Zombies and Children.

[SniperWolfMGS]

Saw a locked thread kinda touch on this. Didn't read all of it. Someone necro'ed it 6 years. So just FYI I'm not trying keep that thread going.

But it did get me thinking. What exactly is the deal with zombies and children. Most games don't address it by just assuming adults birth more adults? I know Dead Island caught some flak for a commercial featuring a zombie kid.

I personally would assume that zombies would just see them as sliders compared to the other hamburgers...

[Hellsmoke]

Honestly I think this topic is stupid. Either we make mature games for adults or we don't because any adult should be mature enough to distinguish a game from reality. If this is not the case then that sounds like a personal problem to me.

This goes for all censorship in games.

Fact is killing a kid in a video game is no worse than killing anyone else in a video game. In fact, we do a lot worse than kill kids in video games. This is all just virtue signalling to me and it doesn't signal virtue imo but I digress.

[jswilliams]

Dead Space "Hold my beer."

[JimmyIowa]

Notions of virtue and maturity aside, the point is TFP includes in the game what will be fun for the majority playerbase. They are still adding new enemies now. But when they go through the effort of new skins, animations, sounds, and AI packages, they add things like gun toting bandits and Demolitions zombies. That's probably what (most) people prefer over children.

Game, fun, challenge. It's honestly not a difficult concept. Even for obviously enlightened people. ;)

[Hellsmoke]

JimmyIowa の投稿を引用：

Notions of virtue and maturity aside, the point is TFP includes in the game what will be fun for the majority playerbase. They are still adding new enemies now. But when they go through the effort of new skins, animations, sounds, and AI packages, they add things like gun toting bandits and Demolitions zombies. That's probably what (most) people prefer over children.

Game, fun, challenge. It's honestly not a difficult concept. Even for obviously enlightened people. ;)

I don't expect TFP to reinvent the wheel or to be the one champion who stands up to ridiculous virtue signalling I mentioned because this goes beyond gaming. I was talking about the hypocrisy of humanity in general. It's okay to destroy whole worlds and play war games killing hundreds of thousands of people but God forbid you show a boob or a kid. This is hypocrisy and the irony just jumps in your face if you are enlightened.

I'm not asking TFP to add children because I really don't care. I'm just pointing out how ridiculous people are with these issues.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6FmwBPDT-w

Edit: To clarify..if there is any moral argument to be had for not killing kids in games that same argument applies to everything else you kill in a game.

[KippenKaasBaas]

SylenThunder の投稿を引用：

Crater Creator の投稿を引用：

What’s an example of a country that would block sales?

This is a short list off the top of my head, and is not conclusive. Surprisingly, there are fewer that would have an issue with crack being added.

• United Kingdom
  
• Germany
  
• Netherlands
  
• Venezuela
  
• New Zealand
  
• Australia
  
• Saudi Arabia

Note for Australia: last time I had a discussion with someone about this there, it seemed like it would be a bit on the fence as to whether it was allowed or not. Was leaning towards not being permitted, though may be allowed depending on how the content is presented in-game.

I'm afraid you're wrong about at least a few of them.
Countries like Germany and the Netherlands are part of the European Union. And we live by their rules on many matters. Drugs is not a problem in the Netherlands at all. Games, books, videogames, and TV shows have no problem with showing or mentioning drug use.
Also in the Netherlands we don't block sales of Steam games. Even Postal 2 is available on Steam in the Netherlands. And that game is one of the most banned games ever.

[lPaladinl]

Hellsmoke77 の投稿を引用：

Edit: To clarify..if there is any moral argument to be had for not killing kids in games that same argument applies to everything else you kill in a game.

Pretty much how I felt when Dead Space censored their Zombie Babies by making them Zombie Dogs instead. The intent and disturbing nature of killing them is the same regardless, but somehow the idea censorship proposes is that it's somehow more palatable to kill a dog than a baby human.

It's just a slippery mud slope of moral failure trying to argue how one is better than the other. Both can be equally as depressing, disturbing or sad.

[BagreMago]

I get why they don't add it.. all the mature rating stuff an all, but if an adult feels bad for killing a 1.4mt game asset that it's supposed to be a zombie kid then it's the player's fault, if your brain can't distinguish a game from what's real then you need to get some help probably.

[JimmyIowa]

RapFa の投稿を引用：

but if an adult feels bad for killing a 1.4mt game asset that it's supposed to be a zombie kid then it's the player's fault, if your brain can't distinguish a game from what's real then you need to get some help probably.

It's the same reason society and most people (but not all, as we see here) would prefer not to have sexualized depictions of fictional game assets that fictionally appear to be under a reasonable age. Yes, even though it is just a fictional image. Even though you don't get that. And we know you don't get it. It's just a fictional game asset, right? It's all good according to you, right? (Hint - this is the part where you post again and start backpedalling away from what you just said.)

Hate to break it to you, but for psychologically healthy people, it has nothing to do with not being able to distinguish a game from reality.

I have my own opinion about who here needs some very extensive behavioural help. It definitely isn't me.

[BagreMago]

JimmyIowa の投稿を引用：

RapFa の投稿を引用：

but if an adult feels bad for killing a 1.4mt game asset that it's supposed to be a zombie kid then it's the player's fault, if your brain can't distinguish a game from what's real then you need to get some help probably.

It's the same reason society and most people (but not all, as we see here) would prefer not to have sexualized depictions of fictional game assets that fictionally appear to be under a reasonable age. Yes, even though it is just a fictional image. Even though you don't get that. And we know you don't get it. It's just a fictional game asset, right? It's all good according to you, right? (Hint - this is the part where you post again and start backpedalling away from what you just said.)

Hate to break it to you, but for psychologically healthy people, it has nothing to do with not being able to distinguish a game from reality.

I have my own opinion about who here needs some very extensive behavioural help. It definitely isn't me.

Are you really going from killing zombie kids in 7 days to die to sexualizing minors and still dares to say that i have a problem, holy f..? Ok then, good luck on your life dude, your mind is def healthy!

Also, it's funny that you have this opinion about zombie kids, i wonder how do you feel killing hundreds of zombos in horde nights? I can only assume you scream "I'M SORRY" while crying your tears out having to kills so many poor bastards in a video game!

Zombie kids are common ground on movies, and games like dead space bring creepy monster babies to the party and it was really scary/fun to fight those guys.

So don't come here with this creepy attitude, i will not even say what you look like.

EDIT: Feel free to answer however you want, the creepiness of your comparison in your first answer was enough for me to prove my point so i'm not gonna keep arguing with a creepy godknows what like you.

[JimmyIowa]

Um, no. YOU are the one who made the blanket statement that all game art fictional images are all okay because they aren't "reality". Not me. All I did is point out how weird that is.

Look, the point is that art can elicit an emotional response. That's what art is. (Go ahead and look up the definition of art now). And a lot of art is fictional. This means that fictional images can and mostly DO elicit emotional responses in healthy adults. This entire pretense that adults should have no emotional response to digitally generated art is just, well, forgive my bluntness, laughably stupid. And everyone here knows it. Except you.

Art elicits an emotional response in healthy adults. Period. That's simply flat out not arguable. Sorry. Honestly I am. You are wrong, and you sound psychologically unhealthy. And I mean that earnestly.

The art assets in this game are, well, art. A person pretending they are so above it all that digitally rendered art can't elicit an emotional response in them isn't being "enlightened". Honestly, I promise. It's someone being either a) a liar, or b) a narcissistic sociopath. One or the other. There's no third choice.

Simply put - Everything you have said so far about adults reactions to images is factually wrong. That's a fact. Sorry. :(

RapFa の投稿を引用：

Also, it's funny that you have this opinion about zombie kids but why do you feel nothing killing hundreds of zombos in horde nights? I can only assume you screaming "I'M SORRY" while crying your tears out having to kills so many poor bastards in a video game!

I never said I felt nothing about other zombies. You keep making things up about me and then inventing fantasies about me playing. Everyone can see that's literally true.
It's what you just did. And your fantasies me when I play the game are disturbing, in themselves.

[BagreMago]

Fine then, i'm a narcissist sociopath for laughing my ars off when exploding heads in horde nights.. or maybe i'm a liar that cries every night before sleeping thinking about the sins i've committed against the poor zombos on my 7DTD world, who knows! You're def right!

EDIT: forgot to mention but i'm actually a full psycopath for getting happy after killing those babies in dead space, yes i'm a baby murderer, oh no..

[Cozzy]

I can vouch for the game being banned in Australia if kids were in it.... There is some seriously F'd up BS that goes on here, we had to FIGHT and FIGHT and FIGHT to even get an R18 rating for games (in the past MA15 was it for games, anything "worse" was basically banned AKA unclassified) but even since we got that R18 rating for games there have been many games refused classification because some mother makes the decisions and she is too weak to tell her 10 year old NO! :( if the game says 15 or 18+ that should be the end of it..... but parents who expect the rest of the world to raise their kids object :(

[BagreMago]

Cozzy の投稿を引用：

I can vouch for the game being banned in Australia if kids were in it.... There is some seriously F'd up BS that goes on here, we had to FIGHT and FIGHT and FIGHT to even get an R18 rating for games (in the past MA15 was it for games, anything "worse" was basically banned AKA unclassified) but even since we got that R18 rating for games there have been many games refused classification because some mother makes the decisions and she is too weak to tell her 10 year old NO! :( if the game says 15 or 18+ that should be the end of it..... but parents who expect the rest of the world to raise their kids object :(

That sucks.. something similar happened where i live, it's way better nowadays, i'm can only hope it will get better in your place, having an authority banning games that are fine for +18 is just silly.

[Orange Joe]

JimmyIowa の投稿を引用：

The art assets in this game are, well, art. A person pretending they are so above it all that digitally rendered art can't elicit an emotional response in them isn't being "enlightened". Honestly, I promise. It's someone being either a) a liar, or b) a narcissistic sociopath. One or the other. There's no third choice.

I love how you explained this out in a very educated manner, Jimmy. The majority of us know that while, yes, it is JUST a game, it IS however made by REAL people who are REALLY making these things. To pretend like none of it effects us in any way simply because it's fiction is just ridiculous.
Anyone else feel like a disturbingly growing amount of gamers seem to be sliding into option B as a permanent mindset?

[Hellsmoke]

Kenny Blankenship の投稿を引用：

it IS however made by REAL people who are REALLY making these things. To pretend like none of it effects us in any way simply because it's fiction is just ridiculous.

What does that even mean "made by REAL people who are REALLY making these things"? This is where I get a little bent out of shape when I ponder the fact that laws and rules are made by which I have to live because some person somewhere feels some way despite reality being something completely different. It's a game, pixels can not be hurt. Period. How you feel about something in that game is your personal opinion. Doesn't matter if it's baby pixels, dog pixels or any other kind of pixel.

Yes, like everything else in the world games are made by real people. This does not address the hypocrisy shown while you're slaughtering everything under the sun and then decide to complain when a kid is shown.

You are picking and choosing what you want to get upset about while losing track of reality and from the outside it looks very hypocritical.