DARK SOULS™ II: Scholar of the First Sin

DARK SOULS™ II: Scholar of the First Sin

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it's a gabe Sep 22, 2015 @ 10:56am
Am I the only one with a huge problem exploring Frozen Eleum Loyce?
I play a bow build with some scimithar on the side for difficult situations and it's almost impossible for me to explore this place. I spent more or less 2 or 3 hours just getting ready for the king's pet and things are only getting worse now that the ice melted. Every mob (except the smaller ones) take me a very long time (not to mention arrows) to take down :/ If I try to engage on close combat with the big guys, I barely get out of it with life, if alive (just now I died for one of those things with HUGE spears after half an hour running away from mobs, trying to defeat them). Didn't walk much at all to get there, but it takes a ridiculous amount of time to pass through.

Is it bc DS2 has a terrible design where you have to keep changing builds to survive certain situations? I noticed that getting some of the items in the Iron Keep is nearly impossible (it was impossible for me, but hey, some ppl could do it). I did a little research after I got fed up with this place that revealed that specific builds are able to survive here, but there's no mention of rangers (same for the king's pet, where there was no strategy for rangers and playing with a bow against it was extremely uneffective). Are the other DLC areas this punishing? Ranger is really the only class I enjoy playing. I don't like tanking and I'm not even good at that (lemme tell you how many times I died in DS cos I insisted on playing with a tank build).
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Showing 1-15 of 24 comments
CoffeeDono Sep 22, 2015 @ 2:12pm 
Well I will let you know that depending on what weapon you go in with in can be easier or harder, if your a ranger with a bow in Loyce your gonna have a really hard time, enemys there are weaker to crush and obviously fire. There is also no need to tank there either, most of the enemys are slow and often leave themselves wide open after attacking, like the guys with the large lances. And range only really works on the pet if you have a phantom taking its attention otherwise you will probably be snacked on by the angry kitty. Try summoning some more help maybe
it's a gabe Sep 22, 2015 @ 2:24pm 
Originally posted by ArmoredTitan:
Well I will let you know that depending on what weapon you go in with in can be easier or harder, if your a ranger with a bow in Loyce your gonna have a really hard time, enemys there are weaker to crush and obviously fire. There is also no need to tank there either, most of the enemys are slow and often leave themselves wide open after attacking, like the guys with the large lances. And range only really works on the pet if you have a phantom taking its attention otherwise you will probably be snacked on by the angry kitty. Try summoning some more help maybe

I find their windows to be pretty short, especially when facing two of the same type at the same time :/ Fire arrows did the same amount of damage as magic arrows to them. As for the king's pet, it's still an annoyance for rangers even with summons. I died quite a few times until I was able to spot two player signs. No matter how many people are in the field, the boss will give some attention to each and everyone a few times. Sometimes it even attacks one after the other randomly, sometimes repeating the attacks against someone who's not even dealing damage (me, busy dodging while the summons would deal a massive amount of damage).

It seems that this DLC was badly designed, probably to force co-op (which doesn't seem to work in my case as I had to wait a long while for signs to show up), or there were changes made to it with SotFS, making enemy placements punishing for anyone who doesn't adapt to the enemies weakness. I had some challenge defeating other enemies in parts of the base game before, but it felt like it was fair, like punishment came from recklessness, not like I was bieng dumbed down and severely punished because I wasn't playing "as it's supposed to be". Don't get me wrong, I love this game. But I'm hating this DLC more than I can possibly express.
boiling pie Sep 22, 2015 @ 2:29pm 
most of the enemies are easily poisoned. Stack up on poison arrows. I hope you have the blackbow. A fast bow is really helpful.

All enemies are also quite easy to backstab, except the cristalyzed ones. These are a pain though. Crystalized Spearmen are my most hated enemies.

Aava is all about agilty. Bring it up to 105 and you should be able to dodge and outroll her attacks, with some practice (or a lot, as in my case)
Last edited by boiling pie; Sep 22, 2015 @ 2:42pm
it's a gabe Sep 22, 2015 @ 2:33pm 
Originally posted by boiling pie:
most of the enemies are easily poisoned. Stack up on poison arrows.

All enemies are also quite easy to backstab, except the cristalyzed ones. These are a pain though. Crystalized Spearmen are my most hated enemies.

My character is built towards poison, but it's been of literally no help for me. There must be something going on at my end, I guess? Not easy for me to get behind them and perform the backstab with a scimithar when there are one or two more ready to land the killing blow.
boiling pie Sep 22, 2015 @ 2:38pm 
Originally posted by Gabriel C:
Originally posted by boiling pie:
most of the enemies are easily poisoned. Stack up on poison arrows.

All enemies are also quite easy to backstab, except the cristalyzed ones. These are a pain though. Crystalized Spearmen are my most hated enemies.

