Long War 2 difficulty level

[kmpt]

I've finished XCOM EU base game and after some time I've played it again with long war mod but it proved to be really difficult after 5-6 hours of gameplay (I felt like my weapons were pretty weak at that time) and I've passed.
I'm going to play XCOM2 now and I'm wondering if I should start with vanilla game or install Long War 2 mod? Does it make the game much harder or not? What do you think guys?

[joebruce185]

Definitely get familiar with the base game. Definitely play Long War 2 at some point. It is definitely harder than the base game.

[Sabaithal]

Get familiar with the base game, especially the tactical layer, first.

That being said, there is a lot more potential variety in LW2 and a lot to learn. Its basically XCOM 2 with the training wheels taken off in a number of ways. There are a number of new strategic mechanics, a number of new classes, abilities, most missions have been reworked, some new missions exist, aliens now have different variants with their own niche, as does player classes, etc.

And its more difficult. Resources are strained, and you really do have to make the best with what you've got. Hence, get good with the tactical layer, because you won't have optimal gear most of the time. And learn to take every advantage you can get (looking at the technical classes here).

[Mrvecz]

To be honest, veteran (normal) difficulty LW2 is equivalent to legendary difficulty in vanilla. Its that considerably harder, but it also gives you more tools to deal with it, but also throws more stuff at you so alot of it boils down to adjusting for LW2 gameplay which is different from vanilla.

In vanilla, alpha striking is how you get through, but in LW2, its more about CC, map control and careful resource management.

Classes are considerably more interersting and deeper. Vanilla classes have been split up to more direct roles.

Rangers are assault rifle specialists that can go for direct damage or overwatch, can attack twice a turn and can use a sawn off shotgun at close range for quick burst damage.

Shinobies are vanilla Rangers, but game gives them more utility to either go for combat or recon.

Technicals are underestimated class but they can be the class that changes the outcome of a battle, they are armed with a gauntlent which can either act as a flamethrower (ignition disables enemy main weapons so they cannot shoot you) or most importantly, the rocket launcher which can blow away cover and deal considerable damage to enemy groups.
Otherwise they can specialize either in rockets, support or flamethrower, giving them more ammo for it or new types of attacks. For example Technicals flamethrower gets a charge based attack that forces enemies out of cover so they can get shot with overwatch, or rocketeer tree gets a bunker buster missile which deletes all cover, leveling entire buildings.

Gunners are another powerclass, armed with cannon they can now all supress AOE targets, disabling their launchers and grenades. They are also all armed with combat knife which is piece of ♥♥♥♥ only usable for one of their perks called Combatitive, Combatitive gives gunners 90% proc to block melee attack (Chryssalid, Lancer, Muton, but not Faceless) and retaliate by stabbing them in the face. Its quite satisfying to see a Lancer run through 3 overwatch shots, swing his stunstick at your gunner who dodges and stabs him in the face.

Grenadiers are similar to vanilla, but they arent melted together with heavy weapons. They can either build for death or support. Flashbangs can get a perk that causes them to have a 50% chance to stun enemies.

Assaults are high risk, high reward, battlefield control troops armed with shotguns or SMG's, they have tons of crit related perks but also some durability related one's. They also carry stunguns which disable a target for a turn or two (depending on tech level). So that gatekeeper can sit down for a turn while you mop up his buddies.

Snipers no longer have shoehorned pistols to their tree, they are either damage dealers, team support with holotargeters (gives bonus chance to hit to marked targets for entire team). Or as more mobile marksman.

Specialists are either overwatch focused, hacking and robots or healing

Psiops have been toned down considerably and now require combat experience to level up. But they also got new abilities like Bastion (Fortress, but as aura, yes team wide explosive immunity + acid/fire/Cryo resistance, Andromedons can eat their hearts out !).

Classes and their composition is the large part of whenever you will succeed or not
I would split classes to two main categories

1) Powerhouses
These classes are universally good, no matter what and will do the most heavy lifting
A) Rangers (damage)
B) Gunners (crowd control, also large target kills like sectopods or Mechs)
C) Grenadiers or Technicals (cover removal/low HP snipes)
D) Assaults (crowd control and damage)
E) Sparks (tanks)
F) Skirmishers (WOTC/LWOTC damage)

2) Support
These classes you either dont even need to succeed or require good powerhouse classes to unlock their potential.
A) Specialsts (Game tends to outtech you extremely often, leaving your specialist incapable of even having a good chance to hack even basic MEC's, everyone can carry medkits and in LWOTC everyone can revive unconciousness)
B) Snipers (Extremely map dependant, you got sewers or metro ? Well ♥♥♥♥ you)
C) Psiops (require baby sitting before they get useful skills and can justify their existence but will become a powerhouse class eventually)
D) Shinobi (Useful for recon, but very risky since melee attacks can pull more pods)
E) Templars (WOTC/LWOTC, damage or CC)
F) Reapers (WOTC/LWOTC, superior recon abilities than Shinobies).



Oh, and it also exists for War of The Chosen (Long War of The Chosen) and its playable from start to finish.

[Sabaithal]

Oh, forgot to mention that. If you do eventually end up playing long war, I highly recommend you sign up for the religion of FLASHBANGS. Its a religion where we use flashbangs, worship flashbangs, and accept flashbangs as the almighty savior of our troops in the field...because it usually is.

Flashbang don't do direct damage, which is their only drawback. They can be thrown/launched further than other grenades, have a massive blast radius for effect, turn off most enemy non-explosive abilities such as snake-grabs, muton parries, as well as cancelling mind-control, and on top of that incur a significant aim and movement penalty to affect enemy units. And they're free.

On top of that, grenadiers can get perks that enhance flashbangs further to affect robots, and outright knock out enemy units when hit, as well as getting even more of them to use. Heck, I end up using support-grenadiers more often than direct-damage grenadiers because of these things. And they work quite well in combination with certain other classes (shinobis).

Anytime you see an enemy unit still alive (An uninjured, if you use red fog) at the end of the run, flashbang em.

[Mrvecz]

Playing with Red Fog is something i must recommend, turn it on for both sides.

Red Fog in advanced settings makes wounded units have penalties to aim and mobility the closer they are to dying. So a stunlancer with 1 HP cannot sprint through 3 overwatches and crit a wounded psiops hiding on the third floor of a house. He will be happy if he can move 5 titles with both of his AP's and his aim is like 40% so hitting someone in cover is almost impossible.

This stacks on top of debuffs, flashbang and suppression that follow up a rocket strike and suddenly 5 enemies cannot attack you because their hit chance is 0%

Though, it doesnt stop special abilities.
Flashbangs disable defense, psi skills and special abilities in general
Supression disables weapon abilities, most importantly, grenades, rockets and other splashy splash attacks.

[Sabaithal]

Originally posted by Mrvecz:

Playing with Red Fog is something i must recommend, turn it on for both sides.

Red Fog in advanced settings makes wounded units have penalties to aim and mobility the closer they are to dying. So a stunlancer with 1 HP cannot sprint through 3 overwatches and crit a wounded psiops hiding on the third floor of a house. He will be happy if he can move 5 titles with both of his AP's and his aim is like 40% so hitting someone in cover is almost impossible.

This stacks on top of debuffs, flashbang and suppression that follow up a rocket strike and suddenly 5 enemies cannot attack you because their hit chance is 0%

Though, it doesnt stop special abilities.
Flashbangs disable defense, psi skills and special abilities in general
Supression disables weapon abilities, most importantly, grenades, rockets and other splashy splash attacks.

100% this. Red fog means that, in effect, you don't need to outright kill everything by the end of the turn in order to avoid damage. Wounding enemy units significantly will achieve much the same effect a majority of the time.

Best defense is a good offense after all.

[BigRowdy]

LW2 is harder than LW. But not at first.

[Sabaithal]

Originally posted by BigRowdy:

LW2 is harder than LW. But not at first.

That really depends on how you play. LW when the player is spamming nothing but fully upgraded MECs with some SHIVs as backup is basically easy mode.

[BigRowdy]

Originally posted by Sabaithal:

Originally posted by BigRowdy:

LW2 is harder than LW. But not at first.

That really depends on how you play. LW when the player is spamming nothing but fully upgraded MECs with some SHIVs as backup is basically easy mode.

Meh.. I roleplay the game. Hard to explain. Also fun to choose a random starting country..

[frdnwsm]

Some notes on the above comments.

Specialists can improve their hacking with PCS, and also troopers with redscreen rounds and Assaults with Stungunner perk lower robotic enemy hacking defense. EMP grenades, anyone?

Psionics later in their development are seriously OP. Give them advanced Psi amps and skills like Domination, Stasis (take that Gatekeeper out of the action) and Void Rift and watch them run amok.

Grenadiers with sting grenades are great due to the large AOE. However, I also like Incendiary Bombs, Acid Bombs and EMP bombs against the appropriate enemies if they clump up. Bombs are more expensive to make than grenades, but the larger AOE is worth it.

[wortkarg]

Originally posted by frdnwsm:

Psionics later in their development are seriously OP. Give them advanced Psi amps and skills like Domination, Stasis (take that Gatekeeper out of the action) and Void Rift and watch them run amok.

I wouldn't say that psionics are OP. All classes in LW2 are good balanced, every class has their own strengths and weaknesses. Psi op is a very good support class, but they are not the damage-dealers. They can do some guaranteed damage, but not that much and not that often. Rangers for example can shoot x3 per turn with Rapid Fire, assaults can do a lot of damage, remove OW and disable enemies by stunning them for 1-2 turns, support grenadiers can stun half the enemies with sting grenades etc. In addition, psi ops appear later and require more investment (building + scientists).

[frdnwsm]

Oh sure, they do require some work. However, I have seen some players question whether the effort is worth it, and it is, IMO. Soul fire can do up to 8 guaranteed damage, and is useful as a coup-de-gras. Void Rift can be used the same way. Bastion provides group immunity to grenades and rockets. Null Lance is another damage dealer.

Basically, whether I bring a Psi-op along depends on what I think I'll be facing; they aren't too good vs robotic enemies. I have noticed that Facility attacks often have a clump of 5-6 MECs all together; a Specialist with good hacking skills and a Grenadier with a couple of EMP bombs are much more useful in such a case.

[wortkarg]

Originally posted by frdnwsm:

Oh sure, they do require some work. However, I have seen some players question whether the effort is worth it, and it is, IMO.

I agree, they are definitely worth it.

Originally posted by frdnwsm:

Basically, whether I bring a Psi-op along depends on what I think I'll be facing; they aren't too good vs robotic enemies. I have noticed that Facility attacks often have a clump of 5-6 MECs all together; a Specialist with good hacking skills and a Grenadier with a couple of EMP bombs are much more useful in such a case.

I'm not a fan of EMP bombs, because they are very situational. There are better options imho, especially for grenadiers. Sting grenades can stun MECs (and disorient with BS). Disoriented MECs are not that scary, they can't use the micro missiles and their accuracy noticeably drops. I only use EMP Bombs if i know, that there are large MEC pods (e.g. UFO mission) and mostly on a non-grenadier soldier.