Skills/ Perks rework needed!?

[Nadeltrauma]

The arrangement of the skills and perks doesn't work at all and urgently needs an overhaul.

Every player is dependent on crafts, medicine and vehicles, but unfortunately everything is rooted in the int tree, which increases the chance of finding the important books.
But that makes absolutely no sense for players who want to skill for strength/tank right from the start.

My idea is this... out with the Strength, Int and Agility system
and a direct system with the divisions listed below

Firearms
Close combat
Survive
Business
mechanics

You shouldn't necessarily have to skill up in intelligence before you get access to various bonuses in, for example, vehicles. But a direct bonus if, for example, I skill the pistol in the Firearms perk.

Further thoughts or suggestions:
Point 1: Exchange books or make them craftable if you desperately want to hold on to books. My preference would be to be able to buy books but level up in the free world by using skills. Example, I'm dismantling a vehicle and getting closer to my dream of crafting one.
Point 2: I don't want to be forced into weapon combos by the perks. I choose a close-up or shooting weapon and these should then be buffed directly with my skill points.
Point 3: Skilling a supercategory such as strength to improve cooking rarely feels stupid. The points for the super category are gone and the direct category is more expensive but also more rewarding.
Example: the bonuses in the vehicle category are way too poor and you're just skilling this nonsense to get more books and that's clearly the wrong approach.
Point 4: Traps and electronics should be a natural part of the craft. Skill points in these categories make things better, stronger, cheaper and more efficient but please don't let me have to skill it so that the books drop in order to be able to build a trap at all.


I know that you can reskill and end up with enough points for the important perks, but the system feels completely wrong at both ends.

Sry for my worst englisch

[Macdallan]

Escrito originalmente por Voxel:

The way the weapon/tool mods work in this game is super trivial and offers little to no 'buildability' the most interesting thing you can do as far as mods go is have a bigger magazine size and choose whether or not you want a silencer. What would be far more interesting is if there were modular attachment "parts", like 2 laser sights for example to have far more tight accuracy at the expense of an extra slot. 2 drum mags forming a C-mag for rifles and even the 9mm pistol, a reflex sight stacking with scopes and allowing you to switch between them when aiming, etc. It'd also be sick if there were skills/abilities with weapons, like rapid firing arrows or firing 3 arrows at once in a 30 degree arc, etc.

The current mod system is very limited just like the linear book/magazine based learning system, the perk and stat system, the new armour system, trader mission tier and new trader quest systems, and nearly everything else. It's how TFP have chosen to make the game - everything is over simplified, uninspired, and kind of boring...

[Korintheblack]

Escrito originalmente por Macdallan:

Escrito originalmente por Voxel:

The way the weapon/tool mods work in this game is super trivial and offers little to no 'buildability' the most interesting thing you can do as far as mods go is have a bigger magazine size and choose whether or not you want a silencer. What would be far more interesting is if there were modular attachment "parts", like 2 laser sights for example to have far more tight accuracy at the expense of an extra slot. 2 drum mags forming a C-mag for rifles and even the 9mm pistol, a reflex sight stacking with scopes and allowing you to switch between them when aiming, etc. It'd also be sick if there were skills/abilities with weapons, like rapid firing arrows or firing 3 arrows at once in a 30 degree arc, etc.

The current mod system is very limited just like the linear book/magazine based learning system, the perk and stat system, the new armour system, trader mission tier and new trader quest systems, and nearly everything else. It's how TFP have chosen to make the game - everything is over simplified, uninspired, and kind of boring...

The weapon mods have ALWAYS been limited. Maybe they'll add in some more or more interesting ones.

[Macdallan]

Escrito originalmente por Czernobog:

99% of this game is magical. It's fiction. Nitpicking over the armor/weapons not being realistic is entirely pointless.

I bonk a truck with a wrench and magically get batteries and engines. I can magically cut down trees with a rock on a stick, and magically process all that lumber while standing in a field. Making blocks out of wood to jump on, by itself, is pure magic. Digging a big hole for experience, gain a skill and now i can get double from plants. I shoot a bunch of zombies and i can magically get better trader deals.

Armor that buffs certain aspects isn't "off the rails" unless you're blind to the context of the entire game. It's clearly a goofy game made for fun and action/adventure. Blasting zombies, looting a deal civilization, and doing what you please. You go to incredible lengths to ignore much of the context of the game to suit your subjective claims (which you think aren't opinions, for some reason)

What you seem to hate is fiction in general. Even Zomboid, the closet zombie apocalypse simulator you could get, still has character progression that turns you into a demi-god. Why do you play games?

It's okay if you don't get it. Some of us do. We'll keep speaking out against this disaster until TFP listen to us or until a modder steps up to do what TFP should have done.

[Macdallan]

Escrito originalmente por Korintheblack:

The weapon mods have ALWAYS been limited.

Prove it.

[Somnion]

Escrito originalmente por Macdallan:

Escrito originalmente por Korintheblack:

The weapon mods have ALWAYS been limited.

Prove it.

This is rich coming from you.

https://7daystodie.fandom.com/wiki/Version_history#cite_note-28

https://7daystodie.com/a17-early-streaming-release-notes/ This is when mods were added, as far as i can tell.

[Macdallan]

Escrito originalmente por Czernobog:

This is rich coming from you.

Another deflection via one-liner. Shocking.

[Mithrandir]

Escrito originalmente por Macdallan:

Escrito originalmente por Czernobog:

99% of this game is magical. It's fiction. Nitpicking over the armor/weapons not being realistic is entirely pointless.

I bonk a truck with a wrench and magically get batteries and engines. I can magically cut down trees with a rock on a stick, and magically process all that lumber while standing in a field. Making blocks out of wood to jump on, by itself, is pure magic. Digging a big hole for experience, gain a skill and now i can get double from plants. I shoot a bunch of zombies and i can magically get better trader deals.

Armor that buffs certain aspects isn't "off the rails" unless you're blind to the context of the entire game. It's clearly a goofy game made for fun and action/adventure. Blasting zombies, looting a deal civilization, and doing what you please. You go to incredible lengths to ignore much of the context of the game to suit your subjective claims (which you think aren't opinions, for some reason)

What you seem to hate is fiction in general. Even Zomboid, the closet zombie apocalypse simulator you could get, still has character progression that turns you into a demi-god. Why do you play games?

It's okay if you don't get it. Some of us do. We'll keep speaking out against this disaster until TFP listen to us or until a modder steps up to do what TFP should have done.

And if you really wanted to be heard by TFP instead of arguing with other players who disagree with you, you'd post in the official forum where TFP can read what you have to say.

Until then, all you're doing here is arguing with any player who dare like what you dislike.

I'm absolutely convinced they won't change the skill system at this point. But if they do, I would have no problem whatsoever to adapt to a new one. So, I'm indifferent to this crusade. What I'm saying is talk to TFP, you'll see if it works. Here, it certainly won't.

[Nadeltrauma]

Too many construction sites are opening here now.

The equipment sets feel like a good thing for a new player but still need some fine tuning. Some full set bonuses are too weak to require a set as such.

Armor and weapon mods need to be revised. Some I'm allowed to use, some I'm not allowed to use. Some are boring and pointless, others are too good. Fine tuning necessary.

But the skill system and the stupid search for magazines for crafts and vehicles don't fit at all into a system where resource farming and crafting are an important part.

Especially since in 99% of cases I will buy or find a better product before I can make a weaker version. The best example is a nail gun or screwdriver. I was never able to build a 1-series nail gun, but I already had a 3-series one available from loot or dealers. This is not acceptable.

I just want a good combination of loot in Poi or purchasable books and the possibility of farming cars or devices to make the craft more rounded. As well as an adjustment to the skill trees

[Somnion]

Escrito originalmente por Nadeltrauma:

Too many construction sites are opening here now.

The equipment sets feel like a good thing for a new player but still need some fine tuning. Some full set bonuses are too weak to require a set as such.

Armor and weapon mods need to be revised. Some I'm allowed to use, some I'm not allowed to use. Some are boring and pointless, others are too good. Fine tuning necessary.

But the skill system and the stupid search for magazines for crafts and vehicles don't fit at all into a system where resource farming and crafting are an important part.

Especially since in 99% of cases I will buy or find a better product before I can make a weaker version. The best example is a nail gun or screwdriver. I was never able to build a 1-series nail gun, but I already had a 3-series one available from loot or dealers. This is not acceptable.

I guess we'll take your word for it.

[Nadeltrauma]

Escrito originalmente por Mithrandir:

Escrito originalmente por Macdallan:

It's okay if you don't get it. Some of us do. We'll keep speaking out against this disaster until TFP listen to us or until a modder steps up to do what TFP should have done.

And if you really wanted to be heard by TFP instead of arguing with other players who disagree with you, you'd post in the official forum where TFP can read what you have to say.

Until then, all you're doing here is arguing with any player who dare like what you dislike.

I'm absolutely convinced they won't change the skill system at this point. But if they do, I would have no problem whatsoever to adapt to a new one. So, I'm indifferent to this crusade. What I'm saying is talk to TFP, you'll see if it works. Here, it certainly won't.

This exchange is important to see if you are the only one who has such a stomach ache and to listen to ideas from others.
Unfortunately, the fact that there are players who answer with three words “everything is fine” or “I’ve never seen anything better” is also part of it. I would also prefer that new ideas come here and the exchange would be a little more pleasant because actually we all just want to have a good time while gaming.

[Korintheblack]

Escrito originalmente por Nadeltrauma:

Escrito originalmente por Mithrandir:

And if you really wanted to be heard by TFP instead of arguing with other players who disagree with you, you'd post in the official forum where TFP can read what you have to say.

Until then, all you're doing here is arguing with any player who dare like what you dislike.

I'm absolutely convinced they won't change the skill system at this point. But if they do, I would have no problem whatsoever to adapt to a new one. So, I'm indifferent to this crusade. What I'm saying is talk to TFP, you'll see if it works. Here, it certainly won't.

This exchange is important to see if you are the only one who has such a stomach ache and to listen to ideas from others.
Unfortunately, the fact that there are players who answer with three words “everything is fine” or “I’ve never seen anything better” is also part of it. I would also prefer that new ideas come here and the exchange would be a little more pleasant because actually we all just want to have a good time while gaming.

Provide more than "everything isn't fine" in rebuttal to "everything is fine" and people will stop saying it.

[Somnion]

Escrito originalmente por Korintheblack:

Escrito originalmente por Nadeltrauma:

This exchange is important to see if you are the only one who has such a stomach ache and to listen to ideas from others.
Unfortunately, the fact that there are players who answer with three words “everything is fine” or “I’ve never seen anything better” is also part of it. I would also prefer that new ideas come here and the exchange would be a little more pleasant because actually we all just want to have a good time while gaming.

Provide more than "everything isn't fine" in rebuttal to "everything is fine" and people will stop saying it.

Exactly. If you aren't willing to be wrong or see anything from a different perspective, then this isn't a discussion. It's a glorified diary entry. If you want to make claims, then at the very least present ANY supporting information we can discuss. Opinion vs opinion will lead nowhere.

Gamers make heavy claims like "these systems are bad/broken/flawed and should be fixed/changed" and when you ask why all you get is "because i said so". It's gross.

It's like walking up to a bunch of dudes building a house, elbowing the wood beams and going "Gee look how bad this is, yall are using wood? You should build this out of marble, it'd be better if you did that." You'd get a hammer flung at you.

[Nadeltrauma]

Escrito originalmente por Korintheblack:

Escrito originalmente por Nadeltrauma:

This exchange is important to see if you are the only one who has such a stomach ache and to listen to ideas from others.
Unfortunately, the fact that there are players who answer with three words “everything is fine” or “I’ve never seen anything better” is also part of it. I would also prefer that new ideas come here and the exchange would be a little more pleasant because actually we all just want to have a good time while gaming.

Provide more than "everything isn't fine" in rebuttal to "everything is fine" and people will stop saying it.

Enough examples have been shown why something feels wrong or out of place. The answer to this “everything is fine” or “do it this way and that so that it will be fine” are not arguments. Either you have real arguments to support the system as the best or you leave the discussion and play your "everything is fine world" - why blow up a discussion if you are happy with everyone?

[Korintheblack]

Escrito originalmente por Nadeltrauma:

Escrito originalmente por Korintheblack:

Provide more than "everything isn't fine" in rebuttal to "everything is fine" and people will stop saying it.

Enough examples have been shown why something feels wrong or out of place. The answer to this “everything is fine” or “do it this way and that so that it will be fine” are not arguments. Either you have real arguments to support the system as the best or you leave the discussion and play your "everything is fine world" - why blow up a discussion if you are happy with everyone?

I have yet to see any examples. Just very insistant "im right youre wrong" posts.

Nothing wrong with magazine progression, armor can use some tweaks but isnt the end of the world. Game could use more weapon mods.

[Nadeltrauma]

Escrito originalmente por Korintheblack:

Escrito originalmente por Nadeltrauma:

Enough examples have been shown why something feels wrong or out of place. The answer to this “everything is fine” or “do it this way and that so that it will be fine” are not arguments. Either you have real arguments to support the system as the best or you leave the discussion and play your "everything is fine world" - why blow up a discussion if you are happy with everyone?

I have yet to see any examples. Just very insistant "im right youre wrong" posts.

Nothing wrong with magazine progression, armor can use some tweaks but isnt the end of the world. Game could use more weapon mods.

The magazine system can't be good if I get most of the items through loot or dealers before I can even craft them in the weakest version