Wait, AP rounds where broken?

[Welp]

i wasn't aware of thus, what exactly was happening with em?

[SylenThunder]

Basically they weren't functioning. AP rounds haven't been useful for a while now. The AP part wasn't doing the AP thing.

[seven]

Well, apparently they "fixed" them by nerfing the HP ammo to the point they do no damage at all. I just ran a test, spawning in Demos and giving them one shot to the back of the head with a .44. Regular ammo did 202 damage. AP rounds gave 273 damage. HP ammo gave 0 damage. I repeated this 10 times each and the numbers were consistent.

[Shurenai]

Originally posted by seven:

Well, apparently they "fixed" them by nerfing the HP ammo to the point they do no damage at all. I just ran a test, spawning in Demos and giving them one shot to the back of the head with a .44. Regular ammo did 202 damage. AP rounds gave 273 damage. HP ammo gave 0 damage. I repeated this 10 times each and the numbers were consistent.

I mean, The HP ammo is supposed to be used against fleshy targets....You're shooting at the most well armored target in the game. HP rounds never should've done any much if damage through armor to begin with.

[seven]

So, HP ammo should do zero damage to them? Even if you shoot their bare arms?

Now, I can see significantly less damage, but 0? If I understand it right, for HP magnum ammo target armor should give 90% protection. So the rounds should still do 10% damage when shooting the armored bits. The arms with no armor should not get that protection and we should be able to dismember them.

[Shurenai]

Originally posted by seven:

So, HP ammo should do zero damage to them? Even if you shoot their bare arms?

Now, I can see significantly less damage, but 0? If I understand it right, for HP magnum ammo target armor should give 90% protection. So the rounds should still do 10% damage when shooting the armored bits. The arms with no armor should not get that protection and we should be able to dismember them.

*Shrugs* Against actually armored spots? Yeah, HP basically shouldn't do a thing. HP rounds are designed to break up on impact and deal maximum damage to soft targets; Unfortunately, this fracture-on-impact also kills any kind of penetration power against any kind of armor, and even loses a fair chunk of impact power against hard targets just because a good chunk of the energy goes to deformation, deflection, heat generation, etc.

Against a human it'd still hurt like a ♥♥♥♥♥ if it hit through armor- Maybe break a rib if it hits the right spot at the right angle. But to a zombie that doesn't care much about pain, Not so effective.

I haven't been in since the patch to do any testing myself. Maybe they broke HP while fixing AP; Iuno. I'm just saying that previously, HP didn't give a crap about armor, and AP didn't apply it's armor piercing benefits at all; And so the defacto best choice was HP in all situations as it did more damage in every situation, even to armored targets.

[Welp]

i saw a video when they first came out which showed that he AP ammo pierced zombies which in effect did double damage. and im certain this was working cause my AP rounds would shred whole mobs.

i pretty much save all my brass for AP rounds because of that.

[Shurenai]

Originally posted by Man Emperor of Mankind:

i saw a video when they first came out which showed that he AP ammo pierced zombies which in effect did double damage. and im certain this was working cause my AP rounds would shred whole mobs.

i pretty much save all my brass for AP rounds because of that.

AP rounds did and still do pierce targets when in the right weapon type. But aside from the piercing effect they also were supposed to reduce the targets effective armor and deal more damage to armored targets.

[seven]

Ok, maybe I'm not understanding some of the stats. What does "Target Armor +90%" mean?

[Shurenai]

Originally posted by seven:

Ok, maybe I'm not understanding some of the stats. What does "Target Armor +90%" mean?

Target armor +90% means a 90% increase to the targets armor.

This would equate to one of two things:
1) A 90% increase of existing armor; EG: If the target had 50% armor, a 90% increase would be 45% additional armor totaling 95%
2) A 90% addition to armor, Meaning if the target has 50% armor, then the 90% additional would make it 140%, since it exceeds 100%, no damage would be taken.

Most likely it's scenario 1 though.

Iirc armor functions regardless of whether or not the armor piece itself is actually hit- If you wear 3 pieces of armor, leaving your boots off to wear running shoes and have 50 armor rating from it, it wont matter even if something hits your feet; you'll still take 50% less damage from it. I think it functions the same for zombies. Demo's have a huge amount of armor compared to most other enemies, the +90% could easily push them over the threshold to take no damage at all from HP rounds.

[Amanoob105]

Huh. Good to know, as I hadn't been making them yet as more zombies seems to not have armor than ones that did.

Do HP rounds still do their job or have I been wasting resources on them?

[seven]

The HP rounds are still good for everything except Demos and Soldiers. Bikers and football players do take damage so their "armor" isn't as good I guess. Of course I was minutes away from a horde when 19.4 dropped and I had a ton of HP ammo, no AP.

[Welp]

i just been using AP rounds myself for the purely piercing effect, cause in said video it showed that while the HP rounds did more damage (basically 75 damage to a 100 health target) the AP rounds did 50 damage to a 100 health target x2 equaling 100 damage cause it could pierce one zombie.

i only used these in horde nights though, and saved salvaged ammo for exploring and looting.