My character is built towards poison, but it's been of literally no help for me. There must be something going on at my end, I guess? Not easy for me to get behind them and perform the backstab with a scimithar when there are one or two more ready to land the killing blow.

try to separate them. Run back and hit.
I have just finished the dlc with a light dex/faith build and used the bow a lot.
LightOfJudgment Sep 22, 2015 @ 2:46pm 
I have mixed feelings about the DLC. On the one hand, I love the design of its areas and I think the boss fights are the best I've experienced in these games, especially those of the Old Iron King DLC.

On the other hand, and I'm happy to be corrected on this if I'm wrong, it seems as if they heavily favor melee/quality builds over everything else, to the point that I felt almost pigeonholed into respecing from my "magic quality" build (proficient in all schools of magic, most notably sorceries) to a melee quality build with a club, spear, greatsword, pyromancy flame (hardly used because wouldn't you know it, even the ice-based enemies are resistant to fire), and bow, since I figured that it'd be more fun to have more effective options than swinging my enchanted Moonlight Greatsword at everything. I don't need (nor do I want) magic to destroy everything effortlessly, but I'd rather it not become so weak so as to defeat the purpose of using it in the first place.
it's a gabe Sep 22, 2015 @ 3:06pm 
Originally posted by lightofjudgment1:
I have mixed feelings about the DLC. On the one hand, I love the design of its areas and I think the boss fights are the best I've experienced in these games, especially those of the Old Iron King DLC.

On the other hand, and I'm happy to be corrected on this if I'm wrong, it seems as if they heavily favor melee/quality builds over everything else, to the point that I felt almost pigeonholed into respecing from my "magic quality" build (proficient in all schools of magic, most notably sorceries) to a melee quality build with a club, spear, greatsword, pyromancy flame (hardly used because wouldn't you know it, even the ice-based enemies are resistant to fire), and bow, since I figured that it'd be more fun to have more effective options than swinging my enchanted Moonlight Greatsword at everything. I don't need (nor do I want) magic to destroy everything effortlessly, but I'd rather it not become so weak so as to defeat the purpose of using it in the first place.

My point exactly. I like the level design of Frozen Eleum Loyce quite a lot. Reminds me of DS. However, how the enemies are set to force the player into an aggressive melee build is terrible. Literally all summon signs I saw (about...four or five the whole time I spent there) had great-something-other. Even when separating enemies, using a bow against them feels as if you were nerfed, as the damage barely scratches them. The way the enemies either get close to you or cast ranged spells makes it difficult to pull off ranged battle as recklessness is not the problem, but the windows are too short even for the black bow's shots. I'm using it now and while I can take two or sometimes three shots at a few types of enemies, they'll soon spam ranged attacks or cut the distance between us with a very aggressive and punishing attack that's not easy to dodge (and gods knows, the invencibility frames are hell for anyone with a focus on dodging).
Last edited by it's a gabe; Sep 22, 2015 @ 3:07pm
Jimbos Sep 22, 2015 @ 3:23pm 
The DLCs are definitly meant to be co-oped it feels like. Probably why they leave those NPC signs all over the place in them, especially in the Iron King DLC it feels like.

As for playing through with a bow... You're gonna have a rough time without some kind of real melee back up, or melee skills. Even with the IMO best bow in the game, the black bow, things take some serious hits. As one person said, just pelt them with poison arrows, if you're gonna stick with the bow, and back off and bait attacks. Go for easy backstabs with your melee wep, when they present them. Even a dagger+0 on a backstab can hit for a surprising amount of damage.
boiling pie Sep 22, 2015 @ 3:36pm 
Originally posted by Gabriel C:
..
(....) The way the enemies either get close to you or cast ranged spells makes it difficult to pull off ranged battle as recklessness is not the problem, but the windows are too short even for the black bow's shots. I'm using it now and while I can take two or sometimes three shots at a few types of enemies, they'll soon spam ranged attacks or cut the distance between us with a very aggressive and punishing attack that's not easy to dodge (and gods knows, the invencibility frames are hell for anyone with a focus on dodging).

the blackbow is fast enough to shot and then dodge without getting hit. That's how I did it, where possible.
Having said that, DS always required melee. You always needed a good weapon. Just think how in DS I spells were limited and could not be refilled without resting at a bonfire.

Also: what level are you? This dlc is really endgame content, maybe you are not ready yet. Ivory King is the most difficult of the dlcs imho.


Last edited by boiling pie; Sep 22, 2015 @ 3:37pm
having a bow focused build is a challenge run in itself, so of course its gonna be harder to pull of. that said, you should easily be able to pull them to you one by one to finish them of. equipping a dagger might be really helpful as it does a ton of critical damage and you can parry these guys one on one or use their long windups to backstab them.

as for aava, i found that going in alone(even with a bow only) is the easiest way to do it. the boss wil focus on you, meaning the attacks become very predictable. contrary to what your intuition as an archer might tell you: at all times try to stay near him. if he does his crystal spear attack roll towards and underneath him. same with melee.
get some distance between you and him to bait him to do a leaping attack towards you. you dodge this to his right rear side(from your point of view) thats his blind spot(unless he does his AOE). this is your time window to attack him. then rinse and repeat.

much simpler to do this alone as he is very predictable.
Archaureous Sep 22, 2015 @ 4:00pm 
Originally posted by Faith+One:
having a bow focused build is a challenge run in itself, so of course its gonna be harder to pull of. that said, you should easily be able to pull them to you one by one to finish them of. equipping a dagger might be really helpful as it does a ton of critical damage and you can parry these guys one on one or use their long windups to backstab them.

as for aava, i found that going in alone(even with a bow only) is the easiest way to do it. the boss wil focus on you, meaning the attacks become very predictable. contrary to what your intuition as an archer might tell you: at all times try to stay near him. if he does his crystal spear attack roll towards and underneath him. same with melee.
get some distance between you and him to bait him to do a leaping attack towards you. you dodge this to his right rear side(from your point of view) thats his blind spot(unless he does his AOE). this is your time window to attack him. then rinse and repeat.

much simpler to do this alone as he is very predictable.

Yeah aava is one fight that is actually easier with a bow, one of the preferred starts is with a fire black hunter bow with fire arrows. Makes him alot easier, alot of the dlc seems to allow more bow use than other parts of the game, or enforce it. Like the shoot able pillars in shulva, you can do some fun things to enemies with quick uses of that (more than once).

Going ranger is challenging, but in the dlc it's a bit more forgiving I think. Dark souls 2 allowed for more bow use than ds1, they fleshed it out a bit more and it can be viable. But it is more difficult to do it in all spots, melee is a build yes that can do any fight and area but I think it's supposed to be the staple of souls. The variance in arrows allow you to take on different enemies however.. arrow damage is a type of damage that is mitigated by some, just like melee users may have to switch weapon types, so do you. Although maces are pretty much good all the way through, melee users can switch out weapons for more effecticeness as well. Sadly the special arrows are limited until late game, but those are your bread and butter for utility.
Last edited by Archaureous; Sep 22, 2015 @ 4:03pm
it's a gabe Sep 22, 2015 @ 4:33pm 
I'm SL 128 and Shulva is being as hard as expected (punishment through recklessness). Also, my scimithar have always been enough for me. I like the tactical approach, learning enemies moves and responding accordingly. The scimithar is useless on Loyce, but as useful as I expect it to be in Shulva. I don't quite like using daggers cos they require very close range and I've never been good with parrying at all, so that's too risky for me. I not always get the backstab button combo right, so I just do that if I know the foe won't take a large chunk of my HP if I mess up (like it has been in Shulva, where they deal a considerable amount of damage, but something I can get away with considering they're entirely slow, not just their attacks).

As for Aalva, is it a he? The very first time I heard it, I though it was a she. Least in my language, Aalva is a female name. The same happened to Sif. I had no knowledge of the origin of the name, thus I always thought Sif was male.
Vinyltavia Sep 22, 2015 @ 5:23pm 
bow and scimitar build here?
You're gonna have to pick things off one by one and you're gonna have to be careful because it sounds like you're massively squishy or something.
on a side note, physical is the best way to go usually in the DLCs as mages have trouble dealing with everything in most of them. Pay note to when and what times slash are viable (like fleshy enemies) and when pierce would be better (like ice encrusted soldiers maybe.) or strike (when hulk needs to smash.)
it's a gabe Sep 22, 2015 @ 5:55pm 
I remember some people mentioning that either scimithars, daggers or katanas could be good to support a bow build. I'm actually using medium armor and am able to dodge smoothly, but Loyce is just too tough either on my build or my SL. Yes, taking one at a time is my style and I never had a problem with it. I always thought everyone was relatively squishy, though. That's the premise of the game, afer all. So far it's been as good as the rest of the game in Shulva. My damage is as I expect it to be and the difficulty is as it's supposed to be (punishment through recklessness).
Originally posted by Gabriel C:
I remember some people mentioning that either scimithars, daggers or katanas could be good to support a bow build. I'm actually using medium armor and am able to dodge smoothly, but Loyce is just too tough either on my build or my SL. Yes, taking one at a time is my style and I never had a problem with it. I always thought everyone was relatively squishy, though. That's the premise of the game, afer all. So far it's been as good as the rest of the game in Shulva. My damage is as I expect it to be and the difficulty is as it's supposed to be (punishment through recklessness).

yeah well, ivory king dlc is the 3rd and hardest one of the dlc. also slash damage. it is not your friend in this part of the game.
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Date Posted: Sep 22, 2015 @ 10:56am
Posts: 24