Why Did My Fortress Fall Apart???

[Skorne Tet'Zu]

My Fortress just came Crashing down. In a nutshell here is what I did:

I built a Fortress over the water. I started with 31 Cement Pillars built up from the Lake Floor (15 to the surface, then another 5 above the surface). Note: No pillar was more than 4 blocks from another pillar, though most were 3 blocks from another. Next I built a Cement Platform on the pillars; with the outer most pillars not being exceeded by the platform (No Overhang). Next... 3 blocks inwards of the Platforms edge I build a house with 2 layers cement... and 3 layers Flagstone. Then I built Wooden Walls to separate rooms, as well as to act as support for the second story floor. I then put in Flagstone Stairs, and a wooden second floor (Frames Only). I then began upgrading the wooden floors (one upgrade)... and after roughly 15 to 25... everything collapsed.

Then only thing standing are the pillars and one small section of the platform!!!

What the heck did I do wrong??? I just lost a TON of materials... and I don't even know how many hours of gameplay; and I haven't a clue why it Fell apart.

Any hints... ideas... warnings... Would be Greatly Appreciated.

Advanced Thanx!!!

[Dragorin]

I'd guess that your house SI pillars where not connected "in line" with the Platform SI pillars. You have to build off SI pillars from ground to roof and they must be in-line. You can't build a solid platform and then just willy nilly build on top of it.. if you do your base on top of the platform will most likely not be fully supported and eventually collapse to weight limits.

[CptnHarlock]

Originally posted by Dragorin:

I'd guess that your house SI pillars where not connected "in line" with the Platform SI pillars. You have to build off SI pillars from ground to roof and they must be in-line. You can't build a solid platform and then just willy nilly build on top of it.. if you do your base on top of the platform will most likely not be fully supported and eventually collapse to weight limits.

Good answer. Also use the "wood pole" in a horisontal positin and stick it in all the corners petween pillar and covering ceiling/platforms. They are upgradeble al the way to steel and add quite a lot of support. i always place my pillars 5 apart amd put the supporting poles in between. Havent had a collapse in a long time.

[Samothec]

It sounds like you exceeded the weight limit, especially considering how many layers of cement and flagstone you used. Either cut back on the layers or have more support. A one block pillar with a gap of 3 blocks is very limited support for 5 layers of heavy blocks.

Also, the blocks have a structural support limits. I did tests in 13.8 for the basic blocks I was using by building a short pillar then attaching blocks to the side going out to see when they'd fall. Wood was good out to 7 (collapsed at 8). Cobblestone good out to 6 only. Concrete was good out to 7. Metal trussing was good out to 15.

Yeah, a more vertical construction will hold up better but the blocks have a weight to them too. For wood I wouldn't have more than a 3 block gap. For concrete I'd limit it to 2 blocks. Only 1 block gaps if I was going wild with many layers. Remember the zombies will try to tear your construction out from underneath you so you need to build as if you are missing every other pillar or make the pillars much thicker.

[Dies Fourth]

Concrete is for some reason the worst building matirial in game : (

Our building guy wont allow it unless its fully upgraded to steel. Your better off making scrap frames and upgrading them.

[Wretched Dollie]

And don't forget that sand is really, really easy to break down. If zombies get down there and start smacking sand, it can also make it crumble.

[Sigh-Phi-Guy]

you could build a double thick floor atop the pillars. then you can build "willy nilly" on the platform.

[beerf1y]

Why concrete is bad in your opinion ? For a structure you can maintain and use to keep Zs away is kinda good. Too many stone you need though. Anyway, weight limits are the most possible way after unsecure underground, could be caves underneath and small collapce could trigger bigger one.

[Skorne Tet'Zu]

First and Foremost: Thank you all for your responses... I wasn't aware of much of that; especially that I couldn't just build "Willy Nilly" on top of a platform that was holding... GREAT to Know!!!

On further issues:

Originally posted by Wretched Dollie:

And don't forget that sand is really, really easy to break down. If zombies get down there and start smacking sand, it can also make it crumble.

I was wondering (and worried) about how Zombies dealt with water? Can I now assume they will simply walk underwater and start swinging wildly?? I was planning on building a wall, at the bottom of the lake, around the pillars; but had not considered them damaging the sand underneath; Maybe a Lake Base isn't the answer. Opinions???

Originally posted by sigh-phi-guy:

you could build a double thick floor atop the pillars. then you can build "willy nilly" on the platform.

I may go with a similar plan, but on land; and with a foundation (depending on responses from above); however... either way; can you explain this a bit more for me. Are you saying that with a double floor the structural integrity issue is no longer an issue???

Again... I appreciate everyone's input on this; at the moment, I'm kind of a sitting duck with a partial base on shore... and trying to recoup resouces from the Lake Floor; So these tips are greatly appreciated as I try to get back on my feet: Sucks to be me right now.

[Torriador]

http://7daystodie.gamepedia.com/Structural_Integrity

There used to be a better wiki about SI, but this is a good starting point to get the basics.

A horizontal beam will share some of the load between two vertical pillars, as long as the beam's mass is Less than the Max load from either side, allowing you to place more blocks on top of it.

An area connected by 4 vertical supports will share it's load between all four pillars, as long as the combined SI of the supported blocks is more than the total mass of all connected blocks within the unsupported area. (this is a very crude description)

[Skorne Tet'Zu]

Originally posted by Torriador:

http://7daystodie.gamepedia.com/Structural_Integrity

There used to be a better wiki about SI, but this is a good starting point to get the basics.

A horizontal beam will share some of the load between two vertical pillars, as long as the beam's mass is Less than the Max load from either side, allowing you to place more blocks on top of it.

An area connected by 4 vertical supports will share it's load between all four pillars, as long as the combined SI of the supported blocks is more than the total mass of all connected blocks within the unsupported area. (this is a very crude description)

Are You Bloody Kidding Me?!? Dude, I'm a Gamer... not a Physics Major; Jeez!!! I love a game's realizism, but that's a bit much. I think I need to go back to a basic Wooden Pre-Fab house, and invest in a Good Ol' Fashion Solid Cement Wall around it.

I do appreciate all the Hints and Tips and Such; but I think this is getting a bit more complicated than I'm actually willing to put into it.

[Torriador]

It's really not that hard, it just sounds scarier than it really is.
in basic terms, if your building is heavier than what the horizontal beams can support, it's most likely that it's going to collapse. which is what you experienced.

But don't give up on building your own fortresses, through trial and error, you can achieve some awesome constructs.

[Torriador]

One way to build a base out of regular concrete blocks, try building a 6x6 platfom on top of a concrete pillar at each corner. you can wall off the perimeter of the platform as high as you want, and it will not fall down.
If you want to expand, just join another 6x6 concrete pad, using the same method as you did earlier, but you only need to add the 2 outer pillars this time.
You can keep expanding this way, until you get the desired size that you want. you can even upgrade to reinforced concrete, or steel when you want to

This is how most of the floors in the brick buildings at the hub city are supported.
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=699603534

these are just some of the buildings in the hub that I've been restoring using this method

[Samothec]

Originally posted by skorne_tetzu:

I was wondering (and worried) about how Zombies dealt with water? Can I now assume they will simply walk underwater and start swinging wildly?? I was planning on building a wall, at the bottom of the lake, around the pillars; but had not considered them damaging the sand underneath; Maybe a Lake Base isn't the answer. Opinions???

The zombies can walk underwater.

Generally speaking the zombies will aim for you no matter your distance so if you are on top of a hill but have a wall they can't climb (due to an overhang) they will smash through the wall and dig upwards towards you. If you build inside a hill, they will tunnel inwards towards you. They tend not to dig down much but if you are close enough below where they are do not assume they won't dig.

What that adds up to is that a base above the water with supports coming up from the lake bottom is very unlikely to have the ground dug out from underneath the supports. However, if you put a hidey-hole only slightly under the lakebed then you should expect them to dig.

If you dig, dig deep so you are out of their sensing range.

[Skorne Tet'Zu]

@Torriador: I can handle that; Thanx. I'll definately try to use that... it should work perfectly for the basic style of fortress I want.

@Samothec: Sounds like I'll be saying out of the water (which is too bad; I had already built my mining tunnel from the platform to the river floor which was very cool). But speaking of mining; I've noticed in the currently release that -57 is as low as it goes. I've also noted that depending on the Biome you can find ores you seek at -57. So my question is: is -57 low enough to avoid Zombie Detection? Thus far I seem too; but it could be just luck.

Again... thanx to everyone for all the info... I don't feel so bad now after losing all that time and work; and I'm a little wiser for it - (smile).

[Ethena]

Originally posted by sigh-phi-guy:

you could build a double thick floor atop the pillars. then you can build "willy nilly" on the platform.

+1

Only thing that works lately