"Tires too wide for the load they carry"

[Connor Levy]

This is something that I have recently notices causes significant issues in BeamNG with high speed oversteer. I am trying to make a Group C car a la Porsche 962, but it keeps giving me the "tires too wide for the load they carry" note. In real life, cars such as this has massive 300+ mm tires on both the front and rear without issue, but tiny 225s give me the issue on the car. Is there any way I could get large tires on the car without provoking this problem?
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1725485829 https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1725485881

[Arya]

Those cars also had enormous downforce loads. Try increasing mid-speed downforce.

It's also worth noting, as Killrob has said many times over, Automation is focused on building road cars. And when you try to make race cars, the algorithms can start to go haywire.

[RiftHunter4]

Originally posted by Wolfey:

Those cars also had enormous downforce loads. Try increasing mid-speed downforce.

It's also worth noting, as Killrob has said many times over, Automation is focused on building road cars. And when you try to make race cars, the algorithms can start to go haywire.

Also worth noting that Blue warnings are mostly suggestions. That said, it is possible to have tires that are too wide where the downforce from the car isn't spread over the tire efficiently, which can cause a lack of grip.

[Connor Levy]

Originally posted by RiftHunter4:

Originally posted by Wolfey:

Those cars also had enormous downforce loads. Try increasing mid-speed downforce.

It's also worth noting, as Killrob has said many times over, Automation is focused on building road cars. And when you try to make race cars, the algorithms can start to go haywire.

Also worth noting that Blue warnings are mostly suggestions. That said, it is possible to have tires that are too wide where the downforce from the car isn't spread over the tire efficiently, which can cause a lack of grip.

The message does seem to have a significant effect in BeamNG, causing the car to be undriveable at high speeds. And increasing the downforce any more causes the "Downforce too high, car bottoms out" message.

[RiftHunter4]

Originally posted by levyracing:

Originally posted by RiftHunter4:

Also worth noting that Blue warnings are mostly suggestions. That said, it is possible to have tires that are too wide where the downforce from the car isn't spread over the tire efficiently, which can cause a lack of grip.

The message does seem to have a significant effect in BeamNG, causing the car to be undriveable at high speeds. And increasing the downforce any more causes the "Downforce too high, car bottoms out" message.

The messages themselves don't have an effect on the exported car, but they can tell you what might be wrong.

If you're having oversteer problems, you need bigger rear tires, regardless of what Automation says (It itsn't testing for BeamNG). I also see a warning for tire spin. That's one you'll need to fix too.

As a general rule, if you're making a race-spec car, automation is going throw a bunch of warnings at you, but you have to tune the car according to what happens in BeamNG.

[Admiral Obvious]

Automation tries to aim towards drivability over sportiness for most of the warnings it throws, as well as giving advice to keep costs down. That's why tire width is almost always a note, and not an actual "consider" or "fix" notice.

Having tires wider than expected for the game is totally fine. The only reason I think it throws that error is because the game thinks that the wider tires would be too expensive for the average consumer.

[Arya]

A few weeks ago I built a race car as a tech demonstrator and dev mule. It's purpose was to help me understand how to build a supercar/hypercar; everything from tyres to aero and suspension, through to brakes. And a lot of what I learned was counter-intuitive.

My starting point was a hot-hatch my company was making, it was the sportiest vehicle I had to work with and I understood how the base car handled. I swapped the 1.7 litre I4 for a 2.5 litre i5 from a large van, and then re-tuned the VVL, added a bigger turbo and modified the fuel system for 850 horsepower. This went through a five-speed Sequential gearbox and Symmetrical AWD to 220 width tyres front and rear. Braking came from four-piston 300mm Carbon Ceramic discs with ABS.

After track-testing it, I came away with some really surprising conclusions.

> ABS is actually counter-productive on very light cars. Disabling ABS and running smaller brakes, and controlling them manually, much improved the car's braking performance.
> Adding extra gears added weight, but dramatically improved the car's engine braking and made a huge laptime difference.
> Reducing the front tyre width lowered the weight and helped make the car more drivable, without making any significant difference to corner speed.
> Progressive-Rate springs were a godsend, allowing me to massively increase the car's downforce without worrying about suspension collapse. Later on I switched to Active Suspension instead.
> Extracting aero performance is less about giant wings(although you want those) - a tiny lip or spoiler in a strategic spot can make a huge difference. I ended up flaring my wheel arches and then mounting Group-B style flicks on them. And that contributed very, very nicely to total DF. While making the car look completely bonkers, in the best way.

[Connor Levy]

Originally posted by Admiral Obvious:

Automation tries to aim towards drivability over sportiness for most of the warnings it throws, as well as giving advice to keep costs down. That's why tire width is almost always a note, and not an actual "consider" or "fix" notice.

Having tires wider than expected for the game is totally fine. The only reason I think it throws that error is because the game thinks that the wider tires would be too expensive for the average consumer.

In my experience, that message has links to sudden loss of control at high speeds, and decreasing tire widths fixed that issue.

[Connor Levy]

Originally posted by Wolfey:

A few weeks ago I built a race car as a tech demonstrator and dev mule. It's purpose was to help me understand how to build a supercar/hypercar; everything from tyres to aero and suspension, through to brakes. And a lot of what I learned was counter-intuitive.

My starting point was a hot-hatch my company was making, it was the sportiest vehicle I had to work with and I understood how the base car handled. I swapped the 1.7 litre I4 for a 2.5 litre i5 from a large van, and then re-tuned the VVL, added a bigger turbo and modified the fuel system for 850 horsepower. This went through a five-speed Sequential gearbox and Symmetrical AWD to 220 width tyres front and rear. Braking came from four-piston 300mm Carbon Ceramic discs with ABS.

After track-testing it, I came away with some really surprising conclusions.

> ABS is actually counter-productive on very light cars. Disabling ABS and running smaller brakes, and controlling them manually, much improved the car's braking performance.
> Adding extra gears added weight, but dramatically improved the car's engine braking and made a huge laptime difference.
> Reducing the front tyre width lowered the weight and helped make the car more drivable, without making any significant difference to corner speed.
> Progressive-Rate springs were a godsend, allowing me to massively increase the car's downforce without worrying about suspension collapse. Later on I switched to Active Suspension instead.
> Extracting aero performance is less about giant wings(although you want those) - a tiny lip or spoiler in a strategic spot can make a huge difference. I ended up flaring my wheel arches and then mounting Group-B style flicks on them. And that contributed very, very nicely to total DF. While making the car look completely bonkers, in the best way.

I will try to use some of these to improve my cars, thank you.

[Arya]

As an extra point; be careful with engine-braking on RWD cars. Factor engine-braking into your brake bias equation; every downshift on a Sequential or Dual-Clutch gearbox will have a dramatic engine braking effect and that can potentially cause violent, sudden oversteer moments.