Building Problem with Wood

[Yosh]

So, while playing earlier today I ran into a somewhat frustrating issue regarding the player made wood blocks/frames.

If you could imagine: I was building an 8x8x1 block wooden foundation, ontop of 5 stilts several feet of the ground. Each stilt was 1x1 thick and supported an outside corner, except for the middle which was 2x2. On top of this foundation, I started making a 7x7 room.

The problem occured as I was working on the second layer of the wall of the 7x7 room. Suddenly, the whole structure collapsed while building, except for the stilts. All the wooden frames had been upgraded/reinforced, and the structure easily survived my weight untill its collapse. A zombie within a nightime horde knocked down one of the stilts as well, which did not bother the structure either.

What happened? In the current version of the game, do wooden structures have a specific weight limit? Is it a bug? The structure had collapsed previously seemingly randomly on my first attempt to build the foundation.



Now, mind you I am not new to this game. I find this issue/bug gamebreaking for me, as its random nature prevents me from making early-game structures, which are vital to gameplay for me.

[Chaoslink]

Well its hard to say specifically, but I've never had an issue following one simple rule.

ALWAYS place a support beam every 3rd block. So a 10 block long side would have a support at 1,4,7 and 10. This includes the middle as well.

By doing this, you ensure that the support is evenly distributed so that you minimize the chances for any structural failures. I believe more tweaking will go into place as the alpha progresses, but for now, you may have to use things like this as a workaround until those improvements come. I know there are weight limits and it helps to have supports under your walls more frequently than the corners, but I don't know any numbers to give you specifics. Which is good, because people often use those numbers to be as efficient as possible which just means any damage at all has the potential to compromise the entire structure.

[Yosh]

That is useful advice, thank you. I am still baffled and curious as to how the event occured though. If I remember correctly, wooden blocks will support up to 5 blocks in one direction. I have always exploited this concept, even with dirt, to build 'raised' buildings with supports wide enough apart that zombies would more likely ignore/pass under.

I am aware of the effectiveness of sloped walls when it comes to 'horde-proofing', but I'd like to salvage what is in-game now.

[Jᴧgᴧ]

Munch's advice is good - I sometimes go every 2nd block (1, 3, 5, etc) when building something which is going to support a lot of weight, or which I want to be able to lose 1 support on without failing.

[zoikwild]

Do you have a hollowed out room underground? I'm guessing it's because you tried making a 7x7 on top of an 8x8 room. You ended up creating a wall that's not supported all the way to the ground,

[Yosh]

Originally posted by zoikwild:

Do you have a hollowed out room underground? I'm guessing it's because you tried making a 7x7 on top of an 8x8 room. You ended up creating a wall that's not supported all the way to the ground,

8x8x1 floor sitting on supports, with a 7x7 room built ontop of it. I'v done similar many times before, but perhaps not to the same dimensions.

[Yosh]

I'm under the impression that it is related to a recent patch. It might be worth mentioning that the structure collapsed while I was setting down wooden frames to create the second layer of the 7x7's walls.

[S-P]

Wood frame has a 4 factor, meaning you can extend it out 3 blocks and then the 4th one will collaspe. You need to make sure the third block has a support beam. The roof you can usually get away with if you don't actually stand on it.

[Buz]

Also make sure your support beams run vertically all the way to the ground. ie even if a structure is stable by itself, building another layer on top can be too much for it to take if the supports don't line up.

[Qinji]

http://www.twitch.tv/qinji/b/579719807

I made a video that I hope will help some of you with how structural stability works in the game.

basically look at each block's mass and the max load and do the math of how much mass a certain block can hold laterelly.

[Qinji]

xav, the reason why your structure collapsed was because each pillar was holding more than it's max load, assuming it's wood, the total mass carried by each pillar exceeded 36. This mass applies to more than just the beam, anything loaded on top of the beam applies to it's mass.

stone items generally carry 90, while metal items can carry 320. Note that cobblestone is considered metal because of it's rebar frame.

The above is "generally" and not a rule, check the item's rollover info for details on how much it can hold and it's mass

[Yosh]

Originally posted by Qinji:

xav, the reason why your structure collapsed was because each pillar was holding more than it's max load, assuming it's wood, the total mass carried by each pillar exceeded 36. This mass applies to more than just the beam, anything loaded on top of the beam applies to it's mass.

stone items generally carry 90, while metal items can carry 320. Note that cobblestone is considered metal because of it's rebar frame.

The above is "generally" and not a rule, check the item's rollover info for details on how much it can hold and it's mass

That makes sense. Thank you. Thats just what I needed to know. I appreciate all of the input.

[Jeremiahk (FK)]

I was setting up a base in the 0,0 hab in one of the ruins that has the central stair case going up to the second level "mezzanine" that has railing around it.

Well during our wall upgrade process I thought I'd knock out one of the broken stone blocks that has metal sticking out of it that was one side of the stairs landing. Well as soon as I popped the block out the whole bloody roof...well what was left of it came down.. and burried me. LOL.

I still have minecraft mechanis in my head. NExt time I'll put up a temp rig to remove it.

[Kickz]

Each block has a value for mass and maxload. those values are very very,..very important when building structures.

Fully upgraded wood frames (Reinforced Wood) have a Mass of 6 and MaxLoad of 36, resulting in a Structural Integrity value of 6.

Originally posted by http://7daystodie.gamepedia.com/Structural_Integrity:

Structural Integrity = RoundDown ( Max Load / Mass )

This means that you can only directly attach 6 more blocks of the same mass (6 in this case) on either side of the block before the structure collapses.
Unless off course before the 6th you attach to another pillar or another structure etc..

Be very careful when attaching other block types or items, such as ladders to blocks as that all adds to the mass and can cause the structure to collapse.

Even walking or jumping on top of a structure you have just about balanced will collapse if your body weight adds to much mass. I do not know what mass value the character body has but it definitely has one.

Say you accidentally attach a rebar frame to a row which already has 3 wood frames then it will collapse as rebar frames have a mass of 20 + the other 3 wood frames each with a mass of 6 equals 38, going 2 above the limit.

Obviously a lot of the structural integrity can be balanced of if you have every 4-5 blocks a pillar to divide the load with, etc..

Also, going higher does add some mass, even if it is little, meaning that at some point building a square structure upwards continuously will eventually collapse it unless you have proper support beams among them.

Also note that you cannot "cheat" :)

Say you have the first block a a rebar frame, which has a mass load of 320 and a mass of 20. It can hold 16 frames before it collapses. If you think you can now attach 16 or more wood frames to that as each of those only have a mass of 6 then you would be in for a surprise as the structural integrity continues from the last placed block, meaning the first wood frame you attach to a rebar frame only allows a max load of 36 negating the 320 maxLoad of the rebar frame.

Anyway, you can get all the information on structural integrity from here:
http://7daystodie.gamepedia.com/Structural_Integrity

Also, clicking on any of the detail links on an item on that wiki will show you how mass, maxLoad, etc.. is all calculated too:
http://7daystodie.gamepedia.com/Rebar_Frame

Very important statistics to know when you want to build more complex structures.

[Cepinari]

I'm lazy, so I'll just use stone for everything and not think about it.

[Lerch Addams]

When you first start building, place a block on the ground then place the same material on top of it.

Then build out laterally from the second block with the same material and count how many units you can stick together until your sideways L shape collapses.

This is a "no math" way of determining how many units you can build out before a collapse.

The safest buildings are a 7x7 box structure with a 5 unit span between vertical support columns.

Another good way of learning for the impatient on what is doable is to scout a wasteland city and take notes on the buildings there.

Build simple at first.
Load it down with waste material you can afford to lose.
Then get more complex.