu. I figure it does not matter the magic stat, and I will get it with wakka???
Whoever designed the expert sphere grid, it is kind of interesting, for instance it seems like it is designed to have wakka go through the bio and demi area.

[Hinnyuu]

Wakka's path does indeed connect to some spells, like Drain/Osmose and Gravity. However I still prefer getting Gravity with Lulu, because her path has Double Cast. Opening with Gravity (or Ultima) and then a second Gravity in one turn brings many enemies in Omega into instant capture range.

[Mikasa Ackerman]

i had a file where i sent yuna lulu and kimahri all around the lower half of their shared circle , but overall , having black magic was more useful for yuna than having blind attack and lancet
so now i just send lulu straight on her path without any extra things ( shes just a pure black mage ) for yuna i one time just sent her to lulus path after the first spells , but then she didnt have the element protection spells which was inconvenient for the last seymour

on thing i often do is teach auron haste and the slow thats hits everyone since hes right next to them i never really tried to truly mix up the roles so far except with yuna , sending rikku on aurons path might work , except the fact that she probabyl wouldnt gain enough agility to stay fast enough to hit everything with aurons high strength ( plus , he has 10 strength more than her , rikku as a white mage could work tho given that some of her overdrives are group buffs

[Hinnyuu]

Yuna is a peculiar case, because while the game definitely sets her up as a White Mage, she's actually quite well suited for a melee combat build.

One reason is that her Aeons scale with Yuna's stats. Sending her down a path that buffs her STR will make Aeons VERY powerful. You can easily reach >9,999 damage with Bahamut as soon as you acquire him, for example, allowing you to absolutely destroy any enemy you encounter at that point in the game. Nothing that shows Belgemine what's what quite like a Megaflare blasting her puny little Shiva for 40,000 damage :P

But even putting aside the Aeon factor, Yuna actually has a lot going for her as an attacker. Her attack animation is very quick, which is useful on long fights. And her Celestial Weapon both has MP 1 and scales damage based on MP - allowing you to keep it at maximum damage much more easily than e.g. Tidus's Caladbolg (which scales with HP). In addition, the MP 1 makes using Quick Hit very easy. And on top of all that, her Celestial Weapon is super easy to unlock, too